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Author Topic: sugar dusting made it easier?  (Read 11069 times)
Cindi
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« Reply #40 on: May 01, 2007, 09:19:00 AM »

I'm not getting an answer to the sugar dusting.  If it is said that the sugar dust kills the larvae, why do it?  This is a stronger statement, has anyone got any answers yet?  Best of the beautiful day, it is raining, germinating millions of seeds that I have set.  Best of good health wishes for all.  Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
Finsky
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« Reply #41 on: May 01, 2007, 10:05:14 AM »

Italian spesialist Nanetti write about sugar system that it is very work intensive to use.
It has not been taken seriously because there are much more easier methods. In normal beekeeping you cannot manage with unefficient systems.

Oxalic acid  is the most cheap and the most harmless to honey users. 
Thymol and formic acid is used in another circumtancies but they are effective too.



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Jerrymac
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« Reply #42 on: May 01, 2007, 10:08:29 AM »

I find it a little strange you haven't gotten an answer yet. I have never dusted so I don't have a clue. I have this flat pan sitting out with comb I crushed the honey out of. I let the bees clean it until it seems dry and then I pour water in it and sit it out again. I have stood for quite awhile looking at the bees as they suck up the liquid. I have bees that are mostly all black and go all the way to a creamy yellow color. I look really hard for any signs of mites but I can't find any. I might try to get a picture today when they are really busy there and post it.

So! Anyone got an answer for Cindi?
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Cindi
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« Reply #43 on: May 01, 2007, 10:12:48 AM »

Jerry, the problem with trying to see the mites on the bees outside the hive, is that:  there are more mites inside the hive, living inside the capped brood, breeding, having a great time in there eating up the lives of the pupae.  Just because you don't see mites on the bees does not mean that you may not have a mite problem. I am serious.

I did not notice any mites on my bees outside either.  I even looked at pictures I had taken and didn't see any.  But I know for a fact that I had extremely high mite counts.

When I did the sticky board mite count in the middle of September (way, way, way, way too late), I don't even want to tell how many mites I had over a three day period.  It is too embarassing to say aloud or on my computer screen.  It was horrible!!!!!  Have a beautiful day, wonderful life, great health.  Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
Jerrymac
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« Reply #44 on: May 01, 2007, 10:21:53 AM »

I got some hives from another individual that had not done anything to the hives in a while. (Health problems) The bees had built comb all over everything. Top frames stuck to bottom frames. There was drone comb with drones in between the frames. Poor little guys would fall out as I pulled the mess apart. I inspected every one I found and didn't see any signs of mites. Still have a bunch to go through. The weather just doesn't cooperate. We are 5 inches over normal rain fall already this year. Last year we didn't have any rain. Then we get those 40 mph winds. Then on the few decent days I am stuck baby sitting my daughters kids while she is going to nursing school.  But I think this coming weekend will be great for digging into hives.

Hope you get an answer to the powder sugar killing larva question.
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Cindi
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« Reply #45 on: May 01, 2007, 10:25:34 AM »

Jerry, holy roly.  YOu got some big work ahead of you.  Looking after little children (how old are your grandchildren anyways?) sure can take the works out of ya.  They really are needy little critters, I know that one.  I babysat for my daughter for years at times.  They are now 8 and 12 so they look after themselves pretty much.  But, sounds like yours are a little younger.

Have fun on the weekend when your weather is more cooperative.  Great day, great health, life is great.  Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
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« Reply #46 on: May 01, 2007, 10:41:32 AM »

Two boys. Oldest just turned three years, and the other is five months. He has found four wheel drive and is going to town.

Opps. Getting off topic. Ain't we good at it?
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« Reply #47 on: May 01, 2007, 12:33:51 PM »

i found a few mites on bees walking in front of hives, one had 2 mites on it, that was about two weeks ago, so i hurried up with vinegar vaporizer "invention". i can't say how efficient it is but so far it looks like it is. like i persumed, 2 of my hives were in my opinion invaded worse than other 3.
after medicating them, there was around 20-30 mites in those two, in others less than 5. medicated them twice, have to do it again in friday.
i just hope the honey isn't going to be saury grin
so far, it looks like it's working, i'll be able to say more in autumn, when i'll testly use another medicament.
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Finsky
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« Reply #48 on: May 01, 2007, 01:59:47 PM »

so i hurried up with vinegar vaporizer "invention". i can't say how efficient it is but so far it looks like it is.


You should trust on experts. http://www.alp.admin.ch/themen/00502/00515/00519/index.html?lang=en

Look below link:  Bee tolerance of different winter Varroa treatments

Why to use not ranked treatments?

