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Author Topic: first extraction... pics added  (Read 3436 times)
Harpo
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« on: January 03, 2012, 07:14:24 AM »

Hi all, need some advice to get me through my first extraction...

I have 10 deep frame doubles with an excluder inbetween, had a look and every frame is capped and ready to go...

My question is, as I remove them for extracting do I replace them with frames of fresh foundation as I go OR do I spin out my honey and return them to the super wet?  huh

I heard the best way to get frames with comb ready for storage is to let the bees clean them...

HHmmm, could I make a triple or would that be pushing them too hard???

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated!!!
« Last Edit: January 08, 2012, 07:10:16 AM by Harpo » Logged
the-ecohouse.com
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« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2012, 07:37:26 AM »

depends on how many frames you have i guess?

if you have a few then

I would just put fresh foundation in....
spin the honey out of the capped frame then and then reopen and swap out any undrawn foundation for the stickys.
they shouldn't draw much in one-two days.

plus by putting the old ones back you will prob get a second honey crop. because they dont have to waste all of that energy making wax from the start.

I'm not a fan of letting bees "clean" out our frames it tends to encourage robbing/ spreading of disease etc. only my opinion..

best of luck
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Harpo
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« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2012, 07:50:22 AM »

Cheers for that...

I wasn't going to leave the stickys in the open - I was going to box them and put them on top of the excluder thinking they'd clean then up and then start filling them again???

I have enough frames and foundation but like you said I'd like another lot of honey...
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the-ecohouse.com
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« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2012, 08:06:34 AM »

nice  Smiley yeah i wasn't sure what you meant.
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sawdstmakr
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« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2012, 08:12:13 AM »

I pull the frames, extract the honey and then put them back. The bees will clean them up and start filling them back up if you still have a flow on.
Jim
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Harpo
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« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2012, 05:57:50 PM »

Thanks for that Jim... I'll do that...

once I get enough nerve to go in and pull them  Wink
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AllenF
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« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2012, 07:15:24 PM »

Nerve?    Why do you need the nerve if you have bees?
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sawdstmakr
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« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2012, 11:01:24 PM »

Thanks for that Jim... I'll do that...

once I get enough nerve to go in and pull them  Wink

Get a bottle of Bee Quick. Spray it on a piece of card board the size of the super, light coat. Put it on top of the hive, sprayed side down. Leave it there for 3 to 5 minutes. Remove the super and if you only have one super, put the card board on a flat surface, sprayed side up, add a touch of spray and put the super on top of it. Place a cover on the super, up side town, at an angle to allow the remaining bees to escape. When I do it this way, I have very few bees flying and they remain very calm.
All movements should be slow and controlled. I have found that the bee that are agitated are the ones that Cgot rolled/brushed or were next to bees that were injured/stressed. Gloves cause a lot of the problems because you end up injuring a lot of bees. Good luck.
Jim
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Lone
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« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2012, 03:30:53 AM »

Hello Harpo,

That first extraction will be very exciting, almost as much fun as your first cutout.  Did you extract today?  If so, tell us about it.  If not yet, then I can give you some from-experience hints. 

First of all, like with many things, it's better to be conservative till you build up a bit more experience and see how things will go.  Unless you are sure they are on a tremendous honey flow and the hive numbers are decent, it won't hurt to leave a couple of honey frames in there.  You can always take them out and extract later when you are sure they are still bringing in honey.  You can freeze them then and extract when you have another Extraction Day.

Same with making a triple-decker.  If you are going to extract right now, there is no reason to add another super.  You are giving them twice as much work and more space than they need.  The only benefit would be if you broke your extractor turning arm and couldn't extract for 6 weeks.  Another super would give them enough space to put the honey in.

The answer to your question is very simple: they definitely prefer the drawn out and extracted stickies to plain foundation.  You do risk an abscond if you put in a whole super of plain foundation I've heard.  The reasons you might put in plain foundation are: you are short on drawn comb and if they are on a flow might draw it out quickly; or for a swarm etc.  I did put in 8 of 10 plain foundations about a month ago when I was converting from wax to plastic, and because they were on a flow and had good numbers, they mostly drew it out in a week.  The newer split we put on 10 plain frames, more of a risk, but it helped being on a flow.  You can do a combination, and keep a few stickies in the freezer for emergencies (no need to clean them up first if you have freezer space).  So yes, you can just take the stickies and plonk them back.  (Yes, Allen, you need nerve there if you have a mad hive like I once had.  As the stickies approached them, they defied the laws of gravity and bombed me upwards from the depths).  I think Eco is talking about if you live a long way from your hives and can't return the stickies the same or next day. 

