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Author Topic: Bailing out France  (Read 7038 times)
kingbee
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« Reply #60 on: October 16, 2012, 03:42:26 AM »

Here is a sad tail of the consequences of “Government” aid to any industry but especially the auto industry which needs to remain open to new ideas and innovate, innovate, innovate, if they are to stay even with the competition.  Anyone here ever hear of British Leyland, the Rootes Group, Simca, or Sunbeam?  No?  Well here is a primer. 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysler_Sunbeam

Remember that Rootes didn’t need a rescue package from the British Government but since their major competitor, British Leyland drank the Government cool aid, Rootes and British Chrysler wanted in on the feeding frenzy and started downing shots of English Money.  Hey the drinks were free.  The hangover however was lethal. This is one major reason that Chrysler needed a bailout in the form of a loan guarantee in the late 1970s, their investments in European car companies turned to vinegar.   Now Government Motors is proposing to invest in Peugeot to go along with their Opal and Vauxhall brands in Europe.  We have been here before.   Soon GM will follow British Leyland, SAAB, and the Rootes group into oblivion like the Whippet car company or Duisenberg did.  You may as well try to stop the Earth from rotating as to reverse GM’s downward spiral as long as the US Treasury is in GM's board room.

http://europe.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20121015/ANE/310159951/gm-mulls-merging-opel-with-psas-auto-operations-sources-say

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BlueBee
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« Reply #61 on: October 16, 2012, 04:17:33 AM »

Just imagine what could have been if Ronald Reagan had the courage of Barack Obama.  Delorean could have been saved and we might be free of Middle East Oil by now.  Instead we’ve sunk how many trillions into trying to “protect” and control Middle East Oil?

What makes no sense to me, is why our right wing beeks are so anxious to spend trillions protecting middle east oil but are so opposed to INVESTING a plumb nickle into AMERICAN companies trying to eliminate the need for middle east oil in the first place.  Maybe we need to review the definition of an "investment" huh

Are our beeks familiar with Japan's MITI?  Seems Japan is no dummy when it comes to the idea of INVESTING.
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kathyp
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« Reply #62 on: October 16, 2012, 11:13:10 AM »

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What makes no sense to me, is why our right wing beeks are so anxious to spend trillions protecting middle east oil but are so opposed to INVESTING a plumb nickle

define "investing" please.  also, show me in the constitution where investing is the job of the government?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
kingbee
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« Reply #63 on: October 16, 2012, 12:15:33 PM »

What WORIES me is why our Left Wing Beeks want to abandon, denigrate, and ban every form of reliable and available Energy known to man.  I'm speaking about everything from coal, to coal gas, to petroleum, to liquefied petroleum gas, to natural gas, to hydroelectric, to nuclear energy.

Once the Hippy Dippy Generation has realized their 50 years dream of becoming one with nature by baning all combustive, hydro, and atomic energy, what then do they propose to do?  What do you think, they plan on sitting cross legged around a roaring camp fire, tilting at wind mills, and beating their bongo drums.   rolleyes  rolleyes  rolleyes

The only trouble is that most of them now will need corrective surgery if they sit cross legged.  grin

The thing that really queered the DeLorean deal was a leftist group called the Irish Republican Army, they burned the factory down.  Now hold on BlueBee, this isn't the same Republicans you are always running down.  These Republicans burned down the DeLorean factory because like Leftist everywhere they were afraid that a Presbyterian or two might get a job building another one of those English Government Motors automobiles, only this time in Northern Ireland instead of Scotsland.  

My leftist beek friends are all for every one paying their fair share, as long as my leftist beek friends are the only ones who decide what that fair share is.  Unfortunately our Leftist beek friends are the very ones who drive the need for ever higher and higher gooberment revenues with their Socialist pie in your eye Fascist industrial schemes like DeLorean and Government Motors.  Oh well, life's unfair and then you die.  

The real problem leftist have with understanding the free market is that most leftist start out looking at societies problems from the view point of a thief and therefore they think everyone around them is also a thief.  

It would be much better if our Leftist beek friends would stick to playing drinking games on Bastille Day and singing the Internationale off key.  But not like this.
THE INTERNATIONALE (in Russian)

« Last Edit: October 16, 2012, 03:24:45 PM by kingbee » Logged
kathyp
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« Reply #64 on: October 16, 2012, 12:38:58 PM »

maybe this is an investment?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-16/electric-car-battery-maker-a123-systems-files-bankruptcy.html?cmpid=yhoo
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #65 on: October 16, 2012, 02:19:56 PM »

 

The real problem leftist have with understanding the free market is that most leftist start out looking at societies problems from the view point of a thief and therefore they think everyone around them is also a thief.  





