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Author Topic: Methods for preventing a Nuc from swarming.  (Read 1058 times)
RHBee
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« on: April 10, 2014, 03:18:27 PM »

I'm soon making up 8 nucs. I plan to keep them all year as reserve queens. My question is. .What methods are used to prevent over crowding swarms in nucs. All I can think of is opening the brood nest often with empty comb or foundationless frames. I plan to make the nucs 4 frame mediums and run them 3 supers high.
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Ray
Steel Tiger
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« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2014, 04:09:12 PM »

 Pull a frame a brood and replace it with an empty frame.  If you pull brood from a couple nucs, use them to make another nuc or to boost a hive.
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greenbtree
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« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2014, 07:23:17 PM »

What Steel Tiger said.

JC
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greenbtree
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« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2014, 07:24:59 PM »

Oh, and EMPTY frame, no foundation, nothing, and keep a close watch.

JC
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"Rise again, rise again - though your heart it be broken, or life about to end.  No matter what you've lost, be it a home, a love, a friend, like the Mary Ellen Carter rise again!"
RHBee
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« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2014, 08:28:15 PM »

Thanks guys. That's what I thought,  open the brood nest.
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Ray
10framer
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« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2014, 10:48:21 PM »

use them as comb builders during the flow or make up more nucs.  i used one for a comb builder last year then converted it into a full hive in may and it went into winter as a deep and 2 mediums.  it was the exception for me, though.
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drlonzo
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« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2014, 11:08:54 PM »

Some people use them for brood builders for queen rearing.  Harvest frames of bees and capped brood to start a cell builder.  Look for videos from Mike Palmer in VT.  He shows what he does with nuc's to control the swarm instinct.
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D Coates
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« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2014, 12:02:28 PM »

I add another 5 frame nuc box on top and turn it into a 10 frame nuc, add another if you need to as well.  Once you find your queen you can steal 5 frames worth of brood and nurse bees to give boosts to weaker hives when ever you need to.  I've added 3 a couple of times in emergencies but at that height they'll blow over in a storm (they aren't happy when this happens).
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vemergy
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« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2014, 12:24:46 PM »

How does one ensure that the frame being pulled out does not have the queen on it?
I have been into bee-keeping for one year, and seems to me that I would spend a whole day looking for the queen, and still not sure at the end of it, that I would have succeeded in finding it.
What tips and advice would you be able to provide to a new-bee with this question.

Regards,
George
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RHBee
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« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2014, 12:44:46 PM »

How does one ensure that the frame being pulled out does not have the queen on it?
I have been into bee-keeping for one year, and seems to me that I would spend a whole day looking for the queen, and still not sure at the end of it, that I would have succeeded in finding it.
What tips and advice would you be able to provide to a new-bee with this question.

Regards,
George


Use a queen excluder between the supers, come back in a few days and the one with eggs has the queen. You can steal with confidence.
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Ray
sc-bee
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« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2014, 01:30:49 PM »

Some people use them for brood builders for queen rearing.  Harvest frames of bees and capped brood to start a cell builder.  Look for videos from Mike Palmer in VT.  He shows what he does with nuc's to control the swarm instinct.

I watched two of his videos last night. I know he is an excellent beekeeper and each has he own way but after watching the queen rearing video I was totally confused huh  I understood the idea but had a hard time picturing his hive make ups for starter/ finishers. I imagine probably just me. May try to watch it again. I suppose his nuc wintering concept is mostly for cold weather beekeepers as it call for constructing nuc boxes that are not standard sizes I believe?

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sc-bee
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« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2014, 01:37:58 PM »

How does one ensure that the frame being pulled out does not have the queen on it?
I have been into bee-keeping for one year, and seems to me that I would spend a whole day looking for the queen, and still not sure at the end of it, that I would have succeeded in finding it.
What tips and advice would you be able to provide to a new-bee with this question.

Regards,
George


Use a queen excluder between the supers, come back in a few days and the one with eggs has the queen. You can steal with confidence.

Or remove the frames you want. Shake all the bees into the bottom box. Place the excluder on and put the frames of brood in an upper nuc box a top the one you just shook the bees in-cover and walk away. Come back in a few hours and pull the frames above the excluder with bees and brood. She will be below the excluder.

Or use an exclude in place as a shaker box. Shake the bees through the excluder. Look for the queen on top as she will not be able to pass through the excluder.

