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Author Topic: How would you get to them?  (Read 1500 times)

Online D Semple

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How would you get to them?
« on: March 19, 2012, 12:37:07 PM »


From the outside, their entrance is about 24' up.

From the inside they are behind the brick Fireplace wall, which can't be damaged.

Would prefer to do a cutout, dealing with a trap out this high up is a pain, and the homeowner wants a 1 year garantee bees won't move back in.

Any ideas?


Thanks    ....Don

Offline sawdstmakr

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2012, 12:55:35 PM »
First of all, I probably wouldn't.
If I did the bill would be pretty high with that request.
My first removal was a 8' brick pillar. That was with the agreement that the home owner was going to hire a brick layer to do all of the repairs. Had to open up the top 12"  on 2 sides of the 30" by 30" column. If I had to do it again I would keep the cement dust down with water and make sure I didn't suck it up with the vacuum. Lost most of the bees that were in the first box that got all of the dust.
Jim
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Offline G3farms

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2012, 02:20:17 PM »
If they are going into the wall where there is a crack between the siding and the brick a trap out might not work anyway, they might find another way back in further up the crack, would need to seal the entire crack except for where the trap cone is at.

I really do  not see doing a cut out, the fireplace would never match back up and the home owners would never be happy with it.

A trap out is what I would try, have the home owners rent or reimburse you for scaffolding rental and leave it in place until the job is complete. Set up your bait hive so that the entrance can be seen from the window and let the home owner give you updates (pics and/or video).

Good luck with it, and remember you can always turn it down, sometimes it pays better if you do  ;)
see my swarms and cut outs at

those hot bees will have you steppin and a fetchin like your heads on fire and your @ss is a catchin!!!

Bees will be bees and do as they please!

Offline AllenF

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2012, 06:16:01 PM »
I know you don't want to destroy the inside wall, but can you remove the mantle?  Or is it mounted on the bricks?   You would never get to them from the backside.   Trap them if you could seal up enough around the sides of the chimney outside.  Or you could but out feeders and swarm traps and catch a few this summer out of this hive.

Offline backyard warrior

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2012, 06:46:36 PM »
you arent a magician and if i were you id tell them that they have to sign here besides u dont know how long its going to take being they dont want anything damaged.  Sometimes you are better off walking away the bees arent worth it. If you decide you must do this job u better charge a premium and i mean a premium to guarantee no bees return u better caulk every crack in the house lol Chris

Offline Robo

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2012, 07:47:02 PM »
Trap out would be the only way I would touch the job..... Good luck
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it comes dressed in overalls and looks like work." - Thomas Edison



Offline iddee

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2012, 08:52:08 PM »
When you read my trapout posts, look twice at reply #19 under "Why do a trapout?"
Specifically the last paragraph.

   
 

""I think I would wait until after swarm season or do a cut out. When scouting these removals, always be ready to turn them down if anything is amiss. I have had many owners change their tune drastically when I turned it down. Many I did under my rules, many I walked away from. Never be hesitant about walking away. They need the service much more than you need the bees.""
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*

Offline prestonpaul

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2012, 10:00:10 PM »
Are they actually in the chimney? what sort of heater is it,  Gas or wood fired? would it be possible to remove it to get to the colony that way? How old is the house? is the chimney attached to the brickwork on the inside fireplace or is it cosmetic to hide the rear heater?
Good luck  :-D
Paul.

Offline Jim 134

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2012, 10:00:47 PM »
When you read my trapout posts, look twice at reply #19 under "Why do a trapout?"
Specifically the last paragraph.

   
 

""I think I would wait until after swarm season or do a cut out. When scouting these removals, always be ready to turn them down if anything is amiss. I have had many owners change their tune drastically when I turned it down. Many I did under my rules, many I walked away from. Never be hesitant about walking away. They need the service much more than you need the bees.""


  X:X X:X X:X



   BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)
"Tell me and I'll forget,show me and I may  remember,involve me and I'll understand"
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"The farmer is the only man in our economy who buys everything at retail, sells everything at wholesale, and pays the freight both ways."
 John F. Kennedy
Franklin County Beekeepers Association MA. http://www.franklinmabeekeepers.org/

Online D Semple

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2012, 10:09:36 PM »
Jim, I agree with you and have priced it very high, Thx. George, good advice having the homeowner watch the hive and give me reports, I hadn’t thought about that, Thx. Allen the mantle is mounted on the brick, good idea though, there is a chance that the fireplace insert was a built in, in which case I may be able to get access to the hive just by pulling the insert out, I’m going to check it out with a bore scope, Thx. Chris & Iddee, I may walk like you suggest, this is a very nice homeowner with 3 little girls who is willing to pay a fair price, so I’m thinking hard about it, no guarantee will be offered. I’ll also wait till after swarm season like you suggest if he still wants me to do the work, Thx.  Robo, trap out it is, unless I find maybe that the fireplace insert was a built in, in which case I may be able to get to the colony by just pulling the insert out, Thx and also thanks for your bee-vac design, I’ve built 2 and love them. Jim, you’re right I don’t need any more bees, I’ve built 40 new hives over the winter but with the weather and all the calls I’m getting I recon I’ll run out of equipment before bees like last year, Thx.

