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Author Topic: PETA and Porn  (Read 3074 times)
Irwin
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« on: September 20, 2011, 07:30:52 AM »

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/19/us-pornography-peta-idUSTRE78H1IR20110919
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« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2011, 07:51:22 AM »

I loved the part when PETA explains that the paid models and women are not be exploited, because "They are here voluntarily (being paid).

I bet that excuse has been tried many times trying to explain prostitution. Hey, I didn't force that young lady to be here. (I just dangled the hundred dollar bills, and these poor girls just were more than willing to take it!")

You dangle enough cash, and of course you can get the hungry and needy to do anything.

Through time, the same exploited reasoning of "Hey....I'm not keeping them here! They can leave anytime they want!" has been used on blacks, Indians, and a host of slave like labor.

Just because someone shows up and gets paid, does not dismiss the reality that PETA exploits women.

But remember, time and again, they have outright claimed that animals rights trump human life.

There are enough other animal rights groups and worthwhile efforts out there working for animals. (No kill shelters, adoption services, and animal rescue networks,) Why anyone would join, support, or associate with PETA is beyond me.
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« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2011, 09:55:56 AM »

excuse me, I need to vomit.
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« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2011, 11:44:03 AM »

i don't really consider prostitution, exploitation.  think about it.  prostitution throughout history has been a way for women to better themselves.  it has even been an honorable profession in some societies.  it has been a way for women to remove themselves from poverty and even "marry up".

now....the woman who is doing it and giving all her money to a pimp, or supporting a drug habit, is probably not in the same class as a Geisha.... 
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2011, 12:43:04 PM »

i don't really consider prostitution, exploitation.  think about it.  prostitution throughout history has been a way for women to better themselves.  it has even been an honorable profession in some societies.  it has been a way for women to remove themselves from poverty and even "marry up".

now....the woman who is doing it and giving all her money to a pimp, or supporting a drug habit, is probably not in the same class as a Geisha....  

Sorry Kathy, for the few that have benefitted from prostitution, far MORE have been injured, enslaved, and killed, due to prostitution. You defining the basic right of a women to sell her body as she fits, and to be able to benefit from such choices. And I agree if that was the depth of the matter.

However,
Prostitution is not about middle aged hags being able to feed themselves and their kids. Much of prostitution is about young girls, exploiting the less fortunate, and enslaving them in a system they can not break free. Teen runaways, contract workers brought here on false promises of a better life, and girls in for nothing more than making it to the next day, is a much larger picture.

Yes, we can bundle escort services into nice defined call girls who are providing a service, paying college tuition, and putting food on the table.

But for many, it's about a young girl being exploited due to circumstances beyond her control, making near pedophiles (johns) heroes to you, by the mere fact they have cash to "better" the life of the girl they are paying.

Prostitution, with few exceptions, IS exploitation on some level. Sorry you have to pull "Geisha" out as an example of the positives of prostitution.

I'm not against prostitution. If it was legal, most exploitation would be stopped. But as long as it is illegal, exploitation will continue. And to say that this activity under the circumstances it now operates, is not exploitative, is not correct to me.

Sorry....I will not be encouraging my girls to become prostitutes to get a leg up (no pun intended) on life.
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« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2011, 12:56:20 PM »

BTW kathy....Can you approve this slogan I would like to use and give proper credit to you?

Prostitution - A great way for women to get ahead.

or

Prostitution - A great way to get a leg up.

or

Prostitution - A way for women to better themselves!

I don't want to miss anything here. So make it clear which you prefer.

I will personally pay for a bumper sticker for you.  As long as you agree to place it on your car or truck.  grin

Let me know which slogan you want.

And I thought today was going to be slow.  Smiley
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« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2011, 01:01:15 PM »

Everyone have the right to an opinion, and in my opinion I think this should not degenerate into an argument.
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« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2011, 01:04:35 PM »

there is the potential for exploitation in all things.  in factories in this country, workers are protected by labor laws.  in china, workers are not and in fact, many work in conditions that we would consider slavery.  does that make factory work bad?  no.  it makes those who enslave others for factory work bad.  

in many places prostitution is slavery and even children are used.  that does not make prostitution inherently bad, but those who exploit women, children, and even men/boys, are.  

prostitution exists in all states.  i would rather see it done as in Nevada, than in the back alleys of other cities.....or even the upscale services that risk both the girl and the customer becoming a criminal for practicing an ancient profession.

