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Author Topic: vinegar for mites  (Read 7338 times)
Pi
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« on: January 11, 2007, 08:19:12 PM »

Does anyone have any information on how to use vinegar (acetic acid) to treat for mites?  I see vinegar vaporizers advertised in bee magazines, but there has to be a way for hobby keepers to use this stuff without spending a lot of money.  I'd love to try it.
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abejaruco
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2007, 12:26:52 PM »

I use the vinegar to dress the lettuce. afro

Please, the bees are living being. And vinegar does not kill mites.
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Mici
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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2007, 03:06:09 PM »

some say it helps against chalk brood
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Finsky
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2007, 03:22:59 PM »

some say it helps against chalk brood

Researchers say that no chemical help against chalkbrood.

I cannot find vinegar as official recommended stuff against varroa.  Beekeepers are tried what ever they get in their mind.

Official means that it is really tested.
.
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TwT
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2007, 04:24:23 PM »

there are some that say acetic acid in vineger should works like oxalic acid or formic acid, they use a vaporizer to put in the hives, I heard of some (few) that only use viniger in hives by fogging it but there is no studies as for as I know about it. like finsky said its just something that poped in someones head one day after reading about formic and oxalic acids.
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Finsky
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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2007, 04:55:03 PM »


Lactic acid is mentioned in official papers but it is not recommended any more. It is laborous to spray every frame.
Gasifyig oxalic acid is very common and effective.

I cannot se the value if hobbyest sacrifies his few hives for own researches. It is vain effort because people have tried huge number of tricks and they even believe them. Fools' job as we say.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2007, 07:02:16 PM »

For a couple of bucks you can make an evaporator and for about six more you can buy enough oxalic acid to treat a hundred hives.
http://bwrangler.farvista.net/goxa.htm

In theory any organic acid is likely to have a similar effect on Varroa and bees.  That would include Formic, Oxalic, Lactic and Acetic (vinegar).  But the oxalic is cheaper to ship (the liquid ones have handling charges added on), cheaper to buy, and easy to use.
I also doesn't require buying an expensive vaporizer, although this one is probably worth the cost so you can stand back far enough upwind to avoid the fumes better:

http://www.members.shaw.ca/orioleln/
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Michael Bush
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Finsky
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« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2007, 02:27:48 PM »

.
I looked from interent varroa acetic acid and I cannot find any research to test vinegar/acetic agid.  I would  say that it is out of usefull methods.
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Mici
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« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2007, 05:12:46 PM »

i can not disagree with finsky, BUT grin if varoa is like some say 100 times more prone to acids, concentrated acetic acid should have the same effect, then again, if you have concentrated acetic acid, it's just as harmfull to bees as any other acids-organic. we can't forget vinegar is only what 5%?
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imabkpr
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« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2007, 09:22:38 PM »


 Finsky; You are right, no stats on vinegar vapor as a control for varroa and other in hive problems but it works. I have been using ONLY vinegar vapor for several years now. cef
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Finsky
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« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2007, 12:35:01 AM »


 Finsky; You are right, no stats on vinegar vapor as a control for varroa and other in hive problems but it works. I have been using ONLY vinegar vapor for several years now. cef



It is strange that it is not mentioned in researchings?

But when we speak about organic acids it is really mistake to bunch them.  Chemistry is not that simple.
http://www.chemtutor.com/acid.htm
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GNHONEY
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« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2007, 08:06:52 PM »

ITS STRANGE THAT SOME PEOPLE LIKE TO DISAGREE ABOUT THINGS THEY KNOW NOTHING ABOUT LIKE VAPORIZER FOR INSTANCE--GNHONEY--
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Jerrymac
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« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2007, 08:34:32 PM »

Or small cell beekeeping where you don't need to do the vinegar thingy. 
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Finsky
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« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2007, 01:44:04 AM »

ITS STRANGE THAT SOME PEOPLE LIKE TO DISAGREE ABOUT THINGS THEY KNOW NOTHING ABOUT LIKE VAPORIZER FOR INSTANCE--GNHONEY--

MORE STANGE IS THAT IF I GIVE A SURE METHOD, HE MUST TWIST IT TO HIS OWN EVEN IF HE HAS ONLY ONE HIVE.

I have treated mites 20 years.Treating methods have changed all the time. Now there are several good treatments and you need meet any more varroa killed hives, if you do it like methods say.

One secret in acetic acid and formic acid may be that formic's boiling point is 101 C and acetic 118 C.  Formic acid gives better result because it is more volatile and need not heating. Thymol is another one. Acetic acid is  recommended nowhere even if it works.
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Finsky
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« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2007, 01:45:01 AM »

Or small cell beekeeping where you don't need to do the vinegar thingy. 

Many have tried small cells and some have loosed everything. It is real trap for beginners.

Another trap is Russian bees.
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imabkpr
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« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2007, 06:19:07 AM »

Or small cell beekeeping where you don't need to do the vinegar thingy. 

Many have tried small cells and some have loosed everything. It is real trap for beginners.

Another trap is Russian bees.


Finski: Is now when you say, " I have been nurseing bees for 45 years"?  whatever that is supposed to mean. I have been associated with bees long enough to know that i don't know all there is to know about bees. Its evident you haven't that long.  Charlie
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Finsky
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« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2007, 06:23:51 AM »


 I have been associated with bees long enough to know that i don't know all there is to know about bees. Its evident you haven't that long.  Charlie

Sounds bad  grin
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ayyon2157
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« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2007, 12:35:53 PM »

Finsky mentions that "some have lost everything" with small cells.

Could you enlighten me as to some of the disadvantages to small cells? I had previously thought that  the only downside was the bother to change over.
 
I had been planning to start a colony on small cells, right out of the package.

 thanks. I always appreciate your comments.

ayyon2157
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William H. Michaels
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« Reply #18 on: February 18, 2007, 12:59:11 PM »

Could you enlighten me as to some of the disadvantages to small cells?

This has bee discussed here so many times.......
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #19 on: February 18, 2007, 02:32:20 PM »

>"some have lost everything" with small cells.

I have never heard from anyone who has.

>Could you enlighten me as to some of the disadvantages to small cells?

I see none.

>I had previously thought that  the only downside was the bother to change over.

It is.
 
>I had been planning to start a colony on small cells, right out of the package.

That's the easiest way.

It HAS been discussed many times.  Try a search.  See if you can find anyone who has done it who thinks it's a bad idea.
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Michael Bush
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