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Author Topic: Mite drop counts vs. treatment  (Read 5556 times)
amymcg
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« on: August 12, 2005, 08:44:55 AM »

I put the tray in my SBB a few days ago and pulled it this morning.  In just over 48 hours, I have a drop count of between 40-60 total. Should I bother to treat this year?  

This hive has not been treated all year by any means. I've only used an SBB for ventilation and the convenience of monitoring the mite drop occassionally.  

Should I wait a little longer and see what happens in September? I'm not going after a fall flow.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2005, 11:46:04 AM »

>I put the tray in my SBB a few days ago and pulled it this morning. In just over 48 hours, I have a drop count of between 40-60 total. Should I bother to treat this year?

I'd try to come up with a plan.  You could probably wait until October when there is no brood and treat some way.  Or you could do drone trapping now.
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
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amymcg
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« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2005, 02:18:10 PM »

yeah, I don't want to treat with Apistan unless I have to.  I may wait and do Finsky's Oxalic Trickling later in the year.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2005, 03:04:26 PM »

I have not trickled it, but Oxalic acid vapor has been very effective for me.
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
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2rubes
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« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2005, 08:19:35 AM »

Hi, I have been posting in other forums, please check out BeeSource and the link in diseases for powderes sugar   http://www.beesource.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000481;p=1 and our website www.Countryrubes.com for pictures on how we do this.   We had just heard about using powdered sugar to knock down mites last spring and tried it with amazing results.  We normally do not use Apistan in the spring, but this spring we had really infested hives and even bought some Sucrocide to give it a try.  We tried the powdered sugar first and on our most infested hive, we counted over 1400 mites.  
   You do need to use it like Sucrocide, 3 times, 7 to 10 days apart.  We have been careful to use it when there are no honey flows.  We used it in the Spring, in July after we pulled our  berry  honey and before the thistle flow and now after we pulled our honey.  
    This is a wonderful way to knock down mites now,  before the mite population explodes as drone brood decreases.  Now mites will be entering worker brood before its capped and weakening them.   These additional mites entering  decreasing amounts of worker brood can stress the developing bees.  I believe this to be a critical time in mite infestation as this working force is supposed to see the colony throughthe winter.      If you are waiting for fall to  to use Oxalic acid, this is something you can do right now.  Its easier than Sucrocide and doesn't anger the bees.  When you sift the powderes sugar onto the frames, you hear a curious gentle buzz.  People who have drenched their bees with Sucrocide have reported very angry  bees.  
     There are instructions on the above post along with people who have tried it  and we have detailed pictures and explanations on our website.
     Good luck,
     Janet Cheesy  Cheesy
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Janet Brisson
qa33010
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« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2005, 11:37:44 PM »

Hi!

Michael, I can't find anything on vapor.  Maybe I'm looking in the wrong places.  Do you have a link or something I can refer to?  Thanks
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MUHAMMAD JEHAN ZEB
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« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2005, 05:20:40 PM »

huh DEAR MICHEAL,
                           PLEASE COMMENTE HOW MUCH QUANTITY OF OXALYIC ACIDE IS TO BE PUT IN COLONEY,HOW? AND FOR HOW MANY TIME.PLEASE COME ON.
BEST TREGARD
MUHAMMAD JEHAN ZEB
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2005, 07:28:36 PM »

I used the "vent evaporator" on this site:

http://bwrangler.madpage.com/bee/goxa.htm

One capful (of the pipe cap) came to about 1 1/2 grams, if I remember right.  It's what I use for three ten frame mediums (or two deeps).

I've always used it once in the fall after brood rearing ceases.  If you have an emergency and you need to treat before brood rearing ceases you should probably treat once a week for three weeks.
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
MUHAMMAD JEHAN ZEB
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« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2005, 04:41:57 PM »

huh my dear MICHEAL,
                              THAKS ALOOTT FOR THE RESPONCE.PLEASE EITHER CONVEY ME THE DIAGRAM OF THE PIPE YOU ARE USING.WEATHER IT IS HEATED OR THE HEAT FROM SUN IS SUFFICENT.
BEST REGARD
MUHAMMAD JEHAN ZEB
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Finsky
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« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2005, 04:13:52 PM »

Oxalic liguid Metdod is very easy. It must be done during winter when bees do not have brood.

If you have mites much, you can take brood off and after that you give oxalic acid.

You prepare the solution and spray it with vaccination sprayer (large needle) in the gap of frames.

*********

Hive must be without broods. If you have palm size brood area, it may contain 20% of hives mites. (But to do is better than for nothing.)

Take 7,5 gr oxalic acetic powder into 1 dl warm water.
Take 100 gr sugar and dilute it in the solution.

(Euro coin is just 7,5 g. You can weight your coin and you can use as weight. Own balance is easy to do. Our coin weights are in internet.)