Way, way over the top and out of line.




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kathyp
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« Reply #66 on: October 16, 2012, 03:08:50 PM »

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Way, way over the top and out of line.


not sure how you figure that.  leftists want to take what others have earned and spend it as they see fit.  they wish to "invest' it, give it away, and waste it.  taking what is not yours is the definition of theft, is it not?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
kingbee
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« Reply #67 on: October 16, 2012, 04:15:11 PM »

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/oct/16/pruden-betrayal-in-benghazi-libya-as-clear-as-a-so/

If you wish to see over the top then perhaps here it is a little glimpse.  Unfortunately Pruden’s words are much too real and too true to be over the top of anyones head, any where but in the White House.
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JPBEEGETTER
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« Reply #68 on: October 19, 2012, 05:13:05 PM »

about bailing out France--- If you are talking about bailing out Bill France (NASCAR) his family has all the money they need, as far as bailing out the Country of France   I  VOTE NO    like they would ever help us again ,should have let Hitler have them aaaaaall the way then mop up the CRAP.
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kingbee
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« Reply #69 on: October 19, 2012, 11:30:41 PM »

...
Mystery solved:  It’s called high compression diesel + SMALL body.

Note:  diesels get the 50 to 60mpg while the gasoline versions of these matchbox cars only get 30mpg....

For various reasons... including ...emissions from diesels, they have not gained wide spread acceptance here...

Uh... how high of a compression ratio can you achieve with a diesel engine?

Yes, there were high milage diesel versions of these cars as far back as the 1970s.  Some of them got OVER 60mpg.  One thing keeping them off the road here is OSHA, NHTSB, and other nanny state administrations and safety boards all trying to help us but none of them doing anything helpful.
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BlueBee
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« Reply #70 on: October 19, 2012, 11:47:12 PM »

That and the fact that diesel particulate emissions are a KNOWN carcinogen.   http://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancercauses/othercarcinogens/pollution/diesel-exhaust

Do you think “nanny state admins” should just let people wash their hands in benzene and play with asbestos?  I guess since the geniuses who wrote the constitution over 200 years ago didn’t specifically address diesel emissions, we shouldn’t have any governmental oversight to protect our children from such things?  Oh wait, Rudolf Diesel wasn’t even born until 1858, in France no less  shocked   
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kingbee
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« Reply #71 on: October 20, 2012, 01:07:39 AM »

Yes Old Rudolph was birthed in France, at lest HE had a birth certificate.  Unlike some people I could mention.  But true to his promise our President is turning back the clock to those thrilling days in the last decade of the 19th Century when the fuel of choice for internal combustion diesel engines was not diesel fuel or even vegtable oil, but coal dust. 

Naturally the French who more than any other government knows how to turn a profit off of other peoples' blood, sweat, and tears (ask the inmates on Devils Island) asked Rudolph Diesel to design a version of his engine that ran on peanut oil.  The French Empire of the day had large land holdings in Africa, called Colonies.  On this side of the Atlantic they are sometimes called plantations and these French Colonies were ideal for the cultivation of ground nuts called goobers or peanuts by you and me.  France fully intended for their captive African subjects to grow peanut oil to grease the skids for the launch of a new French Industrial Revolution. 
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BlueBee
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« Reply #72 on: October 20, 2012, 09:39:20 AM »



You know……..when our right wing beeks deny the obvious FACTS, it kind of blows their creditability on everything else too  police

All I have to show that I was born in Michigan is a similar piece of paper.  Are you saying that is probably a fake too?  My mother doesn’t even have a birth certificate.  They didn’t routinely create them in the area of Ohio where she was born.   
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buzzbee
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« Reply #73 on: October 20, 2012, 11:28:26 AM »

Not that I would doubt an image from the Huffington Post which would tow any line this administration put out there. Funny it took till 2011 for this to show up?
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kathyp
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« Reply #74 on: October 20, 2012, 12:22:22 PM »

not to do the whole birther thing again, but that certificate of live birth is worthless as proof of birth place.  and i know we have gone over this before, so no point in doing it again.  you can look up HI law at the time for yourself.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
kingbee
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« Reply #75 on: October 21, 2012, 05:20:22 PM »

 grin grin I can't help but smile when I saw the birth place of the President's mother.  It makes me think of Dorthy from Kansas in the Wizard of Oz, and that flick makes me think of flying monkeys.  

