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Author Topic: Food for thought....  (Read 1375 times)
iddee
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« on: January 20, 2014, 07:03:10 PM »

This is an excellent article by Bob Lonsberry and it defines the real problem in our country today.

Food for thought....

- by Bob Lonsberry © 2013 

The Democrats are right, there are two Americas.  The America that works, and the America that doesn’t.  The America that contributes, and the America that doesn’t.  It’s not the haves and the have nots, it’s the dos and the don’ts.  Some people do their duty as Americans, to obey the law and support themselves and contribute to society, and others don’t. That’s the divide in America.

It’s not about income inequality, it’s about civic irresponsibility.  It’s about a political party that preaches hatred, greed and victimization in order to win elective office.  It’s about a political party that loves power more than it loves its country.

That’s not invective, that’s truth.  And it’s about time someone said it.

The politics of envy was on proud display last week as the president said he would pledge the rest of his term to fighting “income inequality.”  He notes that some people make more than other people, that some people have higher incomes than others, and he says that’s not just.  It was the rationale of thievery.  The other guy has it, you want it, Obama will take it for you.   Vote Democrat.

It is the electoral philosophy that gave us Detroit. It is the electoral philosophy that is destroying America.  And it conceals a fundamental deviation from American values and common sense.  It ends up not being a benefit to the people who support it, but a betrayal.  The Democrats have not empowered their followers, they have enslaved them – in a culture of dependence and entitlement, of victimhood and anger instead of ability and hope.

The president’s premise – that you reduce income inequality by debasing the successful – seeks to ignore and cheat the law of choices and consequences.  It seeks to deny the successful the consequences of their choices and spare the unsuccessful the consequences of their choices. Because, by and large, the variability in society is a result of different choices leading to different consequences. Those who choose wisely and responsibility have a far greater likelihood of success, while those who choose foolishly and irresponsibly have a far greater likelihood of failure.

And success and failure can manifest themselves in personal and family income.   You choose to drop out of high school or to skip college and you are apt to have a different outcome than someone who gets a diploma and pushes on with purposeful education.  You have your children out of wedlock and life is apt to take one course, you have them in wedlock and life is apt to take another course.

Most often in life our destination is determined by the course we take.   My doctor, for example, makes far more than I do.  There is significant income inequality between us.  Our lives have had an inequality of outcome.  But, our lives also have had an inequality of effort.  Whereas my doctor went to college and then gave the flower of his young adulthood to medical school and residency, I got a job in a restaurant.  He made a choice,  I made a choice.  And our choices led us to different outcomes.

His outcome pays a lot better than mine.  Does that mean he cheated and Barack Obama needs to take away his wealth? 

No, it means we are both free men.  And in a free society, free choices will lead to different outcomes.   It is not inequality Barack Obama will take away, it is freedom.   The freedom to succeed, and the freedom to fail.  And there is no true option for success if there is no true option for failure.

The pursuit of happiness means a whole lot less when you face the punitive hand of government if your pursuit brings you more happiness than the other guy.   Even if the other guy sat on his (bleep) and did nothing.  Even if the other guy made a lifetime’s worth of asinine and shortsighted decisions.

Barack Obama and the Democrats preach equality of outcome as a right, while completely ignoring inequality of effort. The simple Law of the Harvest – as ye sow, so shall ye reap – is sometimes applied as, “The harder you work, the more you get.”

The progressive movement would turn that upside down.  Those who achieve are to be punished as enemies of society and those who fail are to be rewarded as wards of society. Entitlement has replaced effort as the key to upward mobility in American society.  Or at least it has if Barack Obama gets his way.  He seeks a lowest common denominator society in which the government besieges the successful and productive and fosters equality through mediocrity.   He and his party speak of two Americas.  And their grip on power is based on using the votes of one to sap the productivity of the other.

America is not divided by the differences in our outcomes, it is divided by the differences in our efforts.  And by the false philosophy that says one man’s success comes about unavoidably as the result of another man’s victimization.   What the president offered was not a solution, but a separatism.  He fomented division and strife, he pitted one set of Americans against another.   For his own political benefit.

That’s what progressives offer. Marxist class warfare wrapped up with a bow.   Two Americas, coming closer each day to proving the truth to Lincoln’s maxim that a house divided against itself cannot stand.

