Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
August 21, 2014, 05:12:28 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: Beemaster's official FACEBOOK page
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat(1)  

Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Inspection today - need some imput  (Read 1053 times)
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« on: August 03, 2013, 07:49:36 PM »

I have a 3 lb package of Italians that I got on the 7th of June. I have then in two 8 frame deep supers. It is my plan to use these two deeps for the brood boxes.

So I done my inspection today. I put in place my SHB IPK(?) trap from green bees in Trussville Alabama. Not a minute too soon either. I probably killed upwards to 50 SHBs. Most were corralled up by the bees.

My beetle barns ain't worth a hoot or I don't know how to use them. A lot of the beetles ended up on the bottom area after my inspection. I just brushed them into the vegetable oil in the tray. I probably crushed 15 or 20. There may have been maybe 5 on the frames.

The number of bees have really grown. Of the two supers only the one on the top is drawn out. It seems that one or two of the frames on the bottom were beginning to be drawn out a little. It is my unskilled impression that when the brood hatches they are backfilling them with pollen and nectar. I didn't see any signs of damage by the SHB or wax moths. Along about frame #6 or #7 I saw what appeared to be a queen cell. I'll try to load it up but I will describe it as well. It was close to the top of the frame and close to center. It was about the size of a hickory nut but not as fat and a little bit longer.

I didn't see it until I was looking at the pictures I took this afternoon. Since I thought they were honey bound anyway here's what I did to correct the honey bound. I swapped the deeps and put the one on the top on the bottom and visa versa. I also removed about three frames with brood and honey and place them in the other super and put the empty frames in the full super.

I know that there's different opinions about where the second brood box should go. Since I have had it on the bottom for a while and they weren't building in it I figured I had nothing to loose by swapping. I also went and retrieved two medium supers and put them on a frame about 20 yards from the current hive. It's a shot in the dark but I figure if they were to swarm they might just decided it's the right place. I also was thinking that since I created more space they might just tear the cell down. I also saw a lot of what appeared to be white pollen. I ruled out chalk brood because it was packed in there like pollen, flat and level. Could it could be sugar from sugar water in a hummingbird feeder? I had a SBB but since I put that trap on they have really been bearding this evening. I was able to see the pictures pretty good on my computer but when I clicked on them here they didn't look that good. I used a flash to light up the inside of the cells.

I know that some of the white are larva;



Here's the cell



Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
10framer
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1496

Location: Butler,GA


« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2013, 09:11:29 PM »

it's getting kind of late for us.  we're down to goldenrod, kudzu, and maybe cotton and some types of sumac. 
50 beetles is more than i like to see.  i'd definitely keep an eye on that.
if they haven't drawn anymore comb in the next couple of weeks i'd seriously consider taking them down to a single hive body.  this is peak beetle season and they attack bees that aren't able to defend all the space in a hive.
swarms usually stop around early to mid june around here.  if they were planning on swarming they'd have several queen cells.
it looks like you've still got 50+percent brood on those frames, did they all basically look like that?  i see a lot of pollen and a little nectar and very little capped honey.  hard to tell about the white,  the pictures are a little over exposed.
Logged
sawdstmakr
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2828


Location: Jacksonville FL


« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2013, 07:32:20 AM »

That looks like a supersedure cell to me or maybe an emergency cell. Did you see the queen during the inspection.
I could not tell if there are any eggs or young larvae. I did see some uncapped brood. The white stuff is not sugar water, it would be clear. I suspect it is pollen but I have never seen pollen that white. I may be commercial dust like gypsum or something like that. Bees have been known to bring in coal dust and other types of dust.
Do not remove that queen cell. Is it capped?
If all of your drawn frames are covered with bees like this one, they will bee able to take care of the beetles. For 3 years I was killing 1000's of beetles in my SBB oil trays every month, in all of my hives. They would be solid black and smell real bad when i cleaned them out monthly. Now I am not using oil because the beetle numbers are way down although they are starting to climb a bit. I clean it the dry trays weekly because the beetle and moth larvae that the bees kick out can grow in the pollen in the tray.
A friend of mine near by has done they same thing and is also now running dry trays. They work at decimating the beetles.
Jim
Logged
RHBee
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1088


Location: Pinopolis, SC

That's my pooch.


« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2013, 08:35:18 AM »

GSF, you didn't say if you saw eggs or the queen. The bees generally surround the brood with a ring of honey and pollen. Hopefully some of the guys in your area will chime on. If the flow is over I would put a feeder with some 1-1 on top. They need food to draw out the comb. SHB traps by Green Bee really saved my bacon last year. I'm phasing them out in favor of my own design, still using the #6 mesh though. That could be a supersedure cell. Was it capped? If not was there a larvae?
Logged

Later,
Ray
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2013, 12:10:57 PM »

RHBee - first the beetle trap. I put mine in place yesterday. This morning when I checked it there was a double hand full of bees in it. I cleaned it out, went to church, came back and checked it. I counted about 25 more bees. I have taped up the back side and ever crack (yesterday) and the best I can tell everything is bee tight - obviously not. Did you have this problem? Upon inspecting I still can't determine where they are coming in at. When you say dry traps are you talking about using diotamacious earth instead of oil?

sawdust/10framer/RHbee

The queen is there I saw her. Also to be found is larva, pre-pupa, and pupa. I haven't ever been able to spot eggs even with the camera. I didn't notice the cell until looking at my pictures so I don't know if it was capped or had larva.There is small larva as well. About the only thing that's happens around here is farming and open fields. In the last few years most farmers have died or went bankrupt. I do use agriculture lime (not the fertilizer type - this is a white dust) to neutralize the ammonia in my other critter's poop. I also have it on top of the ground under my tomatoes (no blossom end rot)
The fall flowers haven't started blooming around here yet.  I'll see if I can post all the pictures.

Any suggestions about the beetle trap with the bees? I'm thinking about removing the hive off of it and taking another look to see where they might be getting in at. It probably caught a half dozen beetles this morning.
Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
Finski
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3928

Location: Finland


« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2013, 12:17:30 PM »

.
There is no honey in those frames- What kind of honey store the hive has.
It ought to have 1-2 frames full of syrup or honey.

The colony is 2 months old. It should be bigger than that.
First brood cycle 4 weeks, then 4 weeks continuos flow of emerging new bees and brood.
Logged

.
Language barrier NOT included
10framer
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1496

Location: Butler,GA


« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2013, 12:30:40 PM »

beetle blasters or something similar that sits between the frames. go to youtube and look up "john pluta beetle control" or something similar.  if you aren't opposed to pesticides in your hive (i'm not doing it yet but i'm not going to say 100 percent that i won't one day) he shows how to make traps with combat.
i'm pretty sure it's not legal but i'm also pretty sure a lot of people are doing it.  that's a decision you have to make.  there are also some approved treatments out there.
the fall flow is nothing like the spring flows.  my bees are working pretty hard for the first time since the privet quit blooming back in may.
what ever variety of sumac is around is just coming into bloom but most of my hives are bringing in clear nectar (i'm guessing cotton).  if you have cotton or the late soybeans planted around you you may get a decent flow.
i'd be more focused on the beetles than getting more comb drawn.  the bees can winter in a single deep if they have to.  
that lone queen cell wouldn't worry me too much.  i have a hive that keeps one all the time and it gets cut down at last minute or else my existing queen wins the fight (she has got a damaged wing and a dent in her abdomen).  small queen but she lays wall to wall and the bees were my only real producers this year.
i have her daughter in another hive and she lays the same way.
  
Logged
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2013, 12:47:20 PM »

I posted some more pictures in another thread, less the two that are here.

Finski, that may account for the queen cell. There were a lot more bees in the other deep but no drawn out frame. It is like they are scared of it.

thanks everybody! I'm still at a loss on the beetle trap malfunction.
Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
RHBee
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1088


Location: Pinopolis, SC

That's my pooch.


« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2013, 12:53:31 PM »

RHBee - first the beetle trap. I put mine in place yesterday. This morning when I checked it there was a double hand full of bees in it. I cleaned it out, went to church, came back and checked it. I counted about 25 more bees.

The queen is there I saw her. Also to be found is larva, pre-pupa, and pupa. I haven't ever been able to spot eggs even with the camera.
Any suggestions about the beetle trap with the bees? I'm thinking about removing the hive off of it and taking another look to see where they might be getting in at. It probably caught a half dozen beetles this morning.

GSF, I did have that peoblem with one of my traps, the cause was that the bottom screen wire was damaged. Where are the bees located on the tray. The #6 mesh is almost big enough for bees to get through, if the wires are not consistent they will find a way. The place where the bees are caught in the tray might give you some help finding the opening. The guy at green bee sent me a new screen free of charge. Also, make sure the opening around the tray is not to large.
The brood pattern in the pictures looks good to me. Finding the queen is great but I'm not the best at it so I had to get good at spotting eggs. Get the sun over your shoulder so that the light can shine directly in the bottom of the cells. They are very small. If needed get some "helper glasses" and a bright LED flashlight.
Hope this helps you out.
Logged

Later,
Ray
10framer
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1496

Location: Butler,GA


« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2013, 12:58:33 PM »

RHBee - first the beetle trap. I put mine in place yesterday. This morning when I checked it there was a double hand full of bees in it. I cleaned it out, went to church, came back and checked it. I counted about 25 more bees.

