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Author Topic: Ok, I have a confession to make.UPDTED HOLD THE PHONE ITS RENOVATION RESCUE  (Read 3331 times)
mick
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« on: December 14, 2006, 02:52:07 AM »

The bottom box of my 3 supers, I put together in a big hurry and it is not as well built as the other two. It is splitting at the seams due to movement caused by the timber warping in the heat. The bees seem to like these extra openings, and there is no sign of robber bees.

My question is:

Should I remove the frames from this bottom super now and put them in a new sturdy box, or wait until Autumn? when the bees are not as active.

I am afraid that I might upset them too much. There will obviously be some carnage and damage done to brood that is around the edges of the fames. Or will the bees just forget about what life was in the old box and carry on as though nothing has happened?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2006, 03:01:18 AM by mick » Logged
Finsky
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« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2006, 03:51:01 AM »



It is better act than wait. No mercy!
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mick
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« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2006, 04:24:59 AM »

OK, no mercy, I fix on weekend.

BUT tell me professor, I will obviously kill some eggs etc. Do I leave them on the ground to die? will the bees rescue them and take them back home? or do I collect all the scrapings when I trim up the excess from the frames and throw them away?

I would guess I Just leave all the rubbish on the ground for the bees to clean up and put back nice straight trimmed cleaned fames back in the new super.

Mabye I can put the old super on the top and let the bees clean it up?
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2006, 06:30:21 AM »

Work quickly and put it all back together as soon as you can.  It's summer there isn't it?
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2006, 08:28:54 AM »

Why would you be killing or destroying brood?  Usually there won't be much broken comb in that case, the only casualty is the bridge comb and that is usually all drones or honey anyway.

Once you get the frames out, the old box shouldn't need to be cleaned.

You may leave the scrapings for the bees, but if you have more than one hive or any bees in the area it is best to clean it up and leave it somewhere else for the bees to clean so that it won't trigger robbing.    You can keep the wax if you have much.

They won't rescue eggs.

And just make sure you watch out for the queen, she's easy to squish if you are not careful.

They will carry on as normal once they get everything re-situated to their likeing within a few days.

-rick
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2006, 11:57:38 PM »

I assume you're going to exchange boxes.  Just transferring the bees and frames from the damaged box into the new one.  That should not be a problem and is quickly done.  I've learned that changing out the boxes is best--wierd things can happen if you try repairing the damaged box while it's still on the hive.
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mick
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« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2006, 01:21:54 AM »

Thanks everyone, yes just swap boxes is the plan. I guess I am just being cautious, incase the cracks have led to some interesting comb work.
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Geoff
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« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2006, 03:34:32 PM »

           Have just done a similar job with one of my swarms that I caught this year Mick. It was not a problem, just set up the new box alongside the the old one and transferred each frame over. The only reason I had to do that was because the box & floor that I borrowed in a hurry had a very small permanent entrance.
           Only took a few minutes to do the job and ten minutes later one would not know that anything had happened.
  Geoff.
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mick
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« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2006, 03:29:45 AM »

Ok well I didnt get past the middle of the three supers. The frames that I had not touched in this super or removed for honey contaned brood. There was a mess of comb that the bees had reworked and fiddled with. I suspect one wax sheet had collapsed or similar,therefore I removed the equivalent of two frames of this.



Now I know Michael B. and Me mate Finsky have just spat out their beer at these photos and are shaking their heads in dismay.

I now know I should have made some preparations and made a split from this mess. I wasnt prepared and Im am new so I have an excuse.

HOWEVER I got an attack of the guilts. There are brood trying to emerge from these cells, crying out fot help, struggling with all their might to get out, 24 hours after being abandoned and left on the concrete for their mates to clean up. There are bees hovering around this comb, not eating the honey, but just looking confused.

The concrete was warm, and they survived, so I just went into 999 breaker breaker good buddy emergency rapid response mode and have done this. Just shoved it all in glued and thats all super. The bood comb in in the warmest spot, unattached and sitting on the concrete. One frame is mangled honey/brood/empty cells. One is full of honey, one is blank and the white comb thrown in for insulation. I moved everyting as close together as I could.


Within 5 minutes the hoverers have headed for this box that has a cardboard lid. They have called for reinforcements from the main hive. Medics are have been airlifted in, smoke signals sent, its all hands on deck! With 3 hours of daylight left, the line might hold.

It may work, I know it is probably "nonsense" Finsky, and MB at this stage needs a good stiff drink I imagine.

I just think its worth effort, even as an excercise, I have nothing to lose.

I will let you know how it goes. In a few days there will be nothing left, or the beginnings of a new hive.

EDIT: I just shoved a frame of bees in there as well for good measure.