The flying monkeys from "Oz the Wizard of" in turn mades me think of the Obama grant for almost a million Dollars to fund the musical, "The Great Immensity" in,... YES you guessed it... in Kansas City... Its a play about Global warming and one reviewer paned the play by describing it as, "A Wikipedia entry set to music" but hey, Barry's Mommy would be proud because the Kansas City audience was able to experience Kansas ‘flying' monkey poop.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2012, 02:00:09 PM by kingbee » Logged
kingbee
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« Reply #76 on: October 22, 2012, 06:25:51 PM »

...
Isn’t this the latest and greatest French Automotive Technology?  A car that runs on hot air
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6138972/ns/us_news-environment/t/car-runs-compressed-air-will-it-sell/



Gee, I keep seeing pictures of cute wee little cracker box automobiles posted on this forum.  That puts me in mind of the Volks Waggon or folks wagon a peoples car that first appeared in Germany during the late 30s.

There were many “peoples” cars designed, built, and sold, in almost every country prior to 2008.  I am mostly thinking about cars like the Model T Ford, The Henry J, or the Plymouth.  What makes the VW  unique is that it was the first mass produced car designed at the request of and first built on the orders of a Fascist dictator to implement National Industrial Policy, a 5 Year Plan, or Great Leap Forward, call it what you will.  However only 630 original VW Beetles were produced before WW2 forced the factory to convert to making war material, making the original VW one of the rarest cars on Earth.

We are now being regaled by the press with glossy photos of cute little cracker box cars and Electric or Electric-Fuel (Hybrid) automobiles.  So here is one of the other famous, if not successful peoples cars. This car was designed and built either by, or on the orders of a National Industrial Policy Board or other political origination.   In other words by a “tickle down command economy, the one in former Communist East Germany.

I have a warm place in my heart for the East German Trablat.  This car was the first and only real sustainable and green automobile.  Its hood was made from cardboard, the rest of the body panels were constructed from a milage of fiberglass fibers, wool, compressed cotton, wood pulp, recycled paper, and likely any thing else left laying around.   There is a famous picture of a man awkwardly leaning on a Trablat with his hand on the windshield cowling.  The reason he did not place his hand on the hood was because his hand may have broken through the hood.

Even with its high recycled content, the Trablat without a doubt is the most eco-unfriendly automobile in history. 
Trabant 601 exhaust


First it had a two cycle engine that smoked like an incense burner.  If the wind was right, you could smell a Trablat coming before you could either see or hear it.  As a nod to German engineering the Trablat’s engine pumped out a screaming 18 horse power.  The fuel tank was located above and behind the hot running engine (just in front of the passenger seat)  like on a lawnmower.  This was because the Trablat didn’t have a fuel pump and fuel was delivered to the carburetor via gravity.  There was just not enough excess horse power produced by its engine to deliver enough gas to the engine to pull away from the curb.

The Trablat was so wildly popular in East Germany that there was an Eighteen year wait before you were allowed to buy one.  It also came without many options that you and I take for granted, a fuel gauge, or turn and stop signals among them.  One reason for the missing signals lights was because after most East Germans had endured the 18 year wait to get their liver spotted hands on a Trablat, they never hit the breaks or turned but made a straight bee line for the nearest border where they could escape the Workers’ Paradise of East Germany without being shot in the process.  On the up side it was a snap to recycle a Trablat, goats regularly ate the exterior body panels.

There we have a short history of the worlds most famous and long running… well no not long running, most pitiful running peoples car.  Move over Trablat, and say hello to the Chevy Volt.

cranking Trabant

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BlueBee
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« Reply #77 on: October 23, 2012, 01:26:57 AM »

Those are some good videos Kingbee.  If it weren’t for the EPA and CAFÉ regulations, we would probably have these things all over our highways too.  You get more power per weight from a 2 cycle engine and hence you can get faster and lighter cars and trucks.  The downside is the emissions are horrible and the fuel economy is bad.

BTW…. I would not recommend driving a Trablat over the Mackinaw Bridge!  There are urban legends of Yugos being blown right off the bridge.
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kingbee
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« Reply #78 on: October 23, 2012, 12:11:19 PM »

... I would not recommend driving a Trablat over the Mackinaw Bridge!  There are urban legends of Yugos being blown right off the bridge.

I wouldn't drive one in the rain either, it might dissolve. tongue
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sterling
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« Reply #79 on: October 23, 2012, 08:33:35 PM »

Boy, grin it would be tough pulling my boat with one them things.
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