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Author Topic: Fire Departments Watching Houses Burn!  (Read 2838 times)
hankdog1
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« on: December 07, 2011, 04:00:27 PM »

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/07/9272989-firefighters-let-home-burn-over-75-fee-again

Ya know I can't for the life of me figure out how anyone can be so heartless over 75 bucks.  What the heck is going on in TN?  TSA strike teams cruzing the highways and firefighters watching houses burn.  Man alive next time I'm down that way I sure hope I don't slip up and drink the water.  Ya know the sad thing about this is how the heck folks that put laws on the books like this get re elected. 
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AllenF
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« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2011, 04:41:10 PM »

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,30152.0.html

Same thing happened a year ago.

Better pay for protection.
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kathyp
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« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2011, 04:53:43 PM »

i thought you liked the idea of choice?  you'd rather be forced to pay for protection?  this might prove that people, left to their own, don't make good choices.  might be an argument for more government?

we are taxed to cover these services.  we pay even if we don't want to.  these people decided not to pay and took a chance......
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
AllenF
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« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2011, 05:53:03 PM »

If they put the fire out, then next year nobody would pay the $75 and the fire department would be broke and would have to walk to the next fire toting a bucket if water by hand.
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Scadsobees
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« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2011, 06:38:51 PM »

I pay my taxes, so the FD will come out and put out the fire.  But if I don't pay my insurance bill, I will have lost my house and possessions. This is just fire insurance. The FD protects their city, paid by taxes, but everybody else has to pay somehow too.

Hard cold truth.  Hurts, but those people have to pay or lose.  Like they said "we didn't pay because we didn't figure we'd have a fire".
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Rick
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« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2011, 06:17:53 AM »

We should expect to see more of this as our Country continues to digress and our people become more divided.

thomas
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VolunteerK9
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« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2011, 08:33:56 AM »

At least they have an option for fire protection/response. The county I reside in has an all volunteer force. So, technically, no one even has to show up. I dont like paying for my heath insurance either, but I do. Cant afford not to. By not paying the fee, it sounds to me like your safety and all your possessions arent worth it. I'm going out on a limb here, but I would dare say that 'IF' someones life was endangered it wouldnt have mattered about the $75.
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Intheswamp
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« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2011, 12:35:01 PM »

Those reports are sad.  We have volunteer fire departments down here, but they normally break their necks trying to get to the fire quickly.  Sometimes more than one department will respond if it's close to being an overlapping area.  They take donations and get some grants.  They buy surplus equipment and most all of them have some fairly nice departments...and we are a poor county in a state that is not wealthy and most where most school districts are at poverty level.  But, we haven't had a fire department stand there and watch someone's house and possessions burn without attempting to put the fire out...if they did I think they would find that the world can be a lonely, cold place, but I seriously doubt they'll ever have a reason to find that out.

If a department accepts government grants, access to surplus government equipment, or accepts public donations as a non-profit organization I would think they would have to respond to any emergency situation regardless whether someone paid a specific "fee" or not.

I'm happy to live in the area that I do and I'm thankfull to, and proud of, the guys and gals on our volunteer departments.
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
kathyp
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« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2011, 01:08:32 PM »

as i understand it, these fire departments are funded by the towns.  the people who live in the rural areas have to option of paying for the coverage to be extended into their area.  perhaps, if they don't want to pay the fee, they need to create their own fire dept?  by their own admission, this family decided not to pay and to take their chances. 
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
jaseemtp
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« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2011, 04:56:03 PM »

Every one in that county knew about having to pay the $75 for the fire service if the lived outside the city.  The home owner even admitted they knew about and thought it would never happen to them.  They took a chance and paid the price. 
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Intheswamp
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« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2011, 05:52:56 PM »

I understand the situation of the $75, etc.,.  But, I cannot get it in my mind how someone who calls themselves a fireman can standby and let someone's house burn...for $75?  Seems almost a crime to me.  If I'd been there I'd of given the $75 myself!  Sad

My grandparents lived seven miles out of town.  Coming back home one evening my grandmother opened the backdoor to smoke pouring out of the house.  The local fire department responded.  Thankfully it ended up being a pillow left laying on an electric blanket that caught a mattress on fire and it was removed from the house...smoke damage and a small scorched spot on the floor.  The "local" fire department was from town...seven miles away...it is a volunteer department.  Thankfully, the small communities scattered around have started up their own volunteer departments and are glad to help each other if needed.

http://our-compass.org/2010/10/07/firefighters-watch-house-burn-animals-die-international-firefighters-group-slams-fee-as-%E2%80%98pay-to-play%E2%80%99/
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
Scadsobees
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« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2011, 06:36:55 PM »

My grandparents lived seven miles out of town.  Coming back home one evening my grandmother opened the backdoor to smoke pouring out of the house.  The local fire department responded.  Thankfully it ended up being a pillow left laying on an electric blanket that caught a mattress on fire and it was removed from the house...smoke damage and a small scorched spot on the floor.  The "local" fire department was from town...seven miles away...it is a volunteer department.  Thankfully, the small communities scattered around have started up their own volunteer departments and are glad to help each other if needed.