that's my libertarian bent showing, i guess.

and no, i wouldn't encourage my daughter to choose that profession, but i know a doc who put herself though med school that way.  she had no debt when she was done and is now married with children.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2011, 01:06:03 PM »

take the word 'great' out and it's your choice.   evil  i would not put the bumper sticker on my truck because at my age....it would just be sad....
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2011, 01:37:29 PM »

Prostitution is not the problem which has to be dealt with separately. It is only one of the symptoms of our sick society.
A great American seaman Henry George exposed the root of the problems and proposed THE solution.
His book of 1891 Progress and Poverty is available on-line.
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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2011, 02:04:24 PM »

ok, but only if property owners are the only ones allowed to vote. 

i have not read the book, but from skimming the various synopsis, the problem seems that he didn't take into account that the free market does correct itself if it is not interfered with.  the left has fits about boom and bust, but it is a natural occurrence in a free market.  the problem in the cycle is that the government wants to "fix" things and thus disrupts the cycle.  also remember when this was written.  you did not have the majority established middle class (land owning) that we have now.  that did not occur until post ww2.

housing is a good example.  if the govt had stayed out of it, the housing market would have bottomed out already.  those who had been priced out of the market would have a great selection of homes to choose from.  those who lost, could begin to recover.  those who own property would have some sense of what it was worth...

because the government chose to "help", we have families who wish to purchase homes still waiting for the bottom, banks that don't know the value of what they are holding, empty homes becoming drug houses, people living in foreclosures and paying nothing, and a still unstable market.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2011, 02:38:46 PM »

because the government chose to "help", we have families who wish to purchase homes still waiting for the bottom, banks that don't know the value of what they are holding, empty homes becoming drug houses, people living in foreclosures and paying nothing, and a still unstable market.

Well said Kathyp.....if the government kept it's nose out of everyones personal business we would be much better off,  it is bloated and much too intrusive.
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« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2011, 02:58:44 PM »

i have not read the book, but from skimming the various synopsis, the problem seems that he didn't take into account ...
As Leo Tolstoy said: "The chief weapon against the teaching of Henry George was that which is always used against irrefutable and self-evident truths. This method, which is still being applied in relation to George, was that of hushing up .... People do not argue with the teaching of George, they simply do not know it."
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« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2011, 02:59:34 PM »

PETA has succeeded in their REAL goal; getting attention.

No, I don't approve either, but that is the way the modern media works.
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« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2011, 03:19:29 PM »

Well kathy, I consider myself a libertarian also. Do I want government out of my life as much as possible...sure. But to take it to the point that being a libertarian equates to thinking prostitution is good for women.....I don't think so.

It's kind of like politicians. Are politicians just for the sake of being a politician, automatically corrupt, evil , or exploitative? Some would say no. Others, givens the historical value of what politics is, and always has been, IS corrupt by the very nature of politics. It is hard to separate politics, politicians, and the nature as how they do business. Handing out money to the needy, the less fortunate, and those willing to get on their knees for it, is one group exploiting another. That is the nature of politics.

And it closely resembles to me, the very nature that if men on one side have handfuls of money, and offer it to those who many times need it, there is a degree of exploitation.

I would say that politicians because of the nature of the business of politics, is exploitative and corrupt. And I would say that for a population that 30-50% live below the poverty level, that a system of prostitution, who on side side (those with money) can buy services from those who need money, this is exploitation on some level.

Funny you mention the doctor. It is a shame she had no other means to pay for college. Perhaps she could of just slept with the college professor for tuition and grades. I'm sure you feel with your libertarian views that a college professor in positions of power, demanding every freshmen sleep with him to get a good grade, is alright also. After all, they are both adults.

I see exploitation whether it be money, influence, or anything else, held over another person of need, as wrong.

I would rather have women give away sex for free. And not do so out of need. Whether it be from a john offering money, or a professor doling out grades. Power and money over peoples lives, is not good. It is exploitation.

You somehow equate prostitution with sex and a persons right. Like saying that elected officials are just guys doing their job. I see prostitution as a system of exploitation, just as politics is corrupt exploitative also. Hard to separate out the good and bad.
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« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2011, 03:48:05 PM »

Okay I will say I have just scanned your comments so don't kill me for this.