This 1,6 dl volume is enough for 3-5 hives, depending of the amount of bees .

Drop 4 ml solution in the gap of frames, which is full of bees from edge to edge.

Do not give for one box hive more than 40 ml, and this only for hive which is totally full of bees.

Do not give for 2 box hive more than 50 ml.

Weather can be cold, so bees are in the winter ball.  +5C is good weather.

DON'T GIVE TWICE HANDLING. It is harmfull.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2005, 08:28:02 PM »

>THAKS ALOOTT FOR THE RESPONCE.PLEASE EITHER CONVEY ME THE DIAGRAM OF THE PIPE YOU ARE USING.

It's on the web site I listed.  I'm using the brass threaded pipe one that is pictured there.

>WEATHER IT IS HEATED OR THE HEAT FROM SUN IS SUFFICENT.

It is heated with a propane torch until the oxalic acid all melts and evaporates.  Heat from the sun is not at all sufficent.
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Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen
AdmiralD
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« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2005, 11:14:17 PM »

2rubes-

I don't know if the Salem Beekeepers have thanked you for coming to the meeting, but I wanted to say "thank you" for coming and  the powered sugar suggestion.

I have poureed the powder sugar over the frames and brushed it between the gaps of the frames....My bees have "decided" that it is a nucences [sp]  that they can live with. They don't seem angry with it at all.

The last time I used the poweded sugar, a lot of bees when outside of the hive and was grooming themselves. Is this the normal behavior that you see after dusting your hives?

The SBB works great and is easy to remove and replace. It's great for finding out the count of verola...Between the two, I am finding less virola in my worst hive. I have given 3 poweded sugar treatement so far.

I even put a mound of powdered sugar at the entrance of the hive to force the foraging bees to get dusted, but that is gone in 10 minuste. Housekeeping bees don't like it there... wink
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Finsky
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« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2005, 12:26:24 AM »

We know here powered sugar method but I do not know anybody here who use it.

But when you use it you should notice that hive must be without brood. Otherwise most of mites are in brood frames.  Here in Finland we have so warm that most of hives still have capped brood and we must wait a month that all bees have emerged.

Just now leaves are dropping from trees in south part of country. In the middle of country trees are pale.
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2rubes
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« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2005, 07:53:00 AM »

Thank you, I really enjoyed coming up to Oregon and will be there again for the NW Fall Beekeeping Conference.
  Turns out, powdered sugar does not harm brood at all.  There has been studies down here http://www.bioone.org/bioone/?request=get-document&issn=0022-0493&volume=097&issue=02&page=0171
and here is a quote from Michael W during a discussion if I should try rye flour on Beesource.com.  (OTC is an antiboitic that  they were mixing with various dusts including powdered sugar).
'In the study they tested without the OTC also to see if the dusts alone would injure the hives. They found that powdered sugar did NOT but many other things did. They defined "mortality" by bees removing larvae. In Ellis's experiement, if adults were removed from the experiment, adult bees wouldn't have been there to remove the larvae. Adult bees may have removed the larvae due to a foreign substance in the cell that was not actually harming the brood. They dusted directly into cells so anything your applying to top bars may or may not end up in cells to a degree to matter.

They made a square on the frame of brood and dusted each dust directly into the cells to see what would happen. There are pictures of this in the study where the bees go back and remove the brood in the area of the square but no where else. The bees did NOT remove brood from the squares dusted with powdered sugar. They said this may be due to the fact that the sugar is very similar to the nectar they are already feeding to the larvae.'
  We have found no damage in any of our hives.  We have done 3 major treatments on all of our hives, and now we have two hives with large mite loads that we are treating with powdered sugar separately.  There is no brood damage, no queen damage and the bees seem very happy with it.  It also seems to increase their hygenic actions, now we see them grooming themselves all of the time on the landing boards, way after we have used powdered sugar.  
   You do have to monitor a lot to know the mite load and if its increasing.  Your larger booming hives will have more mites.    What is amazing is how many the sugar knocks down.  On a very infested hive, the first treatment will yield over 700 mites, and the second treatment a week later showed about 300 mites.  I need to do one more.  
   Our plan of action is to dust all hives in November when the queen stops laying to capture phorectic mites living on the bees (No brood to hide in).
    I have pictures posted on www.countryrubes.com  
    Thanks for your input,
    Janet
     
 Cheesy
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Janet Brisson
Finsky
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« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2005, 10:00:22 AM »

Quote from: 2rubes
  What is amazing is how many the sugar knocks down.  On a very infested hive, the first treatment will yield over 700 mites, and the second treatment a week later showed about 300 mites.  I need to do one more.


In Finland we have tested that powder sugar method and professionals were not satisfied with results. As you write, it needs many handlings. With oxalic acid liquid results are good with one handling. When brood are not any more in the hive, brood does not happen anything.
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