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Author Topic: Troublesome split  (Read 649 times)
Dimmsdale
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Location: Berkeley Springs, West Virginia


« on: July 07, 2013, 08:59:14 PM »

My 3 year old hive swarmed on me early in the season.  Took a couple frames of cells and made 2 medium strength splits.  The parent hive and 1 split both got mated and took right off.  My second split hatched and I saw the virgin, but she apparently never made it back to the Nuc from her mating flight.  Took a frame of eggs from my other split and they made cells.  Gave em about 2 weeks and looked in today for eggs.  Looks like I have a laying working situation.  Just some spotty drone brood and only drone brood.  This is my first laying worker scenario, which is a good learning experience, but I'm kind of scratching my head on where to go from here.  I figure my options are:

1.  Add a frame of eggs and open brood every week for 3 weeks.  Let the raise a new queen.
2.  Shake all the bees and give them a frame of eggs, or maybe buy them a queen.
3.  Perhaps to a newspaper combine with my other split to strengthen it for winter.  It has grown to a single deep.

I'm thinking the latter would be a good option to stack the deck on my other split making it through winter.

I am very curious about trying to overwinter a Nuc though, and thought it might be worthwhile to try to build this one up to experiment.  If they don't make it, not a huge loss to me.  For those that overwinter nucs in my region, do you use wooden nucs or the styrofoam ones?  I'm thinking the styrofoam would have better success.

What are your thoughts guys and girls?Huh   Smiley
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10framer
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« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2013, 11:43:08 PM »

shake them out and let them drift into your other hives.  i had a couple of splits that ended up with laying workers this year and that's what i finally did.  i kept adding brood and adding brood and all that did was put a drag on my other hives.
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Finski
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« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2013, 12:03:16 AM »

My 3 year old hive swarmed on me early in the season.  Took a couple frames of cells and made 2 medium strength splits.  The parent hive and 1 split both got mated and took right off.  My second split hatched and I saw the virgin, but she apparently never made it back to the Nuc from her mating flight.  Took a frame of eggs from my other split and they made cells.  Gave em about 2 weeks and looked in today for eggs.  Looks like I have a laying working situation.  Just some spotty drone brood and only drone brood.  This is my first laying worker scenario, which is a good learning experience, but I'm kind of scratching my head on where to go from here.  I figure my options are:

1.  Add a frame of eggs and open brood every week for 3 weeks.  Let the raise a new queen.
2.  Shake all the bees and give them a frame of eggs, or maybe buy them a queen.
3.  Perhaps to a newspaper combine with my other split to strengthen it for winter.  It has grown to a single deep.

I'm thinking the latter would be a good option to stack the deck on my other split making it through winter.

I am very curious about trying to overwinter a Nuc though, and thought it might be worthwhile to try to build this one up to experiment.  If they don't make it, not a huge loss to me.  For those that overwinter nucs in my region, do you use wooden nucs or the styrofoam ones?  I'm thinking the styrofoam would have better success.

What are your thoughts guys and girls?Huh   Smiley

It seems that you spoil the hive build up with that mesh. Early splits work like brakes

To makes experiments yourself is not wise, because there are gthousands of cases from which you can learn and not sacrifice hives ,

Early swarming.....get a new beestock

Try to keep hives in one unit in spring. Build up is faster.

Wintering? No need to invent a wheel.

.

.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2013, 10:05:50 AM »

If they were in my backyard, I'd do the frame of brood every week for three weeks.  If they were at an outyard I have to drive to, I'd shake them out and forget them.

http://bushfarms.com/beeslayingworkers.htm
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
dfizer
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« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2013, 10:00:40 PM »

shake them out and let them drift into your other hives.  i had a couple of splits that ended up with laying workers this year and that's what i finally did.  i kept adding brood and adding brood and all that did was put a drag on my other hives.
I'm doing the exact same thing tomorrow due to the exact same situation.  I have had it with hive number 4 of mine.  3 full months of trying the get them to raise a queen by continually adding frames of brood/larvae/eggs. 
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2013, 09:56:51 AM »

>1.  Add a frame of eggs and open brood every week for 3 weeks.  Let the raise a new queen.

Chance of success: 99.9999999%

2.  Shake all the bees and give them a frame of eggs, or maybe buy them a queen.

Chance of success 0.000000001%

>3.  Perhaps to a newspaper combine with my other split to strengthen it for winter.  It has grown to a single deep.

Chance of success 50%
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
Dimmsdale
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2013, 09:12:57 AM »

UPDATE****
I saved this split for last during my inspections.  Approached it kind of dejected, prepared to just shake it out and call it a loss.  What I mistook for a laying worker, must have been a young queen just firing blanks for a while until she got warmed up. She had laid that box wall to wall with worker brood and was strutting around, just as fat as she could be.  I was beyond pleased.  Moved them into a deep box and strolled away from the yard chuckling about the never-ending surprises this hobby has.
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Oblio13
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« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2013, 11:40:24 AM »

"If you don't know what to do, don't do anything" has become my beekeeping mantra.
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sawdstmakr
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« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2013, 11:46:55 AM »

UPDATE****
I saved this split for last during my inspections.  Approached it kind of dejected, prepared to just shake it out and call it a loss.  What I mistook for a laying worker, must have been a young queen just firing blanks for a while until she got warmed up. She had laid that box wall to wall with worker brood and was strutting around, just as fat as she could be.  I was beyond pleased.  Moved them into a deep box and strolled away from the yard chuckling about the never-ending surprises this hobby has.


yippie chick hissy fit piano banana devil applause
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2013, 08:30:45 AM »

>What I mistook for a laying worker, must have been a young queen just firing blanks for a while until she got warmed up.

One of the prime reasons I prefer the frame of open brood solution.  If you are wrong it does no harm.  If you are correct it will fix the problem.
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
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