I LLLLLOOOOOOOOVVVVVEEEEEEE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol
lol

This is just what the world needs (God help us) this is what we need. lol

All I can judge this on is its going to be just like the peta games and I do play them. I mean who cant love a game where you rescue Pamela Anderson for me the Bloody McDonalds corp.

With that said the game plays like this
play for a minute then shows you pictures of chickens being killed.
I am sick and twisted I dont have a problem one with playing the game. Makes me want chicken nuggets.

Okay the porn  grin 15 year old doing what they do looking at porn every 3rd pic is of fluffy having the hell beat out her. How long do yall think it will take before the 15 year old has to beat the hell out of fluffy to get off. lol

So screw the women they don't scare me its the dude getting his fun looking a ta ta s and watching animals get gutted at the same time.  Now that SOB has problems can we say cereal killer in training.
Anyone that has ever been abused can tell you how easy it is to screw up someone with sexual stimulation and subversive messages linked. They might want to help the puppies but I will bet they create guys that do things that are just horrible to puppies.

I have wondered for years if that place is run by some dude in the background that really hates animals.
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« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2011, 04:00:33 PM »

you need to watch those assumptions.

i don't believe just because someone chooses to enter politics it follows that they are corrupt.  they certainly can be.  it is our job as their employers to make sure they are not, and to get rid of them when they are.  if we don't do that, we are as guilty of the corruption.

the woman or man who sleeps their way to a better grade is dishonest.  so is the professor.  never mind the implied threat that if she doesn't put out, the grade will be withheld.  now...if an adult student sleeps with a professor and there are no expectations, that's another thing.

as for the doc, i'm sure she could have take out a loan.  she chose not to do that.  i don't have a problem with her choice even though it wouldn't be mine.


 
Quote
who on side side (those with money) can buy services from those who need money, this is exploitation on some level.
why?  how is it any different than any other service we pay for?  the kid down the road wants to earn money for a game.  i want my lawn mowed and it's 90 degrees.  i offer him money to do a dirty job and he agrees that it's worth his time and sweat to do it.

 
Quote
And it closely resembles to me, the very nature that if men on one side have handfuls of money, and offer it to those who many times need it, there is a degree of exploitation.

 do you consider being employed = with being exploited?
i am not suggesting that women go out and choose prostitution as their career, but a regulated and legal system takes the concerns that you have out of the equation, and allows women who want to make that choice, a way to do it legally....and more safely.  and lets face it, it's a choice with an expiration date.  probably don't see a lot of  women staying in the business all the way to SSI.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2011, 04:04:31 PM »

we did get OT a little, didn't we  smiley

PETA is messed up.  i have had run ins with them in the past.  it's like the repository for every warped personality and sexually repressed misfit on earth.  you can't even have a logical conversation with them.  it's no surprise that they would choose to do  a site like this.  they all seem to be morally bankrupt..... along the lines of Hitler.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2011, 04:19:44 PM »

I mean think about it.

I bet the site will be free or very cheap.

So 12 year old say boy or girl get on there yeah kids never see porn online ha ha.

This is their first real site of true hardcore porn girl doing you feel in the blank then pic of dead puppy you know how twisted you could make that 12 year old and dont think they will quit looking because of the dead puppy. Remember sex is the best thing a 12 year old has to look forward too its better than Santa and if when I was young and didnt know better I had to look at dead puppies to look at pretty girls doing well. I would have killed the puppies myself if I thought she would do it to me.
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« Reply #19 on: September 20, 2011, 04:23:42 PM »

I know what I am saying is extreme but it is the truth.

People really need to never give peta another dime for this one.

Its just flat wrong.



Oh and KathyP

One thing I need to say us fat guys need love too sometimes green is the only way you can get that lol.
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« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2011, 04:37:08 PM »

kathy,
I'm not discussing whether prostitution should be legal or not.

I'm just acknowledging that prostitution is exploitative by the very nature of the business.

I equate politics as corrupt...by the very nature that it has ALWAYS operated.

To suggest that politics is not corrupt, or the prostitution is not exploitative, to me is the point I am making. I think they are.

To say the systems are bad, yet the people are unaffected, is questionable to me.

Sorry....to hold up one case of some women paying her way college, and make the statement that prostitution is not exploitative in nature, fails to acknowledge the many other women who continue to be exploited every day. And making it legal does not make exploitation go away.