Thanks everybody, great site, I was lost on this one.

Don

Offline G3farms

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2012, 10:17:50 PM »


Envision the outside of the fire place how it tapers in to form the tall chimney.

Even if you wanted to do a cut out by removing some of the siding, I don't think you could physically reach them.

If you look on the outside, the chimney is four bricks wide, now transfer that to the inside.
You can see where the taper is according to the windows.

take your pic and draw on the front of the fire place the outline of the outside.

Just don't think you could reach it.
see my swarms and cut outs at

those hot bees will have you steppin and a fetchin like your heads on fire and your @ss is a catchin!!!

Bees will be bees and do as they please!

Online D Semple

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2012, 10:31:48 PM »
George, I'm not going to try a cutout from the outside, I agree with you.

After studying the same inside photo though today, it looks like the fireplace insert was a built in, in which case I may be able to access the colony from the inside by just pulling the insert out.

Thanks.  ...Don

Offline jaseemtp

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2012, 11:04:24 PM »
That would be the best way is to remove the fireplace insert.  Anything else would be a nightmare.  well even removing the insert wont be fun.  Good luck
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Offline AllenF

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2012, 11:16:56 PM »
But if you remove the insert, the bees may still be in the wall above the fireplace in front of the flue.   

Offline G3farms

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2012, 11:56:58 PM »
I am with the others trap out or walk away.

It is still early in the year and there will be more bees, if not you can always go back to this house :-D
see my swarms and cut outs at

those hot bees will have you steppin and a fetchin like your heads on fire and your @ss is a catchin!!!

Bees will be bees and do as they please!

Online kathyp

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2012, 12:29:19 AM »
and keep in mind with the trap out that if the honey isn't robbed out, there will be mess in the wall.  also, with the wax left behind will that cause a mess later?  the last fireplace i looked at the bees were so close to the chimney i don't know why the whole thing didn't melt anyway.  the bees were between the liner and the brick.

and the guarantee thing is a red flag to me.  i'd walk on this one.  there are plenty more out there.
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline Jim 134

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2012, 06:23:30 AM »
George, I'm not going to try a cutout from the outside, I agree with you.

After studying the same inside photo though today, it looks like the fireplace insert was a built in, in which case I may be able to access the colony from the inside by just pulling the insert out.

Thanks.  ...Don


   If you can access the bees by pulling out the insert the home owe got cracks in the bricks and may be  the liner.Just my $0.02


That would be the best way is to remove the fireplace insert.  Anything else would be a nightmare.  well even removing the insert wont be fun.  Good luck


The insert is a BIG red flag to me.

Why was the insert put in ??? May bee  cracks in the brick work ???







    BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)


« Last Edit: March 20, 2012, 06:42:52 AM by Jim 134 »
"Tell me and I'll forget,show me and I may  remember,involve me and I'll understand"
        Chinese Proverb

"The farmer is the only man in our economy who buys everything at retail, sells everything at wholesale, and pays the freight both ways."
 John F. Kennedy
Franklin County Beekeepers Association MA. http://www.franklinmabeekeepers.org/

Offline lenape13

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2012, 06:59:40 AM »
Run away from this one, fast!  It isn't worth it.  And as for the guarantee, there's no way you can guarantee that.

Online kathyp

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2012, 10:28:18 AM »
jim, the inserts are more efficient that a fireplace alone.  we did one, but with a pellet stove.

thing about them is that they are attached (usually) to a pipe that is run up inside the chimney.  to remove the insert, you have to undo the pipe.  that can be either really easy or really hard.  if the pipe is not properly secured, and you can get it disconnected, it may slip and then you have another issue.  getting it all back together can be a ....problem.

i can't tell from the picture what that insert burns, but if it's gas, then you have another can of worms depending on where you live. 
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Online D Semple

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Re: How would you get to them?
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2012, 11:18:00 AM »
Talked to the homeowner last night the gas insert was added a couple of years after the home was built so the Fireplace and chimney will have a traditional firebox and flu, so there will be no access from below like I was hoping.

I won’t make any guarantee, and I’ll offer to do the trap out (like you'll suggested) in late June, so I can bring in a hive to rob out the existing honey late July/ early August during or summer dearth. May be able to catch a swarm off them in the mean time.

I’m also going to give him the names of two other guys who I think would do the work for a lot less money than I would.
 
Thanks for the help folks, appreciate the good advice.

Don