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KONASDAD
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« Reply #49 on: May 01, 2007, 03:53:03 PM »

Cindi- Randy Oliver writes for ABJ. He is up to part six of a series about varroa control. This months article deals w/ drone trapping and suger dusting. He provides some good sources for his opinions. He has a web site too. www.randyoliver.com where I understand his articles are available w/o charge but I've never personally looked.  I have enjoyed his articles immensely. Understandable and pragmatic. He believes sugar dusting will affect some eggs, but few. Mites kill more bees than sugar dusting ever could. He reaches the conclusion that the positives far outweigh minimal negatives of dusting. He goes into the "math" of mites and dusting and drone trapping. good stuff.
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Finsky
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« Reply #50 on: May 01, 2007, 09:48:07 PM »

. good stuff.

But remember: Only 2% in US use sugar against varroa. I think that in Europe it is less. But if you want to be special - it is your chance!
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #51 on: May 02, 2007, 01:11:10 AM »

Cindi,

To answer your question; the sugar shake may cause the death of uncapped brood due to suffication.
If enough powdered sugar gets into anyone cell then the larvae might sufficate before the nurse bees have time to remove the dust.
I do not see it as a serious problem, the bees natural hygenic tendencies correct the problem somewhat.  Even if 10% of the open larvae on a comb sufficated it is only a temporary set back.  Compare that to the loss of the entire hive from mite overload.

Sugar shake is my preferred method of mite control. It doesn't contaminate the wax as checmicals might and it can be combined with water by the bees to produce a type of nector, hence honey stores that the bees can use. 

There is one aspect of this conversation that not even Finsky has addressed, maybe he can find a reference to it.  How much of an impact does extreme cold weather conditions (such as one might find in Finland or Norway or Alaska) affect mite populations and reproduction?  I have a hunch that the answer to that question might make a difference in what Finsky is experiencing and those of us in more moderate climates are experiencing.
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Life is a school.  What have you learned?   Brian      The greatest danger to our society is apathy, vote in every election!
Finsky
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« Reply #52 on: May 02, 2007, 02:20:09 AM »

Cindi,


There is one aspect of this conversation that not even Finsky has addressed, maybe he can find a reference to it.  How much of an impact does extreme cold weather conditions (such as one might find in Finland or Norway or Alaska) affect mite populations and reproduction? 

I have not seen comparations between cold and hot temperature. Of course long brooding time makes more mites but every beekepers adapt their works according their environment. Varroa killing is easy act if hives have brood brake. But if you are afraid of chemicals, it is surely difficult. In cold climate varroa makes bees weaker and they suffer long wintering.

Worst situation is in warm countries like in New Zealand and South Africa. Bees are in nature and hive are dying in varroa. Strong nursed bees rob weakened hives and get in one day huge miteload. In New Zealand they had to polish varroa away  3 times per year and often it is not enough.  When brood is always in hive, varroa treatment is very different.

Links? Every area or country has it's recommendations for treatment. They are in Internet.


Quote
Sugar shake is my preferred method of mite control. It doesn't contaminate the wax as checmicals might and it can be combined with water by the bees to produce a type of nector, hence honey stores that the bees can use. 

Chemicals and chemicals. It is vain to put them into one pot and shake them together. Recommended varroa treatments are at least 20 different and few leave residues into wax or honey. Natural beekeepers have done thier own legislation and rules and researches are not needed in that issue.
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John Jones
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« Reply #53 on: October 09, 2008, 03:53:47 PM »

I am using the Bob Noel and Dr. James Amrine method of formic acid treatment with excellent results.  It is a 24 hour treatment not like the Mite Away II treatment (21 days), or any of the others for weeks treatment periods.  I followed the directions, made the fume board from their links and things went extremely well.  I had dead mite counts close to 600 and on some of the boards did not count them as there were so many. .  This treatment uses a 50 percent formic acid mixture with Honey B Healthy which stops or almost stops any queen problems.  Their latest research had no queen problems and after two treatment cycles myself have had none.  The formic acid vaporizes and actually gets into the cells where the bees are and kills mites in capped brood.  Anyway, while you are scouting around trying to figure out what method you want to do visit these link and make your mind up.  I did not take off my medium honey super during the treatment.  You can google on Dr. James Amrine and Bob Noel and see them often involved in their research.
wvu.edu/~agexten/varroa06

John Jones
Stone Mountain, Georgia


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John Jones
Stone Mountain, Georgia
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