By the very nature of you suggesting making it legal would make all my concerns go away, you also validate that things like exploitation is real. My point is that making it legal or government regulated probably will not change the number of exploited women and girls.
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« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2011, 05:01:51 PM »

You know I find the discution funny seeing that we are all beekeepers and the first trade very well could have been for honey.

I still think that was a even trade honey for honey.

I admit there is exploitation but there is exploitation in most industries I don't think the prostitute needs any more protection than the day laborer or fruit picker or poor beekeeper that you getting screw by import honey. They are all getting screw just the prostitute is the only one that might enjoy it (that is crude but true). I feel for everyone that is miss treated by anyone when it comes to a job I could introduce you to my uncle the head of the local out of Granite City, IL or my granddad that had the same job he does now. Unionize the prostitutes wait didn't they do that in Nevada.

Wait a second darn us poor beekeepers at one time we could trade honey for _______ and now its just 1.50 a pound.

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« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2011, 06:19:17 PM »

What's this place going to be like in Jan.?
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« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2011, 06:24:00 PM »

Quote
What's this place going to be like in Jan.?

 beemaster = Rules   evil

BB you are to absolute in trying to evaluate my positions. it's always interesting to hear other opinions, but just because you think a thing, it is not so.

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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #24 on: September 20, 2011, 06:32:28 PM »

   <<<<  but just because you think a thing, it is not so. >>>>

  AND THIS IS TRUE FOR BOTH OF YOU.

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« Reply #25 on: September 20, 2011, 07:00:08 PM »

Quote
AND THIS IS TRUE FOR BOTH OF YOU.

fair enough.  i never want to be accused of being overly dogmatic....well, almost never.....  Wink
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #26 on: September 20, 2011, 08:51:58 PM »

I'm really tired of the toe tappers from the peanut gallery, always claiming some big argument everytime two strong willed folks having differing opinions. Holy crap! Did me and kathy start calling each other names? Did we start swearing at each other. Did we denigrate each other? No. We both explained our own feelings and positions.

As for the "just because you think a thing, it is not so"

Excuse me. If I think something is exploitative....then in my world, and what counts to me, it is exploiting. I said "I think they are" and such comments as "is questionable to me", in explaining my position. I never said you were wrong. I never said you were stupid. I said what I feel, and think.

Sorry if some feel the need to think that this equates to some nasty discussion with flame throwers everytime two people have opposing views.

Geesh...I though we were bunch of adults here. Having folks paint a picture much worse than it really is, is not good for the casual reader or the overall forum.

People make (or fabricate) way bigger issues, than the discussion ever could.

Maybe we should say "Just because you think it's a nasty argument, does not mean it really is".  grin And just because you think it is in your world, does not mean it needs to be passed on to everyone else.
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« Reply #27 on: September 20, 2011, 09:06:00 PM »

WOW. If I'm the peanut gallery you are referring to, I can't wait to see the reaction I get when I try to stir the pot. It should be totally hilarious.

I'm not sure I am, tho, since I didn't really understand 3/4 of your rant.  I dunno
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« Reply #28 on: September 20, 2011, 09:21:10 PM »

WOW. If I'm the peanut gallery you are referring to, I can't wait to see the reaction I get when I try to stir the pot. It should be totally hilarious.

I'm not sure I am, tho, since I didn't really understand 3/4 of your rant.  I dunno

I don't have the power to put you in a peanut gallery. In my mind, yes I can. But for you to be placed in the peanut gallery, you must allow me to do so. If you thunk I'm talking to you, then your in the peanut gallery only based on your willingness to think you are there.  grin Did you get that?

See....this is part of the problem. People don't understand the posts, misinterpret what they are reading, base comments on what they don't understand, and sit back and throw rocks, or put fuel on the fire, claiming two folks are blasting each other. How can you even respond if you don't understand 3/4 of the post?

I'll try to keep the words smaller next time.  shocked
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iddee
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« Reply #29 on: September 20, 2011, 09:33:28 PM »

""I'll try to keep the words smaller next time.""

Thanks..

My little peanut brain won't pick up on them thar 35 cent words. Ya got to use the dime ones on me.  tongue grin

Las week ah cudden even spel cumputa espert. Now ah is one. How's that?? Ah can even mak mi own postes, widout mi wifs halp.
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« Reply #30 on: September 20, 2011, 09:50:19 PM »

Ok, that's enough iddee.

