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Author Topic: Starting a Nuc  (Read 3608 times)
jgarzasr
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« on: June 08, 2006, 09:31:14 AM »

When is too late to start a Nuc.  I live in South Michigan - and would like to start a Nuc from one of my hives.  What I really want to do is raise some queens from this Nuc to be able to requeen my hive this fall.  Any ideas?  Thanks.
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Finsky
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« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2006, 09:39:55 AM »

Quote from: jgarzasr
When is too late to start a Nuc.

 What I really want to do is raise some queens from this Nuc to be able to requeen my hive this fall.  .


I live at level of Anchorage Alaska and here I may make nuc in July. Later I may give frame of emerging bees or more to nuc from bigger hives when yiled is over. I may even split in two parts the big hive.

But nuc is not place to raise queens. They will be very weak queens.
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jgarzasr
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« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2006, 10:23:28 AM »

Could you explain why raising a Queen from a Nuc would result in a weak one?  - I have never read anything on Queen rearing - but plan to do so.  But I thought that was one of the things you could do with a Nuc.  Thanks.
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Finsky
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« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2006, 11:37:48 AM »

Nucs are used to mate young queens.

Hive which raise queens must be at least  2 deeps and full of young nurser bees. If you give a good hive to that operation, your queens will be very expencive because hardly hive is able gather honey. It will be very confused.

If hive is too weak, it's queens are quite small.

I use to raise somer queen in swarming hives. When hive does swarm cells I change larvae in cells.

If you have  a big hive you may also raise queens. You take queen away for a day or two and bees start queen raising. Then you put queen back , put excluder under the topmost box and bees continue queen cell raising in upper box. What happens to your honey yield is different question. And what you do with those queens is one question.

It is really expencive to do that way.
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Joe
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« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2006, 02:12:19 PM »

When raising queens it is important that during the larval stages the queen is fed large amounts of Royal Jelly and that she is kept warm.  Larger hives have more nursery bees with which to perform these tasks, smaller hives are less able to maintain a consistent temperature and are not as able to keep the larva fed as well as a larger hive would be able to do so. Thus the smaller Nuc colonies will produce inferior queens.
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Apis629
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« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2006, 03:05:42 PM »

To raise good queens you will first need a box, maybe a nuc box, where you shake in a few thousand worker bees from one of your hives.  Insert into there frame/s of pollen and honey and, after 6 hours introduce eggs after you cut the foundation making multiple triangles but, make sure you have plenty of eggs near the edge.  Introduce this into that queenless colony with NO flight (a.k.a. no entrance...or at least it should be screened in.  After 48 hours you should have some good makings of queen cells.  Then, these can be moved into a "finisher colony" which usually consists of a five frame nuc or other QUEENRIGHT COLONY.  Place these frames above an excluder as far from the brood of the queen as possible.  Check them periodically to make sure they're alright but NEVER shake the frame to remove bees.  Also, NEVER flip it upside-down.  After 13 days maximum, take them out and the best formed cells should be gently cut out of the comb and tied into new frames.  Anywhere from 1-3 of the cells can then be placed in a MATING NUC, where she must remain for a minimum 29 days.  This gives her time to mate, begin egg production, and allows her to maximize pheramone production and this leads to better acceptance and longevity.  This is a very basic outline and I sujest you take a class before you attempt any of this.
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2006, 09:29:56 PM »

Just remember that General Custer (actually a Colonel at the time) forgot to look before he leaped--his last words  were: "Don't take any prisoner's men."  
Said situation fits more than just trying to raise queens without plenty of advance preperation.
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TwT
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« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2006, 09:25:26 AM »

now I know everybody has different ways to raise queens, all my grafted queens are raised from 5 frame nuc's with a top feeder, I shake about 10-12  frames of bee's in the nuc and most of the foragers go back to the original hive and most that are left are nurse bee's, with a feeder on the nuc the hives will have plenty of royal jelly and with a reduced entrance and a lot of bee's, any hive or nuc can keep a good warm temp in it.... this is the way I do it with nuc's, they will raise good healthy queens if feed and have enough bee's in them, and you only have to feed until the queen cells are capped..... I use a nuc for my cell builder ( grafting) and then about 5 days after the cells are capped I put each cell in a nuc with more bee's I have shaken and the hives go from there...
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THAT's ME TO THE LEFT JUST 5 YEARS FROM NOW!!!!!!!!

