Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
September 16, 2014, 12:05:55 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: Beemaster's official FACEBOOK page
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat(1)  

Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Late Removal  (Read 1075 times)
D Semple
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 495

Location: Overland Park, Kansas


« on: August 26, 2013, 09:33:20 AM »

Got a barn being torn down in 3 weeks and have to do a late removal on a huge colony that has been in the barn for 5+ years. The bees are in an outside 2"x6" wall located about 6' in from the corner. Entrance is about 5' above ground level.


My wintering success rate on cutouts done after mid July sucks.

We are in a hot dry period here with a very light late soybean flow going on.

Other than the obvious feeding the heck out of them, what steps would you take to help this colony make it?

Mostly I would like to save the genetics if at all possible. (I'm tempted to fly schawee or JP up here for a weekend to find the queen for me).

IF I'm able to find and catch the queen would you pull a queen swap and move her into a different well prepared hive for winter?

I'm open to any kind of ideas and have most any kind of resources available.

Thanks.     ......Don

Logged
Roy Coates
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 54


Location: s/e Michigan


Re:
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2013, 01:12:51 PM »

I would do everything possible to transfer the complete colony. Feed back any stores that I was unable to frame and feed. Checking on them often. If not winter worthy for your area combine with another colony(hopefully one that has less desirable genetics) re moving the queen you like less

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 4
Logged
kaz052
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 15

Location: Western NY


« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2013, 03:25:22 PM »

Seeing that your survival rate with doing a cut out this late in the year is bad and that they are going to take down the barn anyways, what about cutting out the section of wall that the bees are in and just taking that part of the wall and forget about the cutout?  You'd have to look and see how much of the wall cavity they are taking up and get it down but I would think a tractor would do the trick.

Just a thought.
Logged
D Semple
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 495

Location: Overland Park, Kansas


« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2013, 07:19:53 PM »

Roy - good ideas I can do a combine later easily enough, removing the other queen. Thx

kaz - intriguing idea. Lots of questions:
-How would you contain the bees while moving them, they have lots of entrances and once I cut down the wall they would be able to get out at the top, bottom and sides also?
-Colony extends vertically 8' up and down, not sure how to transport it vertically?
-Then setting it up becomes a challenge because it would become a big sail, and this is Kansas. I would probably have to find another barn to strap it to.
-Like the idea except for the double work.

Anybody - think my idea of swapping queens after the removal to up my chances of saving this one is a good one?

Don
Logged
kaz052
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 15

Location: Western NY


« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2013, 09:16:45 AM »

-How would you contain the bees while moving them, they have lots of entrances and once I cut down the wall they would be able to get out at the top, bottom and sides also?
If you cut the wall on the outside cavity of the hive, the 2x6 studs will contain them there. The top and bottom, just use a scrape 2x6 nailed in place. If there is a lot of holes in the barn wood, then just use some luan board (underlayment) and attach it to the wall. It's light, will cover all the holes, and will help solidify the wall.

-Colony extends vertically 8' up and down, not sure how to transport it vertically?
I don't see any reason you can't lay the wall section down horizontally in the bed of a pickup truck to take it where ever you need. Or ask the home owner if you can leave it there somewhere and come back after winter to do the cut out.

-Then setting it up becomes a challenge because it would become a big sail, and this is Kansas. I would probably have to find another barn to strap it to.
You could strap it up against a house, garage, tree, etc. Or put it up on blocks horizontally like a TBH.

-Like the idea except for the double work.
May be double the work but you might be able to have a better chance saving the hive.

Logged
D Semple
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 495

Location: Overland Park, Kansas


« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2013, 05:42:45 PM »

kaz,

I'm going to check out the construction a little closer to see if I think the wall will be stable enough to transport and set back up, without tearing up the comb.

Thanks for the help I'll update with pictures.

Don
Logged
capt44
Field Bee
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 501


Location: Central Arkansas


WWW
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2013, 05:25:54 PM »

What I would do is set up a Trap Out.
close off all entrances but one, set the cone in place and setup the box where the landing board is touching the wall close to the base of the funnel.
Within a week you'll have 95% of the old bees trapped out and in the boxes.
You can move them to a beeyard and let them settle in.
Then merge them with an established hive that is on the weak side using the sheet of newspaper.
I've done this to 2 nest of bees so far this fall.
Logged

Richard Vardaman (capt44)
Moots
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1462


Location: Gonzales LA (Southeastern Louisiana)


« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2013, 05:30:14 PM »

What I would do is set up a Trap Out.
close off all entrances but one, set the cone in place and setup the box where the landing board is touching the wall close to the base of the funnel.
Within a week you'll have 95% of the old bees trapped out and in the boxes.
You can move them to a beeyard and let them settle in.
Then merge them with an established hive that is on the weak side using the sheet of newspaper.
I've done this to 2 nest of bees so far this fall.