I had to look at the map to see where you are.  I see it's near Mudgee.  I know and know of quite a few beekeepers at Mudgee, so it must be a real good area.  You should be right whatever you decide to do.  I rode my bike up Queens Pinch Rd, and down again to get my gears fixed, then up again.  I was given a bum steer and ended on a road they told me there's never been a bike rider on.  To make it interesting, I went to places Henry Lawson wrote about or lived at, which are many there, such as Sofala, and Ilford, the scene of the man who went mad in the bush and kept trying to build a house for his dead wife (The House That Was Never Built).  Someone gave me 6 peaches from a roadside stall near Ilford, which probably kept me alive for the hardest 3 days of my life on the road from Hill End to Orange.  At every crest I had to take the gear off the bike, walk the bike up and go back for the panniers.  Then the dog decided 4 o'clock was late enough and laid down firmly in the mud.  What a brilliant companion.  There at the side of the road were the most beautiful rock pools we both cooled off in.  To make a long story short, hill end is NOT the end of the hills.

Lone
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Harpo
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« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2012, 08:48:36 AM »

Well, it's been stinking hot and humid here - perfect extraction weather as they say ot's best to do it when you're most uncomfortable  Smiley
I dawdled and then cleaned my extractor and bucket then decided to go shopping for a plastic container which I could put the full frames in once I got the bees off them... will screw 2 bits of wood on either end so they can just hang suspended...then the weather turned, temp dropped and wind picked up... we had huge storm cell move through which gave us a spectacular light show and cooled everything off.
My hives are about 150m from the back door and thankfully my hubby has built a beautiful bridge so I don't have to stumble up and down the gully we have... that's why I was a tad nervous...covering that distance with agitated bees in tow - the box should sort that.Have also been contemplating dragging out my hubby's compressor to blow the bees off - have read to blow downwards so they fall on ground infront of entrance.... my dad said I'd blow their wings off?Huh I wouldn't have blasted them  rolleyes I'm apprehensive about using the BEE GONE - heard that some bees won't forgive you for using it and abscond forever???
The hive I'll atack is no.1 - the 10 frame super is fully capped and looks chocka block - pulling it out for a peek a few bees got rolled and covered in honey  embarassed as the got squished into the cappings - there is very little room between them.
How much honey do you think would be there???
I'm going to bottle some and then put the rest towards making mead HIC  grin
Hillend to Orange - I'm darn impressed Lone!!! It certainly is beautiful - could never go back to Sydney!!!
Am planing on doing up a super for my 8 frame hive tomorrow and then as soon as the weather permits will charge in and get it over and done with  - my hubby takes photos (from afar) and I'll definately take some pics of the frames and final product  grin
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the-ecohouse.com
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« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2012, 09:22:07 AM »

Hey Harpo

have you thought about using a bee escape? they are about $20 and they will clear 99% of the bees with no fuss at all.

otherwise you want to shake all those bees off before you drag them up to the house.

if you have 10 frame deeps and they are ALL chock a block expect anywhere between 25-30kg of the good stuff.

look forward to the pictures.
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Birdswood
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« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2012, 04:59:18 PM »

Hey Harpo, I agree with Eco, a bee escape will get rid of the great majority of the bees in the super and they won't "hold it against you".  grin
Just remember not to leave the escape board on for too long as the little critters do figure out the way back.

Leigh
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sawdstmakr
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« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2012, 08:02:25 PM »

Hey Harpo, I agree with Eco, a bee escape will get rid of the great majority of the bees in the super and they won't "hold it against you".  grin
Just remember not to leave the escape board on for too long as the little critters do figure out the way back.

Leigh

I built and tried a couple of bee escapes. The problem with them is that you have to put them on from 24 to 48 hours prior to pulling the supers and then there are still a lot of bees left on the frames. A whole lot more than after you use the Bee Quick. Only the field bees leave the super. You also have to be able to extract the honey  because the SHB have had full access to the super for a couple of days with no protection.
After using the bee quick as described below, I take the supers right into the house for extraction. Usually there are only 4 or 5 bees left in the whole stack.
Try it both ways, see what works best for you.
Jim
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iddee
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« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2012, 10:42:48 PM »

Beequick IS NOT Bee gone. Beequick smells good and dissipates quick. 
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Lone
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« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2012, 10:03:05 AM »

Hello Harpo,

Thanks for the updates! 
Quote
pulling it out for a peek a few bees got rolled and covered in honey  embarassed as the got squished into the cappings - there is very little room between them.

