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Author Topic: Russells A.M.M or German Black  (Read 4899 times)

Offline VolunteerK9

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Russells A.M.M or German Black
« on: July 29, 2011, 01:18:02 PM »
Has anyone bought any of these yet? I know that the AMM comes with an aggressive history but I think that the genetics would make a good addition to my yard. Specifically whats their build up like and anything management wise that needs to be considered. I already have a couple of feral hives that one needs to work carefully with lots of smoke that are a dark colored bee, so suiting up specifically for the AMM isnt a concern.

Offline AllenF

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2011, 01:57:20 PM »
They cost quite a bit.   That is all I know.

Offline applebwoi

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2011, 02:51:14 AM »
Not familiar with AAM.  What are they and if they are aggressive, what is in their genetic package that is appealing?

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2011, 11:55:11 AM »
Not familiar with AAM.  What are they and if they are aggressive, what is in their genetic package that is appealing?

From wikipedia:

Their qualities are:

    significant winter hardiness
    low tendency to swarm
    some lines are very gentle
    defensive against invaders i.e. wasps
    careful, measured "maritime" brood cycle
    strong drive to collect pollen
    high longevity of the worker bees and queen
    excellent flight strength even in cold weather
    possibly hardiness against varroa [2]
 

Although from what I have heard and read the 'low propensity to swarm' is off the mark. Im looking more at the 'possible hardiness against varroa' claim.

Offline rbinhood

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2011, 04:44:57 PM »
Have some on order from Russell I look forward to getting them and see just how well they preform.  The aggressive part will be nothing new for me.....I have some mutt stinging machines now so a few more really will not make much difference.
Only God can make these two things.....Blood and Honey!

Offline AR Beekeeper

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2011, 07:14:57 PM »
I read that California wiped out the last colonies of what was considered the only remaining pure A.MM by introducing varroa mites on to the island where they were.  The bees were introduced to one of the channel islands in the 1850's and no others had been put there since.  The bees were killed to return the island to the natural state it had before man arrived.  The bees had no resistance to the mite and the bees were killed in about a year and a half.

Offline AllenF

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2011, 10:06:55 PM »
I read that California wiped out the last colonies of what was considered the only remaining pure A.MM by introducing varroa mites on to the island where they were.  The bees were introduced to one of the channel islands in the 1850's and no others had been put there since.  The bees were killed to return the island to the natural state it had before man arrived.  The bees had no resistance to the mite and the bees were killed in about a year and a half.

Can you cite that for us.

Offline AR Beekeeper

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2011, 02:03:07 PM »
It was a short article in the back pages of a Bee Culture magazine, about 4 to 6 years ago.  I have given all my back issues away so I can't find the article again.  I have not tried to do a search for bees on the channel islands.

Offline specialkayme

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2011, 02:40:52 PM »
Talking to Russell, his AMM stock is supposed to be as natural as they can get it, while still selecting for a few traits. AMM has a tendency to swarm quite a bit, and can be somewhat aggressive, from what I've heard. Russell has bred them to be calmer, and swarm less, but there is only so much you can breed for when you are keeping the strain pure.

The kicker for AMM is their resilience. AMM has been introduced in nearly every corner of the planet, and has managed to survive. Granted, they don't always flourish, but they have survived in nearly every environment. You can't say that about the Italians, Russians, or Carni's.

I have also heard that AMM has the POTENTIAL to be more resistant to varroa. That doesn't mean that all of them are, but much like Russians, they show some signs of resistance. Again, or so I've heard.

If I can find the cash, I'd like to get an AMM from Russell for next year to try it out. That and a Moonbeam. I tried his Sunkists for the first time this year and I have nothing but good things to say about them. Truly an amazing strain, I can only imagine what he has done with his other stock.

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2011, 07:35:01 PM »
I plan on buying one or two. Hope they work out well.

Offline bee-nuts

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2011, 01:37:37 AM »
You would probably want to keep this stock isolated but thats up to you.  They are big time robbers from what I hear so if you have small colonies in the yard during a dearth dont be surprised if they kill em off.  That is one of the traits that kept their genetic in the wild before mites.  I would love to try them myself but I dont want my new queens offspring getting, HOT, HOT, HOT, when they mate.
The moment a person forms a theory, his imagination sees in every object only the traits which favor that theory

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Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2011, 12:36:01 PM »
Just ordered one. Whew! Shipping is a killer. For what I have in one queen, I could have bought a Spring package. Oh well, hopefully all will be good and I will have a hive full of black, pissy bees by next Spring busting at the seems just perfect for a split.

Offline rail

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2011, 04:55:09 PM »
VolunteerK9 & rbinhood, have you received your AMM queens?
Sirach

Offline rbinhood

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2011, 07:54:48 PM »
Received my three ladies Wednesday and they were in excellent condition including all the attendants, placed them in hives yesterday morning.
Only God can make these two things.....Blood and Honey!

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2011, 11:23:30 PM »
VolunteerK9 & rbinhood, have you received your AMM queens?


Mine are set to ship on the 8th of this month.

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2011, 03:23:37 PM »
Received my three ladies Wednesday and they were in excellent condition including all the attendants, placed them in hives yesterday morning.

How are yours doing? I just got my email stating that mine was on its way.

Offline rbinhood

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2011, 03:51:28 PM »
I checked the three hives yesterday and found plenty of eggs an a lot of small larva.  Hope they build up too go into winter nice strong hives.  So far I am very happy with the results.
Only God can make these two things.....Blood and Honey!

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #17 on: August 11, 2011, 04:14:05 PM »
My plan is to use the AMM for nuc splits to help keep their temper under control. If my queen survives the winter, Im going to bust the AMM hive back down to a 5 frame nuc with original queen and use the remaining brood/pollen frames for other 5 frame nucs and queen them with my own queens. If they are as bad as they say they are, Im not sure I really want one of them up to full strength :) I just really want to add some of their traits to my gene pool-dont really care about keeping them pure.

Offline Vance G

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2011, 12:39:19 AM »
You may find the hybrid offspring to be much hotter than the AMM Dr. Russell has selected for less aggression!  But it's all fun.

Offline VolunteerK9

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Re: Russells A.M.M or German Black
« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2011, 10:27:14 AM »
Just installed my queen yesterday after finally getting her due to USPS mishaps. She looked great and had the company of several attendant bees. Man are they ill or what? I got stung 42 times just looking at the queen cage. Just kidding..Will see how exciting of a hive this turns out to be next Spring and kudos to Russells' customer service.

 

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