Now it's time to see how many folks get on here and claim we are flame throwing at each other. Heck, we might even get a few to send the moderators some threatening calls for them leaving to go elsewhere.  rolleyes

Next time, we can reverse the rolls. You start and I'll take the position you are nasty. If we throw in a few mentions of "M.B.", we can really make em go crazy!  grin

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« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2011, 10:02:12 PM »

Till next time.

Nite, John Boy.

Nite, Elizabeth.

Nite, everybody.
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*Shel Silverstein*
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« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2011, 10:42:46 PM »

nite daddy
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #33 on: September 20, 2011, 11:03:49 PM »

BB I got a good laugh out of all of it sitting here in the peanut gallery.   grin Way off topic have to admit but some good reading.  Have to admit though a lot more of this debate you guys are having has more to do with the different up bringings.  Now I personally can see and reason with both of your arguments.  Kathy makes a good logical argument for it but on the other hand your more of a feller of morals.  Both to be equally respected and both right depending on which camp your in.  You guys were just lobbing mashmellows at one another.  Goodness knows we have had our fair share of people who can't discuss something and it degrades into your stupid and you have cooties.   rolleyes

As for the subject of prostitution I'm more in Kathy's camp here making it legal would help to push out the points your making as to why it's so bad.  Morally we are all taught it is wrong and that's exactly why I also respect your side of it and see where you come from too.  But when something is illegal you make it go black market.  If it's illegal and someone wrongs you on a business deal kinda makes it hard to take them into court.  So if one can't deal with it in the courts how should one go about dealing with it?  I know this example is a little extreme but I think it may be the best way to see how you deal with such things.  We only need to look at Mexico and the drug trade.  People are killed every day because there is no way to get damages but to kill or disfigure those you feel have wronged you.  While it isn't this extreme in prostitution it happens every day too.  We should be able to relate being the second oldest profession of beekeeping.  Hear of people every day breaking the law to keep bees in a town where they are not allowed. 

As for PETA what do you guys have against People for the Eithical Treatment of Airplanes?   evil
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« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2011, 06:49:25 AM »

Hankdog,
Good post.

But.....

I never said whether it should or should not be legal.

I'm pointing out that it is exploitative in nature. And this counters it being "great" for women.

As libertarians, many feel that ALL drugs should be legal also. But does that mean we should ignore the consequences and downside to what "crack" has to offer? Just because it is legal, or one may feel that it should be each individuals right to do what they want, does not dismiss or change the fact that crack is harmful. Whether prostitution is legal or not, it has it's negative side. I just can't simply dismiss prostitution or the negative impacts to women, based on rationale of whether it's legal or not. Just as rationalizing or ignoring the downside of crack, whether sold at the convenience store and taxed, would be any better. Libertarians feel both prostitution and drugs should be legal. And that is fine, But lets not sugar coat the pitfalls of both and suggest that both are good for you. The freedoms of libertarian thought, means folks can make the decisions for themselves. it does not change what may or may not be harmful.

Libertarians.....where suggesting cracked up prostitutes are the career choice of women!

Sorry....I don't think so. I may feel that a women can make that choice. But I don't need to say it would be good for you. That does not mean I'm against either. But that does not I need to glamorize or suggest it good for you either. Prostitution is not something I would promote or suggest for those less fortunate, that this is the way to get ahead in life.

Why everyone keeps thinking that making prostitution legal would make the underside go away, is equivalent to thinking that making drugs legal would make crack nonaddictive. It does not work that way.
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« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2011, 07:45:20 AM »

BjornBee your exactly right in the matter.  To be honest with you though for some women I think it boils down to the idea that through porn on the internet and such it is looking more and more glamerous.  The point I was trying to make is that by making the profession illegal we bring more violance and even slavery into it.  The real things we are trying to prevent.  Prohibition gives a very good example of this more violance, crime, and rot gut.  More people probably died over bad booze in those years then from the crime and violance.  We repealed it while we still have problems with people being alcohoalics people aren't dieing because they stopped by a speak easy and had a glass of bathtub gin. 

Solving such a problem comes down to what makes you feel so strongly on the subject.  We need to teach our kids morals at home, at school, and any chance we get.  The downside to most of this is the people that really get hurt by such things aren't the women that choose this profession but the mother, fathers, sons, and daugthers of these women.  It would be really nice to live in a utopia where everyone was held to a high moral standard and people worked hard to live up to it.  But I feel that no matter how hard we work towards the objective there will always be some that fall through the cracks.  Pimps are always going to be around along with the girls they pimp out. 

