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Author Topic: Syrup feeding drawbacks?  (Read 1513 times)
Zoot
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« on: October 31, 2006, 11:43:03 PM »

Is there any limit to the extent that one should go to with fall feeding?

We seem to have balmy weather again here and the bees are still foraging vigorously. I had fed several gallons of 2:1 syrup in early and mid October and am considering giving them a bit more to allow them the maximum chances for building up stores. But - can the presence of too much syrup in the upper boxes pose a problem? I looked in last week and noticed a lot of frames full of uncapped syrup. Is it certain that they will cap it or could mildew become an issue if it suddenly turns cold and wet again?
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Finsky
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« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2006, 12:52:09 AM »

Syrup must be so much that cells are filled and they cap them.  Hive must be warm enough that they are able to handle capping wax.  Filling take about one week and capping takes often 1-  2 weeks more.
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Zoot
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« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2006, 12:56:42 AM »

If it appears that they may not be able to cap the filled comb - if it never gets warm enough again - should those frames be removed? I am planning on feeding them candy (fondant) over the winter either way.
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Finsky
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« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2006, 01:06:18 AM »

Yes, if it is too cold, bees tend to go into winter ball. I have same problem in my 4 frame colony. I took away syrup and I give capped frames from another hives.

But to get bees over whole winter with candy, that I wonder if it is possible.

One resulution is to heat the hive bottom with terrarium heater as long a as syrup is capped. Put 15 W heater in lower box or on bottom.

This model is very good. http://www.reptilica.de/shop/product_info.php/cPath/22_25_38/products_id/35/lang/english/index.htm

You may use it in spring after cleansing flight.
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2006, 02:14:28 AM »

Feeding candy during the winter can be done but should be limited to once or twice and then OWN (only when needed).  Over feeding can cause problems even in winter.  Bees will stop capping honey when the temperature drops to the cluster point.  Then they will use those uncapped, unpreocessed or under processed stores faster which may mean a early feeding come spring.

Let the bees work for what they get, monitor, and feed in a emergency.  A feeding emergency is:
1. One feeding for a newly acquired swarm or package.
2. In the case of dearth or drought when nectar sources may not be producing due to lack of water.
3. Feeding to apply medication (i.e. Terrimyson for EFB).
4. Lack of stores in the fall or spring.
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Robo
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« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2006, 07:42:24 AM »

But to get bees over whole winter with candy, that I wonder if it is possible.

I have wintered nuc with just candy.  In fact have had better success than with syrup.  With syrup I have had issues with dysetery.  With candy I have not.

But your heating idea I believe is the key to success.
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Zoot
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« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2006, 12:09:40 PM »

Winter feeding with candy seems to be quite common around here among the more serious hobbyists anyway - not sure about the commercial people. The one's I've talk to like it's ability to absorb moisture in the hive. Hence no dysentary, etc. ALways having left plentiful honey in my hives when I kept them years ago (and winters were far more harsh here then) , winter feeding has never been an issue with me. Now I have this abundance of uncapped comb - a result of foraging and syrup feeding - and I am trying to determine just what proportion to keep and what to take out and freeze for the spring. My bigger hive does have a fair amount of capped honey so my challenge will be to calculate how much of it to share between the 2 hives.

Also pondering a water source for winter. My bees seemed to be extremely picky about where they were tkaing water this past summer. Oddly, they seemed to prefer the run-off from our AC system and the incidental accumulation in an old feed bucket that was laying around - never once saw them in our pond or any of the pans I intentioanlly left out.
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Finsky
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« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2006, 12:31:04 PM »

Winter feeding with candy seems to be quite common around here among the more serious hobbyists anyway -.


Very strange because these kind of advices I cannot find from winter feeding papers. Here is Maarec's papers.

Zoot, how much you leave honey into hive in autumn?


http://maarec.cas.psu.edu/PDFs/Fall_mgm.pdf

Here is more beekeeping papers  http://pubs.cas.psu.edu/PubAll.asp?varA2z=M

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binglis
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« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2006, 12:36:18 PM »

What is the 'winter candy', referred to in the e-mails, and is there a homemade version?
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2006, 08:30:15 PM »

Binglis,

Google Fondunt or bee candy.  Most beekeeping books have recipes for bee candy as well as pollen patties and simple syrup.
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Zoot
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« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2006, 08:55:36 PM »

Finsky,

Well, I thought I had left plenty of honey in both hives. I harvested a modest amount (maybe 40 lbs) from my big hive and none from the weaker hive. I am using 8 frame mediums only and this is the first year for both hives.

What surprized me was how much they consumed during the dearth we experienced at the end of the summer - almost all of what I had left them . We did have a fairly good fall flow but additional feeding was necessary. Now, all of the comb is filled and I am pondering what to do with the portion that is not capped.
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Finsky
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« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2006, 09:03:34 PM »

.
I give on average 40 lbs dry sugar as syrup per hive. How is it make wintercandy so much?

What is the idea if bees have combs in the hive and there is no food. Bees take 40 kg sugar as syrup during one week.  One box hive take  whole winterfood in 3 days if there are not much brood.

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