The queen is there I saw her. Also to be found is larva, pre-pupa, and pupa. I haven't ever been able to spot eggs even with the camera.
Any suggestions about the beetle trap with the bees? I'm thinking about removing the hive off of it and taking another look to see where they might be getting in at. It probably caught a half dozen beetles this morning.

also, as the comb gets darker the eggs get easier to see.

GSF, I did have that peoblem with one of my traps, the cause was that the bottom screen wire was damaged. Where are the bees located on the tray. The #6 mesh is almost big enough for bees to get through, if the wires are not consistent they will find a way. The place where the bees are caught in the tray might give you some help finding the opening. The guy at green bee sent me a new screen free of charge. Also, make sure the opening around the tray is not to large.
The brood pattern in the pictures looks good to me. Finding the queen is great but I'm not the best at it so I had to get good at spotting eggs. Get the sun over your shoulder so that the light can shine directly in the bottom of the cells. They are very small. If needed get some "helper glasses" and a bright LED flashlight.
Hope this helps you out.
Logged
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2013, 02:45:26 PM »

Poor bees, they just want to be left alone

ain't gonna happen Wink

I just got back from checking out the cell and the trap. Again, the trap looks good. I added some extra staples to the screen at the entrance just in case they could flatten themselves out like a dime. Looking at the holes I'm surprised a beetle can fit through there (but they do - I saw them) so I don't think that's the problem. What I'm hoping is that while I was fooling around yesterday some of the bees got on the bottom of the screen and that's why I found them in the oil. I made sure that none were there this time and as soon as I put the pan back in I duck taped all the way around and where the drawer pulls out. So there shouldn't be any bees in there around dark.

Like I said earlier I didn't know the cell was in there until I looked at the pictures. I went back to see if there's anything in there and found out that I had semi rolled it. It was tore loose but still hanging on. A worker bee was busy inside of it so that suggests that something may be in there. It was at a bad angle and the worker wasn't worried with me trying to brush it away, it kept going right back in there.

Thanks yall, I really appreciate the advice. Like I've said before I've got a lot of reading & you tube 'n under my belt but there is absolutely nothing like hands on experience.

gary
Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
Finski
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3928

Location: Finland


« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2013, 04:12:25 PM »



 There were a lot more bees in the other deep but no drawn out frame.

Is there lack of nectar in nature when they have not stored it and they do not draw combs.

Give 3 kg sugar as 20% syrup. Look what happens. I have feeded swarms with 20% sugar.
Logged

.
Language barrier NOT included
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2013, 04:36:56 PM »

Thanks
Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2013, 07:56:23 PM »

Well the trap is still killing my bees so I took the tray out and sent them an email. Hopefully it'll work out.

Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
L Daxon
Field Bee
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 669


Location: Oklahoma City


« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2013, 08:40:28 PM »

That didn't look like a queen cell to me.  It is a queen cup.  Different things.  Bees build queen cups quite often in different places around the brood nest kind of as back ups in case they need a replacement queen real quick.  You needed to look into the cup and see if there was an egg or larva in it.  If so, then they will build it on out into a full blown queen cell and cap it.
Logged

linda d
Wolfer
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 184

Location: Southwest Mo.


« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2013, 09:22:13 PM »

I have the IPK traps on all my hives and really like them. I did however have one that kept killing a few bees.
On extreme examination I noticed it was raised a tiny bit in one place and bees were going under it. I don't know how but I saw them do it. Tacked it down and had no more problems.
Logged
GSF
Super Bee
*****
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 1538

Location: Central AL (nw corner of Elmore County)


« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2013, 07:11:40 PM »

Since I ran my mouth about the beetle trap malfunctioning I must post a follow up. I sent green bee an email yesterday. They replied and asked a question - I answered. They said it sounds like the screen has a flaw in it, we'll send you another one. I got home from work this evening and there it was.

Not that's customer service! In today's business world it's hard to find people like that.
Logged

"Life is hard, It's even harder when you're stupid."

John Wayne
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.642 seconds with 22 queries.

Google visited last this page July 24, 2014, 08:49:53 AM