 
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hjon71
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2014, 07:18:51 PM »

I will respectfully disagree.
Which seems weird when almost all of it is true. But that isn't the real(root) problem. Just one of many branches.
 
There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root.
-Henry David Thoreau
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sterling
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« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2014, 12:59:28 PM »

>>The politics of envy was on proud display last week as the president said he would pledge the rest of his term to fighting “income inequality.”  He notes that some people make more than other people, that some people have higher incomes than others, and he says that’s not just.  It was the rationale of thievery.  The other guy has it, you want it, Obama will take it for you.   Vote Democrat.

The income inequality is worse under President Obama then under any president in American history even President Jimmy Carter. That 1% that the democrats want their sheep to trash are better off now then before Obama took over this country. Hello EQ1 EQ2 EQ3. And the stupid sheep think Obama is helping them.
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Fox Creek
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« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2014, 04:52:36 PM »

>>The politics of envy was on proud display last week as the president said he would pledge the rest of his term to fighting “income inequality.”  He notes that some people make more than other people, that some people have higher incomes than others, and he says that’s not just.  It was the rationale of thievery.  The other guy has it, you want it, Obama will take it for you.   Vote Democrat.

The income inequality is worse under President Obama then under any president in American history even President Jimmy Carter. That 1% that the democrats want their sheep to trash are better off now then before Obama took over this country. Hello EQ1 EQ2 EQ3. And the stupid sheep think Obama is helping them.

I agree with everything you said. In my opinion, If you have not read the tenets of Saul Alinsky, you will never understand Obama. Alinsky tells how to take down society. Obama is taking us down almost by the numbers. Conservatives are now known as the "far right"!. Perfect Saul Alinsky. A few short years ago Obama would be considered "far, radical left"!
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T Beek
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« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2014, 06:02:21 AM »

Historically speaking, civilizations last around 1000 years before imploding or collapsing.  Western civilization has already surpassed that 1000 year benchmark and the signs of our end are clearly upon us. 

The 'root' causes of these occurrences are always the same.  A growing unequal 'distribution of wealth' reaches its tipping point, the people take sides passing blame on each other, instead of those deserving our wrath and the house of cards falls over, sometimes burning to the ground. 

That is our future, unless some miracle changes our present direction.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2014, 06:55:48 AM »

To be fair a lot of rich people inherited it, a lot of rich people got it from the public through government enforced monopolies (cell phone bandwidth is not available for me to buy, timber, mineral and oil rights on public land don't benefit me)  But some of them just marketed the right product at the right time and worked hard to do it.  Our government seems intent on stopping any small person from succeeding by excessive requirements for permits and licenses and reporting requirements and liability insurance that is disproportionately against the little guy.  If you run a business that takes one full time person to do the paperwork for the government then a small business already can't do that.  But if it takes that same one full time person to do the paperwork for the multi billion dollar company doing the same thing, that is nothing for them.  I'd like to make things more equitable and fair to the hard working common man.  I don't think you do that by stealing from him and giving it to those who don't want to work hard.  For the most part what the government needs to do to solve some of this inequality is to leave people alone...
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iddee
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« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2014, 08:23:55 AM »

 goodpost
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« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2014, 10:04:43 AM »

It was (still is) largely through theft that most wealth is created, whether by legal means or not.  Ethics are rarely involved anymore, if they ever were.  It is our misunderstanding of the powerful (our controllers) that keeps us relatively calm and away from 'their' doors.  We the masses have been provided an easier target, the poor who have little control, over the well off who have it all  shocked.

Comments that include "they" as descriptive of government have forgotten their 'ownership' of it.  We wouldn't have what we have if it wasn't benefitting the elite.  A quick study of Rome's economy before its fall shows the masses have learned little since then………but the rich (?)  They have learned plenty about controlling us through petty diversions, divisions and distractions.


As Richard Taylor asks us in his book "Freedom, Anarchy, and the Law"  (1973)

"What is the rational justification for the government of some men by others, in case any such justification exists?" 

"What renders a particular governmental authority legitimate over those who live under it?" 

"WHAT is good government-that is, what is its proper end?" 

"What is the proper extent of governments authority over an individual?"   

And IMO the most important, and most forgotten of all; "What is an individual's duty in his role as citizen?"