I am beginning to have queen finding issues in populous hives. I think I am going to start marking my queen.
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John 3:16
RHBee
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« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2014, 04:49:31 PM »

>Or use an exclude in place as a shaker box. Shake the bees through the excluder. Look for the queen on top as she will not be able to pass through the excluder.<

Steve, do you have a picture of a shaker box that you can post?
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Ray
sc-bee
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« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2014, 06:43:17 PM »

>Or use an exclude in place as a shaker box. Shake the bees through the excluder. Look for the queen on top as she will not be able to pass through the excluder.<

Steve, do you have a picture of a shaker box that you can post?

Nothing but an excluder nailed to the bottom of a medium or deep. You don't have to nail it just makes it more convenient to lift. Not a package shaker box. But I saw a video where a guy made a package shaker box out of cardboard and used a large frozen food container (sour cream etc) as the funnel piece for a mouth.
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John 3:16
RHBee
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« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2014, 08:31:25 PM »

>Or use an exclude in place as a shaker box. Shake the bees through the excluder. Look for the queen on top as she will not be able to pass through the excluder.<

Steve, do you have a picture of a shaker box that you can post?


Nothing but an excluder nailed to the bottom of a medium or deep. You don't have to nail it just makes it more convenient to lift. Not a package shaker box. But I saw a video where a guy made a package shaker box out of cardboard and used a large frozen food container (sour cream etc) as the funnel piece for a mouth.


Found this. Same type used by Sue Cobey. I'm gonna see if I can build one.



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Ray
sc-bee
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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2014, 11:12:12 PM »

That is the kind that folks put packages together with. Here is what I am referring to in use by M Palmer, Not he two inches of duct tape around the top. He states the bees will not cross the duct tape and will remain below the tape in the box vs boiling out. He also stated somewhere in the long version video that about 30% of his hives have double queens (I think I got that number right). Of course a rouge queen will wreck your queen cells so he uses the shaker box when he makes up all his cell builders.

Beekeeping: Building Cell Builders with Mike Palmer
« Last Edit: April 11, 2014, 11:30:19 PM by sc-bee » Logged

John 3:16
RHBee
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« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2014, 11:24:21 PM »




This is looking down into the funnel.
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Ray
10framer
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« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2014, 11:35:46 PM »

Some people use them for brood builders for queen rearing.  Harvest frames of bees and capped brood to start a cell builder.  Look for videos from Mike Palmer in VT.  He shows what he does with nuc's to control the swarm instinct.

I watched two of his videos last night. I know he is an excellent beekeeper and each has he own way but after watching the queen rearing video I was totally confused huh  I understood the idea but had a hard time picturing his hive make ups for starter/ finishers. I imagine probably just me. May try to watch it again. I suppose his nuc wintering concept is mostly for cold weather beekeepers as it call for constructing nuc boxes that are not standard sizes I believe?
i wintered a few with 4 frames and division board feeder downstairs and frames above.  the 5 up top were foundation until the goldenrod came in.  i had to feed them 4 or 5 times but they took off pretty well.  I've pulled 4 frame splits off of a couple of them and will be supering them this weekend.


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sc-bee
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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2014, 11:46:34 PM »

Some people use them for brood builders for queen rearing.  Harvest frames of bees and capped brood to start a cell builder.  Look for videos from Mike Palmer in VT.  He shows what he does with nuc's to control the swarm instinct.

I watched two of his videos last night. I know he is an excellent beekeeper and each has he own way but after watching the queen rearing video I was totally confused huh  I understood the idea but had a hard time picturing his hive make ups for starter/ finishers. I imagine probably just me. May try to watch it again. I suppose his nuc wintering concept is mostly for cold weather beekeepers as it call for constructing nuc boxes that are not standard sizes I believe?
i wintered a few with 4 frames and division board feeder downstairs and frames above.  the 5 up top were foundation until the goldenrod came in.  i had to feed them 4 or 5 times but they took off pretty well.  I've pulled 4 frame splits off of a couple of them and will be supering them this weekend.



Are you saying you winter in a deep with a divider containing two nucs as Palmer with boxes stacked on top. I have wintered a stacked five frame but he winters two nucs with a divider in a ten frame box for heat. He stacks five frame boxes above the two separate pieces below. His nucs below are four frame and he has to special make the boxes to have the sealing surface wide enough on the ten frame box to allow sealing the two five frame nucs when added above. He states they will pull and draw comb quicker and he places the foundation to the center of the box next to the divider. He says the bees treat the divider as if it is not there and they still cluster to the center of the box.
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John 3:16
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« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2014, 05:24:25 PM »

This is maybe the Mike Palmer presentation that was most interesting to me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nznzpiWEI8A
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