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Author Topic: Pupae on the front porch...."Normal"?  (Read 1142 times)
Moots
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« on: February 03, 2013, 09:39:46 AM »

Update on my Nucs...
Did a quick peak inspection yesterday on my two Nucs, to my untrained eye, everything seems to progressing along nicely.
However, last night I went take a peak with my red light and one of the Nucs had about 8 or 10 pupae drug out on the landing board.  Gave the girls a hand and wiped them off.  This morning, maybe a couple more with assorted pieces. 

I'm thinking this is relatively normal and part of the whole natural process.  I'm I correct?  Or, is this some reason for concern?  As I said, all else seems to be normal and well!

Thanks for any and all feedback! Smiley
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Finski
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« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2013, 09:55:37 AM »

red light and one of the Nucs had about 8 or 10 pupae drug out on the landing board. 

It is rare. Look into bottom and frames.

If you sea a heap of pupae on the floor, it is varroa which is killing your hive just now.

.
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« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2013, 10:02:05 AM »

I concur
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kathyp
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« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2013, 10:08:24 AM »

have you had any kind of a cold snap where some might have been chilled and killed/damaged?
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bailey
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« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2013, 10:19:39 AM »

I see cycles of what your describing here and there.  They are cleaning out mites and defective larvae.
As long as everything else looks good I usually let them clean out what they want to and watch them grow out.

The pupae were defective. But it could have been some chilled brood with that last bit of cold or mites
Or other unknown reason.

I worry when my bees don't pull out defective larvae. I want them to pull every one they find and any young mites they find with them.

You can go in and look through the brood and see what the pattern looks like.
I'm betting you find a lot of developing and capped brood.  

If you find drone brood in there pull the caps off of one or two and look for mites on the young drone pupae.


The next brood cycle should be hatching out soon on those nucs.
Look for a good increase in numbers of bees in there.  

Bailey
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Moots
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« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2013, 10:30:48 AM »

thanks everyone for the responses...

We've had a dip in temperature this past week, but nothing that I think would have been a problem, maybe lows in the high 30's.

Bailey, I'll do what you said...Considering I was in there yesterday, should I go back in today, or just wait until my inspection next weekend?
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"We must reject the idea that every time a law’s broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions."
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« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2013, 10:51:10 AM »

Keep on asking those questions moots. I'm reading those responses and learning right along side of you.
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Marshall
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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2013, 11:00:01 AM »

 If your were on screened bottoms you could have some chilled brood with a cold snap.
On solid bottoms, you could have some nice vsh traits and they are cleaning out mite infested brood th_thumbsupup
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Just5398
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« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2013, 11:23:26 AM »

For winter should you change from the screened bottom board to the solid?
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Sally
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« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2013, 11:59:13 AM »

No in winter it is good to ventilate out the damp from the hive.

Spring build up or when the hive has brood you can close the bottom up with a board to make it easier for the hive to keep the brood warm.

mvh edward  tongue
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bailey
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« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2013, 12:02:16 PM »

I started with screens bottoms.  Don't use them anymore.  
Better luck so far with solids.
Bailey

Moot.  No further inspection needed.  What did you see as far as
Larve?  Capped brood ? And tight pattern? Or spotty?
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most often i find my greatest source of stress to be OPS  ( other peoples stupidity )

It is better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool than to open ones mouth and in so doing remove all doubt.
Finski
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« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2013, 12:18:05 PM »



I worry when my bees don't pull out defective larvae. Bailey


Varroa kills only pupae.

If dead pupae or larvae are few, bees eate them. If they re many, they must carry them out.

INSPECT THE FLOOR!!!

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Moots
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« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2013, 12:28:17 PM »

Bailey,
Really don't know, I didn't actually pull any frames other then the new ones. I was trying to stay minimally invasive. The rest of the frames in both Nucs seemed to be covered in bees. Progress seemed about the same on the new frames, so I moved it from the end over one frame in Alpha hive and two in Bravo. Alpha is the one with the Pupea issue, the lesser populated of the original two Nucs.
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"We must reject the idea that every time a law’s broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions."
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bailey
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« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2013, 01:45:12 PM »

The cluster had to contract with that last cool spell. If they had expanded the brood in the warmer
Days they may have to have left some brood exposed.

But let's make finski happy.  Check the floor for large amounts of pupae. 
I'm betting you won't see too many.

If not consider their smaller size.  They will contract in cool snaps.  If they have too much brood to
Cover some will die.  They will dispose of them just like mite killed pupae.
Bailey.

It's a nice day today.  You could peek if you like. 
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most often i find my greatest source of stress to be OPS  ( other peoples stupidity )

It is better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool than to open ones mouth and in so doing remove all doubt.
Finski
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« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 01:50:10 PM »

No in winter it is good to ventilate out the damp from the hive.



Winter temp in Conzales La is now over 20 C.

.
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rdy-b
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« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2013, 05:06:51 PM »

Update on my Nucs...
Did a quick peak inspection yesterday on my two Nucs, to my untrained eye, everything seems to progressing along nicely.
However, last night I went take a peak with my red light and one of the Nucs had about 8 or 10 pupae drug out on the landing board.  Gave the girls a hand and wiped them off.  This morning, maybe a couple more with assorted pieces. 

I'm thinking this is relatively normal and part of the whole natural process.  I'm I correct?  Or, is this some reason for concern?  As I said, all else seems to be normal and well!

Thanks for any and all feedback! Smiley

 I would look at the possibility that there is a protein deficiency in the colony-this is associated with pulling  or cannibalizing of brood
may happen if there is a uptick of brood rearing from good weather- and a sudden lack of pollen for the bees to fulfill the protein
requirement of the hive --hive has a economy- and they spend protein where it is needed most-and it may be spent on older bees to replenish glands for royal jelly or even to boost forage capacity--something to think about any way---RDY-B
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Moots
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« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2013, 05:35:11 PM »

Ok guys, we went back in to take a look.   

I had my wife video it and will try to upload later...This is what I observed...Mind you, I'm Green at this so I'm not sure what, if anything I learned. huh

First, I had put in two Beetle jail baitable traps, baited with some apple.  One had one beetle and the other had about 12 to 15, which I thought was impressive and/or depressing for a 24 hour period.  I "thought' the brood pattern looked fine.  I didn't really notice any larva or eggs, but I'm not accustomed to spotting that yet and the frames were for the most part pretty covered with bees.

The center 3rd of my Nucs have a screen bottom, however, I have a board that slids in a slot beneath it, basically making it a solid bottom board.  There was a fair amount of debris on the center board, because the bees can't get below the screen to clean it.  The remaining two thirds of the bottom board looked clean to me.  I also noticed that I had 2 or 3 SHB's seeking shelter beneath the wire mesh and on the center board out of the reach of the bees.  I noticed this because I saw a group of bees going crazy trying to get to the beetles. 

I opened a drone brood cell and saw no mites.  I also pulled the center board to deprive the SHB's of their hiding spot and figure I'ii slip it back in tonight.

Not sure if my description offers clarity of confusion...I'll try to get the video up later.

Thanks all!
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"We must reject the idea that every time a law’s broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions."
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« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2013, 06:04:27 PM »

Bring on the video. Someone will be able to help!
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PLAN-B
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« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2013, 06:28:26 PM »

looking forward to seeing the video Moots and also the responses from everyone...
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Marshall
bailey
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« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2013, 07:11:09 PM »

If there was a good amount of capped brood then it sounds about
Right. 
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most often i find my greatest source of stress to be OPS  ( other peoples stupidity )

It is better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool than to open ones mouth and in so doing remove all doubt.
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