Capt.
The only problem with that plan is it will do nothing to save the genetics of the hive, and he said that is what he would most like to do.  Sad
Logged

"We must reject the idea that every time a law’s broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions."
                                                                                                                   - Ronald Reagan
D Semple
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 495

Location: Overland Park, Kansas


« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2013, 06:18:07 PM »

The only problem with that plan is it will do nothing to save the genetics of the hive, and he said that is what he would most like to do.  Sad

Correct, this one is all about the queen. I normally turn down work this late in the season or talk folks into waiting till next year, but bees have occupied this barn since the mid 90's and the barn is coming down and the barn owners want the bees saved (their sentimental and have money). And, regardless of age this is one of the largest feral colonies I have seen and I may not be able to save the whole colony but if I can transfer the queen in to another strong colony well prepared for winter I'll still have the line.

I will be dragging some better eyes along to help me find her.

Good advice normally Capt. thanks.

Thanks  Moots
Logged
D Coates
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1066


Location: Lee's Summit, MO


« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2013, 10:55:19 AM »

Good luck Don. Transporting the hive in mass is a good call in my limited view.  I'd avoid the trap out simply because in an old barn there will invariably be exits you didn't know about.  Even, assuming there aren't it's going to take you 8 weeks which puts you in early November for completion.  They'll have no stores because they've been having to convert any nectar into wax and brood and feeding will be difficult and expensive (unless you live next door).  That's a whole lot of effort with a poor prospect for survival, again in my limited view.
Logged

Ninja, is not in the dictionary.  Well played Ninja's, well played...
sawdstmakr
Galactic Bee
******
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 3041


Location: Jacksonville FL


« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2013, 12:49:50 PM »

I like the idea of doing the cut out but I would take the honey comb, put it into frames, freeze it to kill the SHB/moths and then return it to the hive after 4 days have passed. I say this because I see the SHB's take over my OB hive for about 3 days after I tear it apart and move everything around. Then the bees start dumping the beetles, eggs and larva out of the hive on the 3 and 4th day. They did not do this the last time when I just removed 4 frames of honey and replaced them with foundation. I did not touch the brood frames. The beetles came from everywhere but the bees kicked them out into the cleanout trays. Not so when I remove the brood and replaced it. The beetles walk around the hive like the bees aren't even there. They own the hive until the bees get everything fixed the way they like it.
Jim
Logged
D Semple
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 495

Location: Overland Park, Kansas


« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2013, 04:45:08 PM »

dusty - Great advice about freezing the comb and giving it back to the 3 or 4 days later, I would never have thought of that. Thx.

If the wife will give me Labor day off I'll do this bee job then.


Drew how was Australia? Did you get to visit any of Perth's wonderfully g(o)(o)d beaches?




Logged
jredburn
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 113

Location: SW Florida


WWW
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2013, 07:43:07 PM »

I have had pretty good luck catching a queen in this type of circumstance by first sealing the entrance from the out side so the queen cannot get out.  Then I hang a large piece of netting from the ceiling on the inside if the room cannot be shut up to keep the queen in.  I then cutout the honey and put it in frames, followed by the brood.  If the queen goes in the hive box with the brood so much the better.  If she does not go in the box the she will find a spot inside the room to hide.  If you stop work after the last brood is in the frame and in the box and wait about 30 minutes, the free flying bees inside the room will find the queen and cluster around her.  You can then take  the cluster with a box and a brush or use a bee scoop to transfer them to the brood box.
If the bees do not go up on the comb after two hours of being in the hive box then they never will.  The SHB will have driven them off.  You will need to remove the bees and put them in a new box with empty frames.  Make them start from scratch.   You can feed their own honey back to them but it must be frozen first to kill off the SHB.. Otherwise fend the Honey B Healty and grease patties.
Regards
Joe
Logged
D Coates
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1066


Location: Lee's Summit, MO


« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2013, 10:16:03 AM »

Drew how was Australia? Did you get to visit any of Perth's wonderfully g(o)(o)d beaches?

Australia was great.  No time for the beaches.  Hit Little Creatures brewery for lunch and then headed over to Kings Park that was very nice.  After that it was all business with days spent in Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, Townsville, with a final 3 day stop in Auckland, NZ.  Productive time, great people, food, scenery, and beers.  I'd be lying if I said I wasn't happy to be home though.
Logged

Ninja, is not in the dictionary.  Well played Ninja's, well played...
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.295 seconds with 22 queries.

Google visited last this page August 31, 2014, 10:09:19 PM