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Author Topic: Extractor advice  (Read 3140 times)
Intheswamp
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« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2012, 12:00:52 PM »

You are so very right, mulesii.  I guess I had a one-track radial mind. Smiley  Yes, with three medium frames inserted tangentially you can extract a total of nine mediums at a time.  Or course you have to stop twice during the extraction process to flip frames, which may or may not be a big issue to some people.  For me, it's not exactly a "plus", but it's not a deal killer, either.

I'm torn between SAF and Maxant.  Of note is that Maxant's customer service is second to none (though some may be equal).  I don't hear of many people needing to repair extractors, though.  It seems most of the major brands work well with few issues.  If Maxant had a 100% 9-frame radial attractor I don't think there would be question which I would choose.  Having said that, from what I understand tangential extracting will remove more honey that radial extracting...correct me if I'm wrong.

Thanks for the heads'up, mulesii,
Ed
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American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
Boom Buzz
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« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2012, 12:18:31 PM »

Ed, yeah I have thought about the bulk storage question a little bit.  When I thought I was going to get the 9 frame SAF from Brushy MTN I was planning to get their extractor kit which has most of the stuff you mentioned.  The kit is on sale with the purchase of that extractor.  I have two five gallon buckets with lids, strainers and gates already.  So uncapping tools and some larger bulk containers will be helpful.

Mulesii - thanks, I had seen that the Maxant is a 9 frame - 6 radial and 3 tangential.  I do solely mediums for the honey super.  So I was assuming, I could do nine mediums, at a time.  Though it seems like it would be more like 15 frames every two cycles, because you are flipping the tangential frames when you reload the radial frames.  So the tangential slots get reloaded every other time!?  So in essence it is like doing 7.5 frames per cycle?  Am I thinking about that correctly?  I haven't ruled it out, but just trying to understand how that would work.  I have not used an extractor before so sorry if the questions are so basic.  The pricing on the maxant is definitely attractive.
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Joe D
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« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2012, 02:04:11 PM »

Boom Buzz, I called my friend that let me use his.  He said he got it from Dadant, it is a 12 frame electric.  I don't know how much but it works great.  He has 80 hives and he let me do mine.  Good luck with your project.



Joe
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D Coates
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« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2012, 04:05:56 PM »

So if I stay around 15 hives for my apiary then maybe the 18 frame is overkill and I am fine with the 9 frame.  I do need to find the weight of the 18 frame, it just might be to heavy to e moving around.

I've only got 15 hives that I harvest from and the 20 frame extractor I've got saves me tons of time.  (average 30 supers, 2- supers per hive, 9 frames per super, 270 frames to extract) My 20 frame is heavy but I installed lockable casters on it so it moves around beautifully.  I use regular super frames and it fits 36 of those.  Not sure if that's the case with the 18 you're looking at.  The thing that an 18 will do for you when you look at it is equally pull the honey from both sides.  Most of the smaller radial extractors put the frames at angles, not like spokes of a wagon wheel.  The larger ones use the true wagon wheel configuration and in theory you'll have less blow outs, but the is conjecture as I've only used a Kelly reversable 2-frame and the Dadant.  I did the same excersize you are doing now as I looked to upgrade my extractor.
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D Coates
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« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2012, 04:12:44 PM »

Woops, double post.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2012, 09:18:15 AM by D Coates » Logged

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Intheswamp
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« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2012, 07:32:14 PM »

John, I hadn't really thought about the gauge of the metal.  I knew that the smaller number was a thicker metal but didn't realize exactly what the differences are.  I found a website that listed the differences and it was an eye opener.  It's amazing what we learn as we get deeper into the brood chamber, eh? Wink

Anyhow, the only folks that I've found that list gauges for their extractors are Mann Lake and Maxant.  Mann Lake states 26 gauge for their extractors while Maxant states 20 gauge for theirs.  If I'm not looking at this wrong, according to the sheet metal website the Maxants 20-gauge (.0375" thick) is TWICE as thick as the Mann Lake 26-gauge (.0187" thick).  I've looked around but haven't found the gauges for SAF or Dadant...I would really be interested in the gauge of the SAF units.

It seems to me that Maxants may be leaning more toward commercial durability.  But, there's lots of happy users of other brands that brag on their extractors as being durable.  Huh

Here's the website for the sheet metal gauge chart:  NorthClad sheet metal gauges.

Here's a snippet of the pertinent part of the chart...

Gauge     Stainless Steel Thickness
26      0.0187"
25      0.0219"
24      0.0250"
23      0.0281"
22      0.0312"
21      0.0344"
20      0.0375"

Anyhow, just wanted to point the "gauge thing" out to you.  Probably everyone else realized the differences years ago.  embarassed

Ed
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
Intheswamp
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« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2012, 07:47:23 PM »

I use a Maxant Model 3100P (9 frame with motor). I do not have the luxury of youth, for strength and endurance.  After watching a friend do hand cranking and hand cranking U-tube clips, I decided to go with the motor driven model. -Mike
Mike, when you extract do you extract a full nine frame-load, 6 radially and 3 tangentially?

If you go with a full-load what is your process for flipping the tangentially positioned frames?

Thanks,
Ed

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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
duck
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« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2012, 08:00:14 PM »

find an extractor, take off the handle, then weld a sprocket on there.  Get some chain and make a motor mount with electric motor, and sprocket.  Adjust sprocket size to slow it down or speed it up.  oh and make a chain guard. heh
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Boom Buzz
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« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2012, 08:34:48 PM »

Ed, thanks for posting the thickness for the different gauge steel.  The FAS is showing up as 0.5 mm which comes in at 0.0197 inches which is between 25 and 26 gauge.  It is Italian made, and the spec sheet has some english on it so hopefully I am reading it right.

I also saw a thread on another site that spoke very highly of Maxant 3100P.  I am interested to hear Mike's response on how he uses it.

Duck, I am actually going in on this with a friend and fellow beek, and he thinks like you do.  "we can rig something up."  And I would be for that if we found a decent used hand crank at a good price.  But since it looks like we are buying new, I am pushing to get a motorized unit out of the shoot.  I am waiting for his feedback on bumping up the budget.

Right now it is between the Maxant 9 frame 3100P, the FAS 9 frame motorized (probably too expensive), or the Mann Lake 8 frame motorized (But the Maxant looks like better quality, at a lower price, and close on number of frames).   I think it would be a done deal if the Maxant were a straight 9 frame and not a 6 and 3.
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Joe D
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« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2012, 11:36:30 PM »

Boom, the Bix extractor I got , I am planning to hook a tread mill motor to it.  With the controls you can run most any speed.  Picked it up at a garage sell for 5 bucks.  They had broke the part you run on, every thing I needed worked fine.  Good luck



Joe
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JWPick
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« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2012, 08:27:50 AM »

We have the 9-frame SAF Italian Hand Crank model purchased from Rossman's. It is a true Radial extracting all 9 frames at one time. It is of good quality and easy to use. Price was the motivating factor for us when we purchased it. We plan on upgrading to the motor in the next year or two when we sell enough honey to help pay for the motor kit. I think the Maxant models are of better quality, but make sure you buy a "true" radial so you don't have to stop or turn frames. I think JP has the Maxant 20 frame model with heavy duty legs (SAF has lower quality legs that twist a bit when extracting  Sad ) which is what we really wanted (maybe later?). JP even has a video of him using his extractor.
Storage is also a huge factor for you while you are extracting. With 6 hives we have filled five 5-gallon buckets. They definitely need to sit overnight to allow wax and particles to rise.
Always think long term and durability in mind.
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JWPick
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« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2012, 08:40:41 AM »

We keep and use our extractor in our garage also. I mounted it to a pallet which cuts down on a lot of unbalanced wobble. We keep it covered with a blanket which helps keep it clean and ready to use.
Hope this helps.
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Boom Buzz
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« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2012, 03:36:48 PM »

My buddy and I are closing in on ordering the maxant 3100p but then I took another look at the picture in the attached link...

http://www.htkbeesupply.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=62_65&product_id=86

It looks like the radial inserted frames are side by side in a way that the honey would not flow out of the two sides facing each other.  That the frames would have to be flipped!?  or at least the frames being placed together would impede the draining of the honey out of the comb.

Can anyone explain how this works?  Any help is appreciated!

John
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D Coates
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« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2012, 04:38:02 PM »

It will flow between the frames with no problems.  You won't need to reverse anything on the 6 super frames.  If you put a deep on it's side to fit on the long sides youwill have to flip that one though.
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Boom Buzz
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« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2012, 04:53:58 PM »

Thanks Drew!  I called Maxant and talked to Jake there as well.

Placed the order and bought some uncapping tools also. 

Really appreciate all the input and food for thought from everyone! Thank You!

As a side note, I checked craigslist one time yesterday and a three year old 9 frame SAF motorized popped up at a great price!  Just an hour south of me.  Needless to say I got pretty excited....until I saw the "This item is sold" note!  Cry  DANG!  Not sure how I missed it, but it was gone before I even knew it was available...  I will be happy with the Maxant I am sure!  bee

John
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Intheswamp
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« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2012, 10:55:51 PM »

 grin  th_thumbsupup
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
Intheswamp
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« Reply #36 on: August 21, 2012, 11:46:10 AM »

So....IS IT THERE YET!!!?   grin
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
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« Reply #37 on: August 22, 2012, 11:35:08 AM »

Just used my maxant 1400P for the first time. it is a great machine works really nice
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