Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
July 30, 2014, 02:40:30 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: ATTENTION ALL NEW MEMBERS
PLEASE READ THIS OR YOUR ACCOUNT MAY BE DELETED - CLICK HERE
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat  

Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: multiple eggs per cell  (Read 1078 times)
dermot
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 40

Location: Canberra


« on: August 20, 2013, 05:30:28 AM »

I opened 9 hives here in Canberra on the 11th of August- the first warm day of late winter- 17c. 2 of the weakest hives showed somin strange.




   I had a look on a few forums and it seems that sometimes queens coming out of winter seem to take a little time getting back into the swing of laying individual eggs in individual cells. From Michael Bush talking about myths:

"Queens will never lay double eggs.

(In other words, all multiple eggs are a sign of a laying worker).
I've often seen double eggs from a queen. Rarely I've seen triples. I've never seen more. Laying workers will lay from two to dozens in one cell. I look for more than two and eggs on the sides of the cells and not in the bottom. Also eggs on pollen. These I consider signs of laying workers."

   It looks like 6 or 7 in some cells. The queen was present in both of these hives and the eggs are in the centre of the cells. My guess is that this time of year the queen has an imperative to lay but the small cluster size has reduced the area warm enough for her to lay in so she just keeps laying and the workers will eat the extras.

   Hopefully I'll be able to check again in a week or 2 and see if she's settled down.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2013, 05:48:37 AM by dermot » Logged
Lone
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 1053


Location: North Queensland


« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2013, 06:07:50 AM »

Dermot, that's what I'd do.  Give the queen a chance for a little while but if it turns out to be drone brood only or continues with multiple eggs then I'd change the queen.  I had a similar situation, multiple eggs but not much brood in total. The hive just got weaker.

In Queensland, queens don't really stop laying in winter so I don't know about what happens when they are "coming out of winter", but sometimes new queens will also lay multiple eggs for a while.

Lone
Logged
100 TD
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 25

Location: Riverina


« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2013, 07:16:52 AM »

Interesting, I recently had a laying worker, lots of eggs in cells, and on the sides, if it is a queen, then she's a good layer, and I'd make sure she has plenty of room to lay.
Logged
Michael Bush
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 13588


Location: Nehawka, NE


WWW
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2013, 03:25:37 PM »

Judging by the number of eggs I would have guessed laying workers.  I've rarely seen a queen lay that many in one cell.  But you saw the queens.  Perhaps the bees just haven't opened up enough room for the queens to lay yet.

Logged

Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
edward
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1189


Location: BÖNAN SWEDEN

FEED ME HONEY or I`ll smash your screen !


« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2013, 06:01:11 PM »

"Queens will never lay double eggs.

"Older Queens that may start failing sometimes lay 2 eggs in the same cell" according to Ole 88year old beekeeper,queen breeder, and still going strong.

I have seen it myself, but never more than 2 , most likely worker bees laying eggs  angry

mvh Edward  tongue
Logged
100 TD
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 25

Location: Riverina


« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2013, 10:37:43 PM »


Quote from: dermot
2 of the weakest hives showed somin strange.
This statement would lead one to think laying worker

OP sighting was 11th, he'll sure know buy now if they're drones..........

Interesting though, can't see any on the cell walls.........
Logged
Lone
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 1053


Location: North Queensland


« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2013, 12:36:39 AM »

My multi-layer queen layed more than 2 eggs per cell, maybe up to 5.  But even though bees were hatching, I don't think there was more than about 10 square cm of brood at a time.  The multi laying never resolved.

Lone
Logged
100 TD
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 25

Location: Riverina


« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2013, 01:56:13 AM »

Interesting, second pic, no laying on pollen, singles on outside, none on cell walls, could be a queen, will be interesting to find out, specially if only small cluster area to keep warm, I wonder what is on the other side of that frame?
Logged
dermot
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 40

Location: Canberra


« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2013, 04:24:55 AM »

So we opened the boxes again on the 27th August (16°C). We found the queen again in both hives & both clusters were so small that they were contained within 3 frames. In 1 hive the queen reverted to laying single eggs per cell & there was a small area of very nice capped brood.
In the second hive the queen had improved & instead of laying 6-7 eggs per cell, is now down to laying 2-3. It seems as though the workers cleaned up the multiple eggs as the brood in the second hive is also very neat.
It was 16 days between visits & there is now no drone brood, which would seem to indicate multiple eggs from the queen rather than a laying worker.




The first image shows the queen on the frame & the second shows a close up of the same image with the multiple eggs almost transparent with the light shining through the wax.


The frames were removed for the purposes of picture taking to show the size of the cluster.
Logged
prestonpaul
House Bee
**
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 239


Location: Kennedys Creek, Victoria, Australia.


« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2013, 04:39:55 AM »

Would it be worth re-queening those 2 hives, just to be on the safe side?
Logged
dermot
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 40

Location: Canberra


« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2013, 05:26:35 AM »

I'm not sure that re-queening would help that much, as the problem seems to be much more to do with the size of the colony and the resultant area covered by the cluster and the "heater bees". The first hives' queen has already returned to single eggs per cell and I think the second is well on the way.

   I have enough healthy hives and access to swarms that I'm not reliant on these 2, and so I can afford the luxury of seeing if they can pull through the early spring and become productive hives. The queens have shown a great ability to lay and may prove to be tough genetic stock, worth continuing with.
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.181 seconds with 22 queries.

Google visited last this page July 17, 2014, 02:32:33 AM