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Author Topic: Natural Comb Extracting Blowouts  (Read 1073 times)
BrentX
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« on: July 23, 2012, 05:50:45 PM »

About half of my natural comb (no foundation) frames experience some type of blowout in the radial extractor, with sections of comb breaking away.  On some frame there is just a small section lost, on others it can be a significant portion of the comb.

The blowouts are not perceptively different on new comb versus old comb.  The natural comb frames with wires do better than the unwired frames.  Any other thoughts on increasing natural comb robustness in the extractor?

My four frame extractor is a single speed - the speed of my power screw driver.  There is a slip clutch mechanism that allow the frames to start out slower and build up, but the rate of speed increase is not tightly controlled.
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yockey5
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« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2012, 06:43:08 PM »

Too fast, too soon and blowouts are a sure thing.
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kathyp
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« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2012, 06:48:29 PM »

and it's not a big thing.  the bees will repair the comb next year.  even foundation frames will have blow outs depending on what they are and how they are put together.  retrieve the chunks and enjoy.
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hardwood
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« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2012, 07:39:37 PM »

Make sure the comb is attached on all sides before extracting. I find that my bees don't build all the way to the bottom bar in the brood areas but if I move the frames of honey up away from the brood they will fill in the gap.

Scott
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AllenF
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« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2012, 08:04:32 PM »

Wire your frames.   Or use heavy fishing line.   And spin it slower to start with also.   Slower and longer spin.   Once most of th honey is spun out, then you can increase speed.  And bees will fix the comb that is messed up. 
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2012, 12:14:05 PM »

I've blown out wired wax and even plastic when the comb was soft enough and the speed was not slow at first.  I can't imagine the purpose of a single speed extractor... I'd make a belt tightener for it and start slow...
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mikecva
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2012, 02:32:02 PM »

Do you have or can you borrow an electric drill. Usually they can be run at slower speeds. Your power screwdriver may not live very long as many of them can not be run under a heavy load for the extended periods of time it takes to extract your honey. If you are not going to do cutouts, you might try what my neighbor did years ago - he cross wired his frames in an x pattern rather then horizontal (I have not done this myself so I do not know how well it works).  Looks like you will have a little crush and drain extracting this year.  bee  -Mike
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BjornBee
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« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2012, 06:33:14 AM »

My question is: Why are you worried about using foundationless comb in honey supers?

What is the reasoning of foundationless frames? I suppose it being cheaper would be one reason. Although any basis of "more natural" would seem useless since brood generally is not raised in honey supers if a honey barrier was established, or an excluder was used.

You mention frames, so I am ruling out the use of TBH. Another style of hive that uses foundationless would be the Warre hive, and that protocol normally calls for constant undersupering, and the destruction of comb when supers are removed.

So I am left thinking you are using a standard hive, running supers, and then for some unknown benefit reasoning that eludes me, are trying to extract foundationless frames.

You can try to slow down, and do this over and over, each time realizing you will lose comb. This is common and does happen.

Why are you not using foundationless in the brood chamber, then using some type of reinforced comb (wired, plastic, etc) in the supers where being foundationless means about absolutely nothing.

Or did you follow someones advice which seemed good at the time, but in practical commonsense makes far less than the ideal situation it was promoted as?

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Joe D
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« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2012, 10:48:52 AM »

Check it to make sure it is attached good, if it isn't then you can use it as comb in  honey.  I am new haven't extracted much but so far I've had 1 frame in spring and 1 in the summer extraction to blow out.  Good luck with yours.



Joe
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Intheswamp
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« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2012, 11:23:25 AM »

If you continue to use your screwdriver try pulsing the power...power on, power off, power on, power off, etc.,.  That may keep the speed down to a workable speed that will reduce blowouts.  Once you have half+ of the honey slung out then speed it up.

Ed
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sterling
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« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2012, 05:05:01 PM »

I think I would get a variable speed drill to replace the screwdriver.
 I guess I ain't to smart either cause I use foundationless frames in honey suppers. Mostly cause i'm cheap. And I extract them in a motorized extractor with little problem. If they aren't attached completely on the ends I put a rubberband on them before I put them in the extractor. But you have to start slow and gradually speed up. If the comb is not straight with the frame I cut around the edge and put a rubberband on to hold them straight put them back in and the bees fix em.
If I was bigtime I would use plastic foundation.
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beeghost
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« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2012, 12:03:37 AM »

My best advice for a cheap way to control speed of your extractor and still use power.................look in for sale ads on craigslist or where ever and look for an old treadmill being either given away or for sale really cheap. I built my extractor last year and used the treadmill control panel and motor I got for free and it has been a blessing. It is belt driven and starts off really slow, then I can also spin it fast enough that it would probably send blown frames everywhere if I wanted to!!

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