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Author Topic: Monsanto #2  (Read 4309 times)

Offline luvin honey

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2012, 02:06:09 PM »
I'm headed to an Organic Farming Conference--no Cheetos or soda there! It is really awesome food, but I still enjoy a good ol' bag of Culver's onion rings from time to time :)
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Offline T Beek

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #41 on: February 17, 2012, 03:48:10 PM »
Cool Luvin honey.  Is that the MOSES conference held near LaCrosse?  My wife and used to attend nearly every year during the mid 80's to late 90's, before the Government got too involved in deciding what organic meant  :-D . 

Now we just call our produce 'homegrown' and if anyone asks we gladly tell them what we do and don't do to our soil  ;) .

t
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Offline luvin honey

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #42 on: February 17, 2012, 03:50:58 PM »
That's the one!
The pedigree of honey
Does not concern the bee;
A clover, any time, to him
Is aristocracy.
---Emily Dickinson

Offline kingbee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #43 on: February 17, 2012, 07:32:28 PM »
... Monsanto has done everything possible to block passage of any laws requiring the labeling of GMO's in our food supply...

I have gone on record before advocating that organic food self identify itself in a positive manner as in, "Yes, this food is organic."  But some want to force producers of regular food to wear a Star of David, similar to what the Nazis used to idenify or seperate the Jews of Europe.  I would also oppose any labeling of a negative nature such as, "This package contains NO GMOs."  Your rights to know end where my or anyone else's right to privacy begins.  End of story.   

Offline windfall

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #44 on: February 17, 2012, 08:02:39 PM »
If you are selling a consumable product to the public, you have no right to privacy in regards to that product.

Offline kingbee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #45 on: February 17, 2012, 08:48:29 PM »
... like growth hormones in beef or milk, it will take years for some to see the impact. I guess if someone likes fully developed 7 year olds, able to carry their baby to term, you probably have no problems with growth hormones...

Look at the facts.  In Europe the use of rGBH in the production of dairy products is strictly forbidden.  Yet today European girls are reaching puberty at roughly the same early age that girls in the USA are.  The ability to carry a child to term or the age at which a young girl reaches puberty is highly dependant on the amount of fat that girl has stored in her body.

Don't accept my humble word for it.  Look at the examples of female Olympic gymnast.  To these young women reaching puberty by 16 or 17 or maybe even before age 20 is a major disaster and a career killer, and there is hardly a gram of fat on their bodies.  The prepubescent teenager Nadia Comanich of Romania in the 1976 youtube link is just one example.
http://gymnastics.teamusa.org/news/article/4431
Nadia comaneci-first perfect ten in history (1976 Montreal)

The good thing in all of this is that we both are being forced to think.   Think about it!!!
 

Offline kingbee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #46 on: February 17, 2012, 09:08:45 PM »
If you are selling a consumable product to the public, you have no right to privacy in regards to that product.

Tell it to the Coca-Cola Company, their secret formula goes back to 1886.  Maybe you just want to know what Colonel Sanders 11 secret herbs and spices are, well you're out of luck.  There is hardly any ready to eat food that has a comprehensive list of ingredients.

On the other hand, products like Round Up that enjoy patten protection from the US government are forced to list all of its ingredients along with the formula.  Help me out here.   

Offline luvin honey

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #47 on: February 17, 2012, 09:24:55 PM »
... Monsanto has done everything possible to block passage of any laws requiring the labeling of GMO's in our food supply...

I have gone on record before advocating that organic food self identify itself in a positive manner as in, "Yes, this food is organic."  But some want to force producers of regular food to wear a Star of David, similar to what the Nazis used to idenify or seperate the Jews of Europe.  I would also oppose any labeling of a negative nature such as, "This package contains NO GMOs."  Your rights to know end where my or anyone else's right to privacy begins.  End of story.    
Well, kingbee, I'm not invading your privacy. If I asked you personal questions about your life, I would be trying to invade your privacy. Knowing what I eat has nothing to do with your privacy.

When I am selling a product, I have no feeling whatsoever that I have a right to privacy in how that product was grown, processed, cleaned and sold. In fact, I consider that concept absolutely crazy. If someone is about to put my product on their skin or in their body, they have THE right to know all about it. I realize I will lose some customers that way and gain others. Doesn't matter. It's a matter of honesty and trust.

Monsanto doesn't want things labeled because it knows consumers are cautious about GMO and wouldn't buy the products. It would destroy their business, as nearly everything we eat now is from GMO ag.

Our entire food system is built on so many atrocities (see McD's decision to stop using "pink slime" in its burgers) that we absolutely cannot know about them, or we will stop buying that food.

I'm not in organic to make big bucks. I'm in it because I believe in it, because I wouldn't feed my family any other way. I don't need to work hard to convert people, as they're already on a waiting list for my veggie CSA, without me saying a single word to them.