Just curious...did your grandmother get that mattress pulled out, or did she wait for the FD? 
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Rick
Intheswamp
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« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2011, 07:03:51 PM »

The first we knew of it she was blowing her car's horn in our front yard.(they lived about 1/4 mile down the road from us).  They had been "riding around" some that afternoon...my grandfather had advanced parkinsons disease at that time and that was his " outside activity".  Me and father went up there and opened the back door....too thick for us to enter.  It wasn't long after that that the fire department arrived.  They found the source of the smoke and brought the mattress out.  I remember watching as they came out on the back porch with the mattress as a hot spring popped out of the mattress and landed on one of the firemen's back.  Interesting note...that fireman's son works for me now and has for over 20 years. Wink

The timing of the fire was before home health visits, etc., and grandmother had to do a lot of lifting and "helping" my grandfather...if she could've got through the smoke there's no doubt in my mind that she would have tried to carry the mattress out herself.

Another side note....  I have some property that has about a 3-4 acre pactch of some of the south's prized greenery, kudzu, growing on it. This property is in a very rural area off of several dirt roads and goes back into the swamp...timber, etc.,.  It was a couple of weeks after it happened when my cousin asked me if the local volunteer fire department had called me.  I had no idea what he was talking about.  Seems something had set the dry kudzu patch on fire.  The VFD responded, put the fire out, never even bothered me with it.  It was also at night...around 10pm when it happened.  I saw one of them later and gave them $75 (interesting number, eh?) to help out on the diesel fuel, etc.,.  If my cousin hadn't told me I would have wondered about the kudzu patch being burned....I kinda wish they'd of let it burn a little longer, but... Wink
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
jaseemtp
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« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2011, 07:24:05 PM »

Well to help in the confusion, the people who live in that county understand they do not have fire department coverage unless they paid the $75.  Now for the firemen who responded to the call most likely were told by there employer if the house that is buring is not paying into the plan then you dont put it out.  I am not sure about where y'all live but a fire department job is a pretty good job to have and I would not want to risk my job for some one else who thought they could get one over on the system by not paying and expecting the service regardless.
I can understand how and why folks are upset but these people were informed of the fee for service to help cover the cost of running the fire department outside its normal coverage area.  The city fire department has done a favor to the people who live outside the city, all they require is the $75. 
How would you feel if you lived in the city and your taxes were going to the fire department and your home was burning and no one was around because they were out fighting a fire in an area they were not suppose to be?
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hankdog1
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« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2011, 09:37:19 PM »

Kathy honestly from the looks of how old that trailer is those folks may not have had the cash.  Even if they did have the money I'm sure if you told them we can put it out but you will be charged I'm sure the people would have been more then happy.  I am for choice but honestly it's not much of a choice when the town runs a monopoly with the fire department.  Besides this isn't so much about freedom of choice as it is to do the right thing.  Like I say put it out and hand them a bill the government seems to be really good about collecting their money before anyone else.  Plus the funny thing about it is and this is true everywhere while it is gonna cost the same per sqaure foot to put a fire out those just outside of the town are charged a much higher fee.
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kathyp
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« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2011, 09:45:12 PM »

Quote
I am for choice but honestly it's not much of a choice when the town runs a monopoly with the fire department.


it's not though.  the town pays for it's fire department and offers the service to those outside town for a fee.  the people outside town could create their own fire department, couldn't they?  i'm guessing that it would be expensive to do so.  for less than the cost of purchasing and  maintaining equipment, and whatever else it takes to provide fire protection, they are offered the chance to purchase protection from town. 

it seems to me that this is not only practical, but fair.  they are not forced (taxed) to pay for it.  they are not required to maintain it.  the fee comes out to a little over 1 dollar a week.  seems like a bargain to me.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
jaseemtp
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« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2011, 10:13:10 PM »

One more way to look at it, those boys with the fire department are working for the city.  I would be willing to be that their insurance would not be so willing to pay if they were injured or killed doing something OUTSIDE their area.  I bet the very measly $75 fee covers the cost of the extra insurance and supplies.  There was an incident not long ago where several paid firemen who were off duty were killed while helping put out a house fire out side of their district.  Their familys were paid nothing....  So say what you want about how they are responsible for irresponsible people. 
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Intheswamp
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« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2011, 10:38:26 PM »

Bottom line is that it is just like most everything else today....about money.  Sad
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www.beeweather.com 
American blood spilled to protect the freedom and peace of people all over the world.  320,000 USA casualties in WWI, 1,076,000 USA casualties in WWII, 128,000 USA casualties in the Korean War, 211,000 casualties in the Vietnam "conflict", 57,000 USA casualties in "War on Terror".  Benghazi, Libya, 13 USA casualties. These figures don't include 70,000 MIA.  But, the leaders of one political party of the United States of America continue to make the statement..."What difference does it make?".

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."..."The press is our chief ideological weapon." - Nikita Khrushchev
Scadsobees
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« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2011, 10:52:03 PM »

Can't run a FD without that money!
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Rick
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« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2011, 11:17:21 PM »

What would Jesus do?
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