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Author Topic: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)  (Read 2789 times)

Offline annette

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2011, 02:38:38 PM »
i think that's one major advantage of going foundationless all the way through.  you end up with drone comb in the brood boxes and not the honey supers.  also seems i have less burr comb.  they don't need to build it for drones.  i'm sure that varies from hive to hives.

Annette, i use open, drawn comb in the honey supers starting them.  i have not had a problem.  in fact, this year giving them more room, i had less problem with them bridging frames, etc.  it's not perfect...and i don't expect it to be, but it's better than last year.  bad thing is i just didn't get much honey overall.......

I really do not know what the problem was this year. Only thing I did different was give them the Walter Kelley beveled frames in the honey supers.

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2011, 12:14:23 AM »
>Is it a frequent occurrence to have drone brood in the supers at some point of the spring/summer?

Only when there is no drone comb in the brood nest.

> If you are into harvest time and have drone comb and don't want to cut it out, what are your options?

I have all the same sized boxes.  I can move them down, or leave the box.

>  ...  just leave that super on for a few more days until those drone hatch out?

Or just leave it altogether.
Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2011, 12:18:40 AM »
>I really do not know what the problem was this year. Only thing I did different was give them the Walter Kelley beveled frames in the honey supers.

I've had better luck with the beveled top bars than any other guide.  They are stronger and seem to get followed better.  I think we sometimes blame something for a problem that is really just random chance.  Some bees just don't understand parallel combs...
Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen

Offline T Beek

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2011, 07:51:44 AM »
MB quote;  Some bees just don't understand parallel comb.....that just cracked me up :)  Thanks Mike.  I'm enjoying your book, even more than your site.

thomas
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2011, 08:57:06 AM »
>I'm enjoying your book, even more than your site.

If you want to help me out, leave a review on Amazon and/or Barnes and Nobel...
Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen

Offline T Beek

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2011, 09:00:56 AM »
Happy to help.  Consider it done.

thomas
"Trust those who seek the truth, doubt those who say they've found it."

Offline windfall

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #26 on: August 31, 2011, 04:46:46 PM »
Annete,
I got some of those WK foundationless frames this summer too after burning through the first batch I made myself. So far no problems, although only a handful have been drawn out yet.

 I was kind of surprised how wide the facet was at the bottom of the bevel (around 5/16+")....pretty "blunt". More bothersome was the fact it (the guide bevel) wasn't centered.. off by almost 1/8", which I guess won't be problematic so long as I maintain direction on them to maintain spacing...we will see. Maybe a machine setting got bumped and a few thousand frames slipped through before anyone noticed ;)

Offline T Beek

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #27 on: August 31, 2011, 05:37:02 PM »
I got some of mine from WK as well, but the majority were made from existing frames.  Got a LONG Hive busting right now and its got nothing but the WK frames and has zero funny comb throughout. 

My Langs are are a mixture of WK and modified frames and they are also making straight comb, (after a bear nearly wiped me out this past May I'm happy to have any bees). 

I should say that I'm fairly relentless w/ keeping the broodnest open and thus am manipulating frames frequently so there's little chance funny comb gets a handle in my hives.

thomas
"Trust those who seek the truth, doubt those who say they've found it."

Offline organicfarmer

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #28 on: August 31, 2011, 05:55:56 PM »
Thanks MB

Is it a frequent occurrence to have drone brood in the supers at some point of the spring/summer?  If you are into harvest time and have drone comb and don't want to cut it out, what are your options?  ...  just leave that super on for a few more days until those drone hatch out?

Drone cells and honey storage cells are similar in size so when they build in the supers, they build large cells (most efficient in term of economy of wax for storage volume). If the queen gets in there and there is a need for drones, she'll lay.... drones. So having drone cells in supers is normal; trying not to have drone brood is also normal  :)

Offline annette

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2011, 12:54:35 AM »
Annete,
I got some of those WK foundationless frames this summer too after burning through the first batch I made myself. So far no problems, although only a handful have been drawn out yet.

 I was kind of surprised how wide the facet was at the bottom of the bevel (around 5/16+")....pretty "blunt". More bothersome was the fact it (the guide bevel) wasn't centered.. off by almost 1/8", which I guess won't be problematic so long as I maintain direction on them to maintain spacing...we will see. Maybe a machine setting got bumped and a few thousand frames slipped through before anyone noticed ;)

I have used these frames in between the brood nest for a few years with no problem, they always drew out the comb nice and straight. This is the first time I used them just for the honey supers. I know it sounds weird, but this is the only thing I did different this time.

I guess I should have stayed on top of checking on them to see how they are drawing out the comb, but since I never had this problem before, I did not check. Now I know to check more carefully when they are drawing out the honey supers. Still the frames left a bad feeling in me and I will not use them again.

Offline annette

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #30 on: September 01, 2011, 12:55:37 AM »
>I'm enjoying your book, even more than your site.

If you want to help me out, leave a review on Amazon and/or Barnes and Nobel...


I will do the same, as I just love your book

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: foundation-less and honey supers (big mess)
« Reply #31 on: September 01, 2011, 01:14:07 AM »
>I will do the same, as I just love your book

Thanks

>I have used these frames in between the brood nest for a few years with no problem, they always drew out the comb nice and straight.

You really can't beat an empty comb between two drawn brood combs for getting a perfectly drawn comb, with or without foundation.
Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen