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Author Topic: Trapout vs. Cutout  (Read 1050 times)
greenbtree
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« on: March 27, 2012, 12:27:21 PM »

I have been contacted by a gentleman who has bees in the upper story of his farmhouse.  He says they have been there for ten years (Yes, I know it probably isn't the same colony, etc., etc.)  He didn't care when he lived in the house, but now he has others living there.  For a change, it's close - only a fifteen minute drive for me.  I am going to go this weekend to evaluate the situation, but thought this would be a good topic for everyone to chime in on - which would you LIKE to do and why? 

JC
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"Rise again, rise again - though your heart it be broken, or life about to end.  No matter what you've lost, be it a home, a love, a friend, like the Mary Ellen Carter rise again!"
sawdstmakr
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« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2012, 12:56:55 PM »

If I were the home owner, I would definitely require a cutout. If you do a trap out, you will leave a lot of honey and pollen and the bugs will be horrible. Also after the hive larvae are in there you will have a foul smelling, sticky messin coming through the wall. Do a cut out for him.
Jim
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Jim 134
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« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2012, 01:51:57 PM »

If I were the home owner, I would definitely require a cutout. If you do a trap out, you will leave a lot of honey and pollen and the bugs will be horrible. Also after the hive larvae are in there you will have a foul smelling, sticky messin coming through the wall. Do a cut out for him.
Jim



 IMHO You need to listen to 12:00 to the end.
 And know if you got lots of SHB in the area or not if  you got lots of SHB do at in the early spring few SHB  

http://youtu.be/wTqFbiaD_js

And all so read this

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,20301.0.html
  

          BEE HAPPY Jim 134 Smiley
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kathyp
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« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2012, 02:07:04 PM »

if you can, i'd go for the cutout also.  it's cleaner, and faster.  trap outs are super when you can't get to the hive, but even robbed out, the wax and whatever is left behind.  + it's swarm season and if you do a trap out and leave it to be robbed, you run the risk of a swarm moving in before you are done....and starting over.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2012, 02:23:04 PM »

Cut-out is the way to go.  Reserve trap-outs for situations where a cut-out is not feasible (ie.  brick walls, trees, etc.)

I'm always skeptical of claims of how long the bees have been there as well,  but occasionally you get surprised.
http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,9430.msg60376.html#msg60376
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iddee
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« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2012, 03:20:48 PM »

""If I were the home owner, I would definitely require a cutout. If you do a trap out, you will leave a lot of honey and pollen and the bugs will be horrible. Also after the hive larvae are in there you will have a foul smelling, sticky messin coming through the wall. Do a cut out for him.
Jim""

Unless you are in heavy SHB territory, that statement is totally wrong. A trapout without SHB can be very clean and leave nothing but dry comb.

Having said that, I agree a cutout is by far the best way to go when it is even close to feasible. A trapout should always be the last choice.
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greenbtree
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« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2012, 09:20:44 AM »

Update: I did a cutout on this location yesterday.  If my husband had seen the contraption I lashed together to reach the approximately 23 ft in the air to reach the bees he would of said "No way, Jose' ".  I tried to reach them from inside the attic or a bedroom, but that wasn't possible. This place was the goofiest old farmhouse, with weird nooks and crannies EVERYWHERE.  No wonder they had bees now, I am sure that they will again.  Apparently they had raccoons living between the floors of the house two years ago, and I found hickory nuts under the brood nest propolised in place.  Currently, there is no hickory tree within 2 miles of the place.
Well, I pulled out a lot of comb not currently in use, and filled 1 deep with brood and pollen (I am going out to add a box and give them syrup after I post this.)  Just about the time I thought I was done, I noticed bees going in slightly above where I had pulled everything out.  My ladder contraption was as high as it could go, and I just couldn't reach them.  The bees wouldn't have two broodnest areas would they?  Who knows if I got the queen, I have yet to spot a queen during a cut out.  I told the owner that if he could get a hold of some scaffolding I could come back.  IF I got the queen and all of the brood, how long would the remaining bees hang around?  They were super nice bees, real quiet (Yeah, it's Spring, but still.) the ones I put in the deep stayed quiet, but the ones that were left were extremely agitated when I left.  I had vacuumed up as many bees as I could reach, I have NO idea how many might have been left.

JC
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"Rise again, rise again - though your heart it be broken, or life about to end.  No matter what you've lost, be it a home, a love, a friend, like the Mary Ellen Carter rise again!"
kathyp
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« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2012, 10:03:50 AM »

Quote
The bees wouldn't have two broodnest areas would they?

they might very well, and that location sounds like the perfect place!  since i mostly do old barns and stuff like that, i learned right away to carry more than one set up.  it's not uncommon to find more than one hive in those old places.

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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
iddee
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« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2012, 10:56:08 AM »

As Kathy says, sounds like 2 hives. There is a hive here in town with the entrance on the corner. One hive goes in and goes straight, to the hive in the front wall. The other hive goes in and turns right, going to the hive in the side wall. They have been there for years.
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"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

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greenbtree
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« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2012, 11:15:19 AM »

Well then, I hope this guy can get some scaffolding somewhere.  He is going to need it to do a proper job of repairs anyway.

JC
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"Rise again, rise again - though your heart it be broken, or life about to end.  No matter what you've lost, be it a home, a love, a friend, like the Mary Ellen Carter rise again!"
David McLeod
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« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2012, 12:59:55 PM »

After this season I will not do a trapout on an established colony unless there is no possibility of a cutout.
I lost a good portion of a trapout colony to an abscond swarm this spring when the beetles took over. This was in the very first week of the trapout. The tree went dead as far as activity in a weeks time. When the cone was removed the floor of the cavity was a mass of maggots.
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greenbtree
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« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2012, 09:03:31 AM »

David - EEEWWWW.  Luckily we don't have SHBs here.  I'm going to call the homeowner at the end of this week to get an update.  Thanks all for the info.

JC
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"Rise again, rise again - though your heart it be broken, or life about to end.  No matter what you've lost, be it a home, a love, a friend, like the Mary Ellen Carter rise again!"
G3farms
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« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2012, 09:18:10 AM »

I'm with David on the cut outs if possible, and if not do the trap out in the spring before SHB has a chance to build up. It only takes a couple of days for them to get a foot hold.

Wold have liked to see you ladder contraption thingy!! shocked

Just remember a hive of bees that might not even make it is not worth breaking your neck over, a nuc will be at most $125, a whole lot less that a hospital bill.
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