Even though the RoundUp formula is listed, it was patent protected for a certain amount of time, then the patent came off and that product is up for grabs in the general market, now known as glyphosate. People were not allowed to duplicate it during the patented time.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2012, 10:17:42 AM by luvin honey »
The pedigree of honey
Does not concern the bee;
A clover, any time, to him
Is aristocracy.
---Emily Dickinson

Offline T Beek

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #48 on: February 18, 2012, 09:32:42 AM »
 X:X X:X

C'mon Spring.  We got the fever bad around here :lau:

t
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Offline BjornBee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #49 on: February 18, 2012, 10:03:13 AM »
 :lau:

If I was to use Nadia as an example in my own argument, you would be all over me.

I hardly think giving steroids to a young girl, and her being on a 14 hour a day training regiment, hardly qualifies for basis of comparisons of fat levels, or development in regards to other girls. We know stress and rigorous training delays development in young girls. Hardly a model to compare to the development of other girls who have growth hormones and are far less, if any, being pushed 14 hours  day in workouts or training for the Olympics in specialized schools with all day long programs.

Your justifications and "proof" are funny to say the least.
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Offline SEEYA

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #50 on: February 18, 2012, 10:47:29 AM »
>>If you are selling a consumable product to the public, you have no right to privacy in regards to that product.
 X:X  X:X  X:X

>>End of story.
Live long and prosper!

Offline kingbee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #51 on: February 20, 2012, 03:15:16 AM »
... If I was to use Nadia as an example in my own argument, you would be all over me...

I would not, you give me to much credit BjornBee.  Besides this is a credible scientific fact that is accepted by scientist and medical professionals everywhere.

... I hardly think ... a young girl... being on a 14 hour a day training regiment... qualifies for basis of comparisons of fat levels... in regards to other girls...  We know stress and rigorous training delays development in young girls...

So are you saying that because Nadia burned through calories at a fearful rate and because she only ate enough to train, making her almost anorexic, that being anorexic like does not delay puberty?  You can't have it both ways.  If a 14 year old Nadie living in Rumania is anorexic like and prepubescent at the same time, then why is not a 14 year old girl in the USA who is over weight and postpubesecent by age ten not a proper basis for comparison?  Me thinks that you are arguing for the sake of argument. 

Anyway any medical professional with the respect of his or her fellow medical professionals will tell you that the amount of food that the body of a young girl perceives to be available to her (stored as fat) is a major reason that girl enters puberty.  The amount of harmones she ingests from dairy products (either organic or none organic) is a very, very, very, small and tiny part of the reason.  Its a little like stimulating brood production in our bees.  When the queen perceives a flow in progress she increases egg laying activity.

Offline T Beek

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #52 on: February 20, 2012, 08:25:36 AM »
Quote from KingBee to Bjorn Bee:  "me thinks you are aguing for the sake of arguing" 

There's an abundance of that around here.

t
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Offline BjornBee

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Re: Monsanto #2
« Reply #53 on: February 20, 2012, 08:42:08 AM »
I am not talking in circles. I honestly can't even really imagine what hormone or steroids she may of been on. There are many. I do know that stressfull regimented workouts, delay puberty in situations as seen with Olympic training facilities of 30-40 years ago. Using Nadia, for any justifications, is a poor choice.

But the point is, you keep bringing "proof" such in Nadia, and GMO experts Penn & Teller, to support your positions, even though others have clearly asked for more than your usual rhetoric and weak positions. You talk in circles, try make rationalizations that do not add up, and for the most part, surprises me in what you think.

Like....suggesting every food product and chemical is fully tested by the EPA, USDA, or other government agency. I guess your belief is that rubber stamped "purchased" chemical approvals as seen with clothianidin that we are all aware of, is part of that oversight.

Then your statement that Monsanto does not want to control the food industry, and passing it off as "opinion" is icing on the cake. Biotechs, hand held devices, cars, whatever the product, I don't know too many businesses who don't want to be number one or have a dominate position in the market. That don't want to dominate the market. That don't want to make as much as they can. Monsanto wants everyone to use their products...period! And they have some rather clear ways of ensuring farmers do use them. I guess in your mind multi-billion dollar international biotech companies have no marketing plan, no lobbyists, and lack political clout either. They are just good hearted folks. :roll:

Lastly, although I could go on much longer, your claim that all these patents will be open to the public, shows great problems with your positions. On this forum is another thread on this subject.
http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,30918.0.html
It details Monsantos willingness to first try to delay, then probably buy another 20 years, and lastly, just changing the profile of their patents, and releasing another version, keeping the process going. You think they don't have the ability to design another GMO crop with "assassin" capabilities making the first release ineffective? Especially when they know the winds will carry the pollen onto every farm as they already demonstrated. I will not call you gullible. but I will suggest you sound a bit close to shareholder or paid spokesman for the company.

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