Horizontal lang supering question

[BeeV]

I am planning to build a horizontal lang for next spring, with 33 medium depth frames. I plan on shimming a migratory top so it will have a top entrance. Question is, when I get to the point where I have to add supers, do I add the supers to the end opposite the entrance, or would it be better to add directly over the entrance and just move the shimmed top up. I suppose I could add a shim between the bottom box and the super so the entrance would stay in the same place. Just pondering different configurations and wondering what bees would prefer the most.

[caticind]

I keep long hives (horizontal langs) but have been rearing for fast splits, not honey surplus, so I haven't bothered to super them yet.  So this $0.02 is mostly speculative.

If you only have an entrance at one end of your hive, it would seem to make sense to super up under it rather than make the foragers or the storage bees make the long walk to the other end of the hive.  I don't see any reason why you couldn't shim between the bottom box and the super, or move the entrance up with the super, or both...

People keeping in vertical Langstroths sometimes advocate having a top entrance over the supers so that foragers go directly in to the super.   A quick search of the forum will also yield endless debates about whether swarming bees choosing an optimum location prefer top, bottom, or middle entrances, which might help inform your decision.

Me, I doubt any increase in efficiency makes that much difference.  Just make sure your entrance(s) is large enough to allow full forager traffic, that you have a method for reducing it in case of robbing, and that it is located somewhere that mortuary bees can reach pulling out the dead.  

(That might be one argument against having only one entrance up on the top of the super stack.  Mortuary bees can climb just fine with their burdens, but do you want them to have to climb all the way to the top for each trip?)

[rbinhood]

I have four 30 frame horizontal hives using deep frames with a queen excluder in the center and a queen in each end, an entrance at each end.  These hives are mainly for brood production but I have on occasion placed supers on one just to experiment.  You have to place a center divided queen excluder in the center of the hive and super up in the middle of the hive when you use this configuration. I did loose one of the queens in one of the hives at one time while I had a super on and it still worked well with the center location of the supers and two entrances. In my Alzheimer clouded mine there is no better configuration for raising brood for making splits than to run a 30 frame horizontal hive with the center excluder and two good strong queens.  During a good strong nectar flow I have had to add a new super about every two weeks.  The most honey I have ever had in a year was seven medium supers of honey from one hive.

Just remember that what works for one person may not work for another,  try your idea and if you do not get the results you were expecting try another configuration, and another till you get the results your are looking for.

[caticind]

I have four 30 frame horizontal hives using deep frames with a queen excluder in the center and a queen in each end, an entrance at each end.  These hives are mainly for brood production but I have on occasion placed supers on one just to experiment.  You have to place a center divided queen excluder in the center of the hive and super up in the middle of the hive when you use this configuration. I did loose one of the queens in one of the hives at one time while I had a super on and it still worked well with the center location of the supers and two entrances. In my Alzheimer clouded mine there is no better configuration for raising brood for making splits than to run a 30 frame horizontal hive with the center excluder and two good strong queens.  During a good strong nectar flow I have had to add a new super about every two weeks.  The most honey I have ever had in a year was seven medium supers of honey from one hive.

I'm glad to hear that has worked for you!  This is a configuration I was considering trying on an older hive next year.

[BeeV]

Thanks for the pointers. I hadn't considered running a two queen hive, but that sounds like something that would work well with the horizontal configuration. Of course, now my ADD kicks in and I have something else to ponder! 

[rbinhood]

BeeV,

It is like having three hives working one super, and boy do them girls work during a strong flow!  You have to keep a close eye on them or they will fill a super quicker than my wife can spit her Dental snuff at a horse fly circling old Maud the mules ear!  I have found that if you use 15 frames on each side you can cut a 3/8" deep grove in the center of both hive ends just wide enough for a metal bound excluder (cut to size) to slide down into it and it will hold the excluder in place.  You will also need to place a runner along the bottom with a slot the full length for it to sit into.  Then the top excluder needs to be wood frame, and add a runner in the middle with a slot too fit down over the excluder, thus there is no danger of the queens crossing over from one section to the other.

One very important point: NEVER HAVE BOTH COVERS OFF AT THE SAME TIME unless you are absolutely sure where the queens are in the hive otherwise it could result in the loss of a queen by one crossing over into the other side.

I build mine just like you would build a normal hive with openings on both ends and a oversize SBB and inter covers and you can use either type of top cover you like...me I like a semi telescoping on each end of the super, and by using the inter cover your top cover is up above your wooden queen excluder thus giving it a little protection from the elements and by adding a strip to metallic ducktape along the sides and the tops you can keep the rain out.

Such are the ravings of an "old fart" who has tried almost every trick in the book and then some.

[Bee Brothers Apiary]

Cool..good info, thanks