Of course there are other forms of prostitution that are very legal.  A cousin of mine married a gal who's mom and dad own an adoption agency.  There are women that they work with that stay knocked up.  Seems odd that if a woman got pregnant by accident that she would learn from her mistakes.  They do learn one thing that staying knocked up is like wellfare the adoption parents pay for the medical bills a place to live and other bills.  Basically it's a free ride for them for 9 months out of the year.  Now when you look at it in my personal opinion that woman is just as wrong and for many other reasons even more wrong then prositutes.

Bjorn gotta say enjoying this post.  Have to give you props you make a very well articulated argument.  Makes me think we should have been lawyers instead of beekeepers.  We need more disscussions like this on here instead of the ones where it seems like once they have no more points to make it seems people revert back to grade school.  BTW just in case that's where this ends up I'm gonna say it before ya get the chance.  I'm rubber your glue whatever you say bounces off me and sticks on you.  lol  Hope ya have a good day.   grin
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« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2011, 11:59:28 PM »

What's this place going to be like in Jan.?
It's started you better get ready.
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« Reply #37 on: September 22, 2011, 06:19:27 PM »

Nah Irwin this is a discussion it's when people run out of stuff to write and revert to your stupid or your momma wears combat boots that ya gotta watch out buddy.  lol
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kathyp
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« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2011, 06:33:27 PM »

Quote
your momma wears combat boots


watch that now...some mamas did wear combat boots....
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Irwin
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« Reply #39 on: September 22, 2011, 11:26:37 PM »

LMAO cheer
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« Reply #40 on: September 23, 2011, 07:03:17 AM »

Quote
your momma wears combat boots


watch that now...some mamas did wear combat boots....

Some still do!
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« Reply #41 on: September 23, 2011, 06:33:43 PM »

Bjorn as far as I know mine may actually wear them you never know.
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« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2011, 11:14:57 PM »

Ahhhh, so nice to check in and see things are still as they should be!
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kathyp
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« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2011, 11:24:21 PM »

where the heck have you been?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2011, 11:15:33 AM »

Yea where you been.
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« Reply #45 on: September 29, 2011, 07:07:19 PM »

... excuse me, I need to vomit.


Here, let me help you!!!!  Lips Sealed

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/220373/peter-singer-strikes-again/kathryn-jean-lopez
http://www.utilitarian.net/singer/by/2001----.htm

"Peter Singer, a father of the animal rights movement, is no stranger to controversy. For his support of infanticide, euthanasia and abortion as morally justifiable, he has earned the ire of individuals and groups from all cross the political spectrum from the National Council of Disability to the Wall Street Journal.
This is completely unsurprising given Mr. Singer’s political position, preference utilitarianism; the belief, traditionally tied to hedonism, that the action that an individual must take is the one that best minimizes suffering and maximizes pleasure. In a 2000 review of a book, he defended bestiality, noting that while taboos against oral sex, contraception, masturbation and homosexuality have all largely been done away with, bestiality has not.
He went on to explain that its taboo was a mere pretext for distinguishing ourselves from animals, "erotically and any other way", and thus denying them fair treatment. He explained that some intra-species relationships could lead to "mutually satisfying conclusions".
While he came under heavy fire for his comments, PETA president Ingrid Newkirk not only defended Singer, but also bestiality…"

“…When I was working with the Washington Humane Society, there was one case that I was unable to find a way to prosecute, which will always haunt me. It involved a sex club run by men who, we had reason to believe, were sexually assaulting cats in a private home.” --PETA President Ingrid Newkirk and self confessed “Media bleep.”

LOL As someone who has numerous times tried to medicate a house cat with pills or capsules I have serious doubts about Ms. Newkirk’s veracity when she made the above statement.  But I must bow to Ms. Newkirk’s superior knowledge and expertise in now to go about having sexual relations with a house cat. However, Newkirk did express glee at the news of the death of Kenneth Pinyan, a Boeing engineer from Seattle who died after paying to be sodomized by a stallion.  Ms Newkirk praised Mr. Pinyan as a pioneer in new types of ‘relationships’ between man and beast.

Newkirk, Singer, and HSUS President Wayne Pacelle have all endorsed, reviewed, or written fore words for each others books, and at different times held memberships in the same animal rights organizations.  
I have heard rumors that Newkirk was negotiating for the movie rights to Kenneth Pinyan’s life and death.
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