Questions we all should be pondering…..but don't…… and won't……..not in any meaningful ways anyway………….. Sad
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Fox Creek
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« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2014, 01:42:27 PM »

In my opinion, envy, jealousy are horrible human traits. To promote this to gain power, is even worse. Shame on those who are responsible.
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« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2014, 04:41:30 AM »

In my opinion, envy, jealousy are horrible human traits. To promote this to gain power, is even worse. Shame on those who are responsible.

GREED overshadows every other human trait (good and bad) and prevents the evolutionary steps required to bring us to SHARING.  Without GREED, envy and jealousy would serve less purpose in our lives.
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« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2014, 06:50:51 AM »

Greed is an ugly word if i say so myself. Most of the people I know that are "well to do" in a lot of other peoples eyes are the ones who have worked 7 days a week 12- 16 hours a day for most of their younger years. They sacrificed their leisure time then and people look at them and say they have been fed with a silver spoon. And many of the ones that cry foul and call these people greedy are the ones that complain when needing to work overtime, two weeks paid vacation, retirement and 10 holidays are not enough.
Perhaps if my hard working friends would just "share" all they busted their rear ends for they would be better liked.  I doubt that really. If they gave all they accumulated through their labors, it would not be enough to satisfy the naysayers. I envy these people a bit sure, but I know what they sacrificed to accomplish what they have. And I also respect that.
Their is too much envy and too little enthusiasm for working harder to meet your needs.
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T Beek
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« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2014, 08:30:35 AM »

I have no problem with those who benefit from their own hard work, their own smarts or common sense decisions, I've known and still know many of those folks, I was even one of them before retirement shocked

However, I don't equate 'hard work' with 'unearned' wealth, whether the wealth was inherited or created out of thin air through the 'magic' of our corrupted economic system. 

An economic system that ignores natural and political economy in favor of a twisted economy designed, built and maintained by those who most benefit and profit from it. 

None of us should pay respect to those who choose to live off the resources of others as a lifestyle, whether they be the purposely (?) poor 'takers' (that even 'felt' nonsensical to write), or were simply born rich or were able to enrich themselves through further gaming of todays corrupt system, the BIG TAKERS…Owners IMO, the ones laughing their way to the BANK (S), not those too poor to open an account…..


********************************** Brian

Economically speaking, WEALTH is defined as;  Natural material (that which is freely provided by the earth) that has been changed in form (by LABOR) or used as is, in place, so as to satisfy human desires.  Thus WEALTH is material, produced by LABOR, that satisfies human desires and has exchange value. 

When the NATURAL MATERIAL is controlled/owned/monopolized by a few --- LABOR is denied its fair and equal return or SHARE of PRODUCTION or even the RENT 'owed' for the use or abuse of the NATURAL MATERIAL, which rightfully belongs to everyone.  Does any of this seem familiar at all?
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Keith13
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« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2014, 08:42:21 AM »

So when I leave my wealth to my son the day I die my son instantly becomes evil? My father worked hard to change my families legacy from scraping by to middle class. I am working my tail off to change my own from middle class to well off. I hope my son will strive for more than I did

Come on man you can do better than that

Keith
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« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2014, 09:08:36 AM »

So when I leave my wealth to my son the day I die my son instantly becomes evil? My father worked hard to change my families legacy from scraping by to middle class. I am working my tail off to change my own from middle class to well off. I hope my son will strive for more than I did

Come on man you can do better than that

Keith

Are you leaving millions….or billions?  Are you leaving vast tracts of LAND (for later speculation) or resources?  

If you earned what you have by your own sweat or intelligence (LABOR) you are most certainly entitled to keep it (ALL OF IT) and pass it on (I've made this point VERY clear several times …..KEEP WHAT YOU MAKE, PAY FOR WHAT YOU TAKE (its not hard to understand)……..However, I'm fairly certain we are talking about two very different 'perceptions' of wealth and how it was obtained.  Rest assure; The rich steal considerably more from the middle class than we can ever imagine.  

I'm afraid the deck is stacked against your son, and my sons, all of our sons, and our daughters too, and all of their sons and daughter to come in the future.
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sterling
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« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2014, 09:55:54 AM »

So when I leave my wealth to my son the day I die my son instantly becomes evil? My father wit themselvesrked hard to change my families legacy from scraping by to middle class. I am working my tail off to change my own from middle class to well off. I hope my son will strive for more than I did

Come on man you can do better than that

Keith

No he can not do better. In many of his responses he shows  disdain for those who have prospered.
And whose business is it if someone has inherited their money or made It on their own anyway. like has already been said most people are in the place in life they are in because of the decisions they make or have made. Human nature is to blame others or be envious of others for their own decisions.
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« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2014, 10:22:39 AM »

Thankfully and fortunately, I'm in a pretty good place…due to all my own sacrificing, hard work and smart decisions…….in spite of the thieving that took place and still does.  