Some people only put 9 frames in a 10 frame super, which also allows the comb to be built out proud and easier to uncap.  With 10 frames, put them close together.  Resting the hive tool on the side of the box, gently push with the end of the hive tool the top part of the end frame so they are quite tight.  Repeat on the other side.  You should be left with a gap at the end. The next time you open the box, you will be able to crack that 10th frame towards the wall more easily and remove it.  Once it is removed, you can crack apart and move the frames along into the gap until you have space to pull the one you want and avoid rolling bees.

Quote
How much honey do you think would be there???

Maybe something like 2kg a frame, I'm not sure.  You could weigh one.

I'm not sure what a bee escape is, so I just shake the majority of bees off and use the bee brush or smoker for the persistent ones, and a nudge for the stubborn couple at the end, and then put them in a box with a lid so more don't start buzzing round.

Quote
Hillend to Orange - I'm darn impressed Lone!!! It certainly is beautiful - could never go back to Sydney!!!

It nearly killed me  Smiley

Lone
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Harpo
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« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2012, 07:26:35 PM »

Thanks for the tips Lone....

I'll be doing the big shake and then smoking as my bee brush hasn't arrived DOH!!!

The weather is ideal today so I'll get into it around 2 this arvo...

Have everything prepped including my 4yr old son who's disgnated himself "extractor man"  grin

Will move it all into the kitchen ( my domain ) and lay newspaper on the floor.

How long should I let the honey sit in the extractor to reduce bubbles??? I figure I'm still going to get some when I run it through my double strainer into my 25L bucket with valve???

OH! do you also crush the capping before you put them in the capping bag for spinning?
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bernsad
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« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2012, 07:59:54 PM »

Most likely you won't be able to leave it in the extractor, it will start to fill up the bottom and then foul the baskets as you spin, making it progressively harder to operate. You will need to keep running off the honey into a bucket as you go, the bubbles can seperate out over the next couple of days. You might just need to watch how quickly the honey flows through the double strainer also, once you get a few bits of wax and other detritus caught in the strainer the honey takes longer to flow through and can run over the top if you are really going great guns.

I imagine you'd have to break up the cappings a bit so the honey can move through it as you spin them.

Good luck with your first extraction and don't be surprised at how long it takes, I didn't realise it would take me a few hours at a time.
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Harpo
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« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2012, 12:22:38 AM »

Well I did an extraction today - NOT the one I was aiming for though  embarassed

I suspected a honey flow was on and did up a super for my 8 frame hive... knew I waqs in trouble when I couldn't get the lid off!!!

shocked all 8 frames where extended from the top bar to the roof and chock full of honey... that will teach me for dawdling and underestimating the work ethic of my bees  tongue

It was a nightmare trying to clean that up but much was learnt!!! I put the combs in a capping bag and have it suspended it - looks like there will be over 2kgs of yellow.

I threw an excluder on, added the super and bolted... talk about trial by fire...

Has helped me prepare to pull the 10 framer - the weather has turned but I have all my stuff ready to go..
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Harpo
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« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2012, 06:30:48 AM »



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SO GRATIFYING!!!!  grin

Well I pulled all 10 frames, de-bee'd them with a horsehair paint brush I borrowed from my hubby ( my bee brush hasn't arrived yet ) and lots of smoker work.... the tub we screwed rails in worked a treat until I went to move it! I had to drag it over to the bridge with bees in tow and then bolt to get the wheel barrow... definately easier...

I parked it in the sun room and had about 20 bees come along for the ride but they were no bother. I started de-capping with a hot knife but it looked like I was butchering the honeycomb so I swapped to the scratcher and found it easier, more precise and faster??? Loading 2 at a time my 4 year old made himself "spinner" man and went great guns till he ran out of puff - I think we underspun the first 2 pairs as our 3rd produced as much as the previous 2??? All up we were at it for 3 hours... then I had to reload the tub and return the stickies to the super... while out there I checked my brood box and it's looking fab - most frames with 90% capped brood! WHOOP WHOOP!!!  

After spinning the cappings we got about 22 litres of yellow gold  grin

I'm loving this journey and all the advice and encouragement you've offered has been invaluable  Kiss
« Last Edit: January 08, 2012, 07:06:01 AM by Harpo » Logged
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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2012, 07:43:28 AM »

Glad to hear it went well. Smiley
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