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jgarzasr
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« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2006, 09:26:25 AM »

Thanks for the replies - I guess I will delve a lot more through some books before trying anything.  I want to do it right when I actually try it.  I will just purchase the Queen this fall.

I am curious - The one hive I have that survived the winter - This hive showed that it was a good survivor stock, as it did great over the winter, and is now a really good strong hive.  It has a low mite count - even though I only treated once last summer.  It also is a good honey producer.  If I purchase another Queen and requeen this hive this fall - will I possibly lose these traits?  Or should a Queen from a reputable supplier be ok.
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TwT
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« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2006, 09:32:36 AM »

Quote from: jgarzasr
Thanks for the replies - I guess I will delve a lot more through some books before trying anything.  I want to do it right when I actually try it.  I will just purchase the Queen this fall.

I am curious - The one hive I have that survived the winter - This hive showed that it was a good survivor stock, as it did great over the winter, and is now a really good strong hive.  It has a low mite count - even though I only treated once last summer.  It also is a good honey producer.  If I purchase another Queen and requeen this hive this fall - will I possibly lose these traits?  Or should a Queen from a reputable supplier be ok.


if you like the queen keep her, if this hive is in 2 deeps do a walkaway split and see what the split with no queen raises..
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THAT's ME TO THE LEFT JUST 5 YEARS FROM NOW!!!!!!!!

Never be afraid to try something new.
Amateurs built the ark,
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Finsky
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« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2006, 10:18:21 AM »

Quote from: Apis629
To raise good queens you will first need a box, maybe a nuc box, where you shake in a few thousand worker bees from one of your hives.  .


If you have a langstroth deep lightly full of bees, it has 20 000 workers.

Bees raise queens even if they have 2 frames.

But final value of queen depends on what is  the mother queen.  But if you just want to raise queens, it need not to be so perfect happening.

BUT if you take "few thousand" nurser bees from bigger hive, it will disturb badly that main hive. It needs them to raise it's own workers.

Then you need bees to mating nucs. Have you enough bees for that all.
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TwT
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« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2006, 10:32:28 AM »

that's the first thing I found out is that you will have to have a good number of hive's to shake from to raise queens, shaking bee's from a hive is like simulating a swarm, when I shook my bee's for a cell starter I got them from a large hive, but when it came to shaking bee's for my mating nuc's, I found out quick that I had to adjust down to 2 frame mating nuc's because I didn't have enough hives to shake from to fill 5 frame nuc's, but next year I will have 20 plus hive (with some luck) to shake bee's from...
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THAT's ME TO THE LEFT JUST 5 YEARS FROM NOW!!!!!!!!

Never be afraid to try something new.
Amateurs built the ark,
Professionals built the Titanic
Finsky
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« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2006, 11:06:52 AM »

Quote from: TwT
that's the first thing I found out is that you will have to have a good number of hive's to shake from to raise queens, ...


I like to raise queens with swarming hive. When hive starts to make queens cells it is easy to cange larvae in cells. They raise good queens.

Then I take that combs wit bees and queen cell and I make a mating nuc and put them in place 3 miles way. It goes really easy. - But I have any  more aura around these issue.
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Jon McFadden
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« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2006, 08:19:33 PM »

A way to reduce resources is to use the Nicot System and Cell Door. With these and a strong colony, you can raise up to 40 quality queens at a time.
There is an instructional tape for the Nicot system produced by "The Bee Works". The $14 I spent on this video was the best investment I ever made. He doesn't leave much out. Another video, Queen rearing, costs more, but includes all the information on the Nicot System as well as grafting and splits.
http://www.beeworks.com/uscatalog/main/videos.html
All the information is great.

I posted information on my first try with the nicot system at:
http://nordykebeefarm.com/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=6

I have information on the cell door posted, too.
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