Knowing how an economy works, particularly one as corrupt as ours, served me well indeed…... Smiley  I'm especially thrilled that no one was purposely stepped on in the process and pursuit of my living the dream….. cool

No comment on the 'content' above?  I suppose I could comment on the lack of it, or the lack of digestion perhaps, but what would be the point?  I dunno


Q; is this an example of what's been called tag teaming?  Wink  laugh
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« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2014, 12:40:14 PM »

I don't think it has anything to do with wealth passed down from generation to generation. There are rich & poor, young & old, that have lost their way... Some have forgotten what's "right" or what's "wrong"... makes me worry about things. Like what the "hell" is going on? What happened to a "good old fashioned work ethic", "good morals", "do the right thing", and "common sense"? I'm hoping that a whole lot of people get back on track or our Country's in big trouble. (just my opinion)
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Fox Creek
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« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2014, 01:09:21 PM »

I have never met a wealthy man who was not generous. I have worked for some very wealthy people. Mit Romney has done more for those in need than any race baiting, class envy huckster. creep. (think Obama). I became sick to my stomach when I read Alinsky's guide to the ruin of society. "Class envy". Fools will follow. 
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T Beek
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« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2014, 01:34:47 PM »

I have never met a wealthy man who was not generous. I have worked for some very wealthy people. Mit Romney has done more for those in need than any race baiting, class envy huckster. creep. (think Obama). I became sick to my stomach when I read Alinsky's guide to the ruin of society. "Class envy". Fools will follow.  

I've met plenty and am still acquainted with a few.  Hard people to get close to for the most part…..unless they made their dough by working for it and being smart….there really is a difference.  Not all are bad per say, I'm sorry if I've ever given that impression, it was never my intent, so it can only be a misunderstanding.  

I don't begrudge anyone who does well in this life….as longs it doesn't cost someone else.  Most of those I prefer to call 'semi-wealthy' are simply playing by the rules passed down by others.  

Fact is; We seldom encounter the 'truly' wealthy, the rule makers, our LANDLORDS.  Some seem to believe that the wealthy actually hang out with us  Undecided….sorry but chances are pretty good that most folks will never occupy the same room with any of the truly wealthy, much less have a conversation with any of them.

…..besides, that's 'not' the type of wealth I'm thinking of or talking about about anyway………Let's not confuse the issue, the wealthy do that pretty good on their own………..

Happily, I've also had the great pleasure of assisting in a number of investigations, prosecutions and witnessing (many less than were deserving) several of them serve jail time.  Good times indeed.  Smiley
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Keith13
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« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2014, 05:40:20 PM »

So when I leave my wealth to my son the day I die my son instantly becomes evil? My father worked hard to change my families legacy from scraping by to middle class. I am working my tail off to change my own from middle class to well off. I hope my son will strive for more than I did

Come on man you can do better than that

Keith

Are you leaving millions….or billions?  Are you leaving vast tracts of LAND (for later speculation) or resources?  


Yes I am I am leaving hopefully 1000's of acres of land. Land I have been able to acquire through sacrifice and hard work. Yes we have planted the land accepting the risk and we plan to log the land I have land planted in trees now I hope my son will be able to harvest. Unfortunately I do not have oil on my land or else we might harvest that as well. How does that make me or my son evil or my step-daughter for that matter I plan to split my wealth with her too? I am not trying to tag team you by no means I am just trying to understand how I and my children are evil because of my hard work?

respectfully,

Keith

If you earned what you have by your own sweat or intelligence (LABOR) you are most certainly entitled to keep it (ALL OF IT) and pass it on (I've made this point VERY clear several times …..KEEP WHAT YOU MAKE, PAY FOR WHAT YOU TAKE (its not hard to understand)……..However, I'm fairly certain we are talking about two very different 'perceptions' of wealth and how it was obtained.  Rest assure; The rich steal considerably more from the middle class than we can ever imagine.  

I'm afraid the deck is stacked against your son, and my sons, all of our sons, and our daughters too, and all of their sons and daughter to come in the future.
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