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Author Topic: Swarm with two queens?  (Read 976 times)

Offline 2Sox

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Swarm with two queens?
« on: May 24, 2013, 02:37:12 PM »
Clipped the branch with the swarm and shook it gently into my carboard nuc box.  A small bunch didn't make it in but most found their way into the box.  A few stragglers were hanging out on the frames I had laying on the ground.  I started to shake them into the box when I discovered that one of those stragglers was a lone queen!  I carefully placed her into the box.

While I was waiting for the rest of the flying bees to settle into the box, I found this queen walking down the outside of the box - alone.  This time I scooped her up, and placed her in a queen catcher, put it into the box.

Looked in this morning and the rest of the bees act like she isn't even there. Could this be a virgin queen that left with the rest? But it's my understanding that virgins come after the swarms leaves. I just can't figure it.  I haven't spotted another queen so I just don't know.
"Good will is the desire to have something else stronger and more beautiful for this desire makes oneself stronger and more beautiful." - Eli Siegel, American educator, poet, founder of Aesthetic Realism

Offline D Coates

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2013, 03:50:16 PM »
Some swarms, normally after-swarms have multiple virgin queens.  I had one with at least 3 (2 I knew of) but I've heard of other with as many as 6.  Virgins are for the most part ignored until they are no longer virgins.
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Offline 2Sox

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2013, 03:51:37 PM »
Some swarms, normally after-swarms have multiple virgin queens.  I had one with at least 3 (2 I knew of) but I've heard of other with as many as 6.  Virgins are for the most part ignored until they are no longer virgins.

So is there a mated queen in there somewhere??
"Good will is the desire to have something else stronger and more beautiful for this desire makes oneself stronger and more beautiful." - Eli Siegel, American educator, poet, founder of Aesthetic Realism

Offline Jim 134

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2013, 05:10:47 PM »
So is there a mated queen in there somewhere??


          Just remember one thing there are no absolutes and beekeeping. I have seen mated Queens and unmated Queens in the same swarm.



                               BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)

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Franklin County Beekeepers Association MA. http://www.franklinmabeekeepers.org/

Offline D Coates

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2013, 05:48:49 PM »
Some swarms, normally after-swarms have multiple virgin queens.  I had one with at least 3 (2 I knew of) but I've heard of other with as many as 6.  Virgins are for the most part ignored until they are no longer virgins.

So is there a mated queen in there somewhere??

I'd say no and let them work it out.  I've never seen a mated one with a virgin in a swarm or heard of it except for Jim134's claim.  There are definately some absolutes in beekeeping.  Case in point, a drone will never lay eggs.
Ninja, is not in the dictionary.  Well played Ninja's, well played...

Offline 2Sox

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2013, 05:51:18 PM »
So why is this one being totally ignored?

I just went in to let her out of the queen cage.  Don't want her starving if she's not going to be fed.
"Good will is the desire to have something else stronger and more beautiful for this desire makes oneself stronger and more beautiful." - Eli Siegel, American educator, poet, founder of Aesthetic Realism

Offline Jim 134

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2013, 11:28:16 AM »
D Coates.......
Someday you may find a swarm like this that come from multiple hives.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-97FnTGIa12g/UZUtpiO0FwI/AAAAAAAACVc/eJ16Xmx8cCE/s640/BC+Swarm.




                          BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)
"Tell me and I'll forget,show me and I may  remember,involve me and I'll understand"
        Chinese Proverb

"The farmer is the only man in our economy who buys everything at retail, sells everything at wholesale, and pays the freight both ways."
 John F. Kennedy
Franklin County Beekeepers Association MA. http://www.franklinmabeekeepers.org/

Offline don2

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2013, 11:53:19 PM »
It is not unusual to have multiple virgin queens in the after swarm/secondary, swarms. That is where it is good to have extra equipment, cage one and start a nuc, if you can manage to have a few extra bees.  :) d2

Offline twin1

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2013, 12:48:24 AM »
I've noticed in several of "JP the Beeman" videos he finds more than two or three queens with swarms.  And what is happening when they are "balling" the queen?  are they trying to kill her or protect that queen?  Just very interesting the multiple queens.  Caught my first swarm of the year last week after the tornadoes rolled thru.   I highly recommend the lemon grass oil.

Offline don2

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2013, 12:52:00 AM »
Killing her.  :) d2

Offline alfred

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2013, 11:15:24 AM »
So typically doesn't the old Queen leave with the swarm? ...and the new queen stays?  Right?

So if there is an after swarm or multiple swarms or a two queen swarm, one of them would be the old queen, and the rest are the newly emerged Queens???

Alfred

Offline don2

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2013, 12:36:01 PM »
Normally the old queen leaves with the first swarm.  :) d2

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2013, 02:25:39 PM »
"On the fourteenth, the fifth young queen appeared, and the hive threw a swarm, with all the concomitant disorder before described. The agitation was so considerable, that a sufficient number of bees did not remain to guard the royal cells, and several of the imprisoned queens were thus enabled to make their escape. Three were in the cluster formed by the swarm, and other three remained in the hive. We removed those that had left the colony, to force the bees to return. They entered in hive, resumed their post around the royal cells, and maltreated the queen when a duel took place in the night of the fifteenth, in which one queen fell. We found her dead next morning before the hive; but three still remained, as one had been hatched during night. Next morning we saw a duel. Both combatants were extremely agitated, either with the desire of fighting, or the treatment of the bees, when they came near the royal cells. Their agitation quickly communicated to the rest of the bees, and at mid-day they departed impetuously with the two females. This the fifth swarm that had left the hive the thirtieth of May and fifteenth of June. On the fifteenth, a fifth swarm cast, which I shall give you no account of, as it showed nothing new."--Fran├žois Huber, New Observations on the Natural History Of Bees Volume I

http://bushfarms.com/huber.htm#oldqueenleadsprimaryswarm
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My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
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Offline alfred

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Re: Swarm with two queens?
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2013, 04:20:55 PM »
So basically anything can happen....


 

anything