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Author Topic: Obama blames ATM machines for slow recovery  (Read 2213 times)
buzzbee
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« on: June 18, 2011, 03:45:34 PM »

Obama seems to blame slow recovery of jobs on ATM machines,did ya hear?

http://youtu.be/yIBhg1v4bMo
« Last Edit: June 19, 2011, 07:41:59 AM by buzzbee » Logged
BlueBee
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« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2011, 01:06:28 AM »

I haven’t heard that one?  Did the jobs for the ATMs get outsourced to China too?
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yockey5
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« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2011, 09:18:36 AM »

Such a short sighted fool.
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kathyp
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« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2011, 10:26:00 AM »

if you read Marx/Engels, that's one of the constant themes.  mechanization leads to loss of jobs. it's something that the workers have to constantly guard against......that, and cutting down to many trees.....

it would be funny if it weren't so sad.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2011, 11:37:14 AM »

I hear you Kathy.  However many of our jobs aren’t being lost to mechanization, they’re really being given/driven to Asia due to our business and trade policies.  How many millions of jobs has Apple and the other high techs created in Asia?  Our politicians (left and right) have done an outstanding job of creating jobs in Asia.
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bulldog
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« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2011, 11:53:55 AM »

i hate to agree with osama, but he has a point. i've said something similar many times. how about the self checkout at the grocery store, home cheapo, etc. they expect me to do their work for them so they can pocket the extra $7-8 dollars an hour for a cashier. i say ___ them. i'll wait in line as long as i have to. they'll never pass that savings on to us so i make them ring me up.
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« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2011, 12:25:21 PM »

I say that banks should have tellers on staff 24 hours a day!  That way when I need some cash at 10pm for a run to the liquor store I can buy what I need and not need to bother with an ATM and can instead get stuck listening to some lonely chatty teller!!

Just think of all the work that would generate!  Unemployment would plummet!!

And then all of the little banks that went bankrupt could be purchased by the giant fat cats, and their employees employed there!  Because we know all those companies are just sitting on TRILLIONS of dollars that they don't want us to have, those greedy capitalist pigs!!!

I like the grocery store checkouts.  When I have 3 items, I HATE sitting and waiting for the person with 400 packets of koolaid and the 300 coupons, when I can just ziiiip right through.  Incidentally, the automatics on average take LONGER than a cashier would, but gives the customer the feeling of control and the feeling that it takes less long.

Yeah, I recently read part of the Communist Manifesto...aside from being dreadfully boring droning on about the proletariat, there was an awful lot of class envy going on and complaining about the people with the ingenuity and the hard work to actually get ahead in life.
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Rick
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« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2011, 12:49:28 PM »

i hate to agree with osama, but he has a point. i've said something similar many times. how about the self checkout at the grocery store, home cheapo, etc. they expect me to do their work for them so they can pocket the extra $7-8 dollars an hour for a cashier. i say ___ them. i'll wait in line as long as i have to. they'll never pass that savings on to us so i make them ring me up.

What point?

There are designers, the manufacturers, the service industry, and probably dozens of other related jobs in the manufacturing and running of ATM machines.

Standing around thumbing your nose at progress, saying it is costing money and jobs, is the wrong way to look at it.

BTW...wasn't Obama ready with millions of shovel ready jobs? A trillion dollars worth. Oh wait, perhaps we should destroy the big earth movers and bulldozers under your rationale and have 100 ditch diggers work 8 hours a day doing the same work that one big equipment operator could do. Maybe they can also hand out standard grey uniforms, sandals, and straw hats with hammer and sickle emblems on them. I heard that works great in some countries.  rolleyes

Obamas got a point.  lau  He is a moron, just barely smart enough to fool half of the voters who happened to be bigger morons, vote for him.  Wink

Since I think "passing on savings" must be translated into actual cost of commodities for some folks who actually have no vested interest in stocks and cap gains, I think prices in this country are pretty low. I can get a burger for a buck ($6 in Europe) buy a pair of Levi jeans for around $35 (130.00 in Denmark) and still fill up my car for less than most countries.

The only folks I know complaining about "modernization" and loss of jobs, are union folks who are spokesperson for the union elite who care more about how many folks pay dues versus keeping jobs in this country.

Under your rationale......New Jersey would have the lowest gas prices in the country. They still demand that service stations have attendants pump gas. No self-serve or modern practices like pumping your own gas (like checking out at a register) So without the ability to pump your own gas, another job is saved, but where are those savings with your thought process? New Jersey gas prices are extremely high.

Thinking a store is saving bushels on money, or that you are going to see savings due to expensive installed self checkout stations, may be a bit off the mark. I think they are catering more to consumer demand, and market forces. Oh wait.......those things don't play into a hammer and sickle mind thought process....sorry.

Of course your confusion may be due to the confusion between "osama" and "Obama".  Wink
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« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2011, 01:45:27 PM »

Bulldog, it doesn't pay to be liberal minded around here  grin
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kathyp
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« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2011, 03:37:24 PM »

oh, you can be as liberal minded as you wish.  we will try to fix you.... evil
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2011, 05:42:32 PM »

oh, you can be as liberal minded as you wish.  we will try to fix you.... evil

On my farm, fix means emasculate!   I don't object to a liberal mind, it's what such believe he can do with my money I object to.  To said liberals I say, "if you're so determined to fix the world, start by using your own dinero!  Maybe then you'll start to see what the rest of us are talking about.
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« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2011, 05:55:33 PM »

Quote
we will try to fix you

we will try to repair your thinking  grin
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2011, 03:13:51 AM »

Its the people who make the stuff that comes out of the atm machines that are to blame, the machines themselfs are a great achievement