Ohh the shame, please dont tell!
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Cindi
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« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2006, 07:49:50 AM »

Mick, Ha, what an interesting time you have had for sure.  There is so unbelievably much to learn when beginning with the bees.  All this is learning curve.  Do not ever shame yourself or feel bad.  I have done that so much over mistakes I have made.  Look at it as though you have learned some very valuable lessons about beekeeping.  You most likely will learn from this and that is OK.  I have made some enormous blunders too.  I don't even want to talk about them and probably never will.  You got guts to admit your follies to the world. LOL.  Have an awesome day Mick, keep on with the pictures, you take interesting and good shots.  Great day. Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
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« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2006, 08:47:11 AM »

Looks like alot of drone brood to me.  I think I would probably not go to the effort.  The new wax looks great, and indicates a flow.  Get some foundation back into the main hive bodys or you'll have the same wild comb again, maybe worse.  Freeze the drone comb and call it IPM, then move on.  One of the biggest problems beeks have, especially new ones, is to spend way too much time and resources on lost causes.  I know the argument.  It's my only colony, it's my time and cost nothing, yada yada yada.  I wouldn't make a spit on the flow, instead straighten things out, get them going like a house on fire, then split them off the flow or between flows.  Looks like there is honey to be makin right now.  You did insure you didn't transfer the queen out with the brood comb right?  I know it's fun to try new things, and not trying to be negative. 
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Cindi
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« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2006, 09:09:17 AM »

Mick. So, in the third picture down, I see quite a bit of larvae that is not capped.  I wonder is that larvae that have not finished being capped or is it capped larvae that the bees chewed off the cappings to.  I have seen that in my hive and wondered (up here it can get quite cold at nights) if it was what was aptly named as "chilled brood" and died?  I know it is hot down where you are Mick, so it is not likely the chilled brood I was talking about.  Great day. Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
kathyp
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« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2006, 10:59:08 AM »

it's always worth it to try a thing.  at the worst you have wasted a little time.  you probably learned something.  i think what you did was fine.  success is measured in lots of ways!!   grin

do keep a close eye on this box and let us know what you observe.  maybe we'll all learn something!
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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mick
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« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2006, 01:26:15 AM »

Thanks for the comments everyone.

Well there is more activity at the box 24 hours on than I imagined. The photo sums it up really. Lots of flights in and out, some feeding happening on the lid, from one bee to the other, and as you can see on the lip of the box, a lot of what I gather are bee droppings. Whatever it is, it wasnt there yesterday. I know the queen is still in the main hive.

It is an interesting excercise, Golfpsycho, Im in the yada yada yada category, I have nothing to loose as the "proper" colony is very strong, and honey will be flowing until at least April here. I am spoilt by the variety of Eucys, Banksias and Meleleucas that flower in succesion. Things may go to plan, I bought another super today, lid and bottom and will make another transfer in a week if things work out.


Below is the real hive.


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Cindi
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« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2006, 08:54:46 AM »

Mick, you truly do love the camera, good for you.  Keep on with the pics, they are loved by all I am sure (mostly me though) LOL.  Great day. Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
Finsky
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« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2006, 09:00:29 AM »


It was good that you took combs away. They are for drones and colony would waste energy when it raises drones so much.
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mick
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« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2006, 03:08:41 AM »

AHA thanks Finsky, so no harm done! I have noticed I sure have a lot of huge drones about the place.

48 hours on, things looking good. Comb building hapening in the new "split" hive.

Im a little bit excited, I might get to see how a new queen is made.

If this succeeds, you will hear me beating my chest all over the world! The weather is on my side, however Im a firm believer in not counting my chickens before they hatch!
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mick
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« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2006, 03:42:38 AM »

72 hours on, there is a lot of chewed up wax in the bottom of the box, I guess from the capped cells. heaps of buzzing around. You know, the bees buzzing around it all look to be drones, which given what Finsky said is interesting.

However the Bushfire smoke has returned, so maybe they are just upset and confused now. Time will tell.

You know, It really upset me to see those lil heads poking out and the legs waving like crazy to get out. For a dedicated carnivore as I am, its a bit odd! Undecided
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Cindi
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« Reply #18 on: December 20, 2006, 09:36:17 AM »

Mick, are the baby bees finally coming out yet?  YOu said that you saw them poking out, waving their feet, I am sure they will emerge, evidently it only takes a few minutes, I have only seen a few come out one time, guess I looked at the wrong time.  Great day.  Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
mick
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« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2006, 02:54:36 AM »

Hi Cindi, they are all out. I am wondering if they were all drones and were too big to get out by themselves, hence the chewed wax/cappings in the bottom.

Its 100 degrees here and smoky as buggery, so I dare not disturb them today. Still buzzing around, and they seem to have become used to the bottom entrance ok. Initially they were using a crack under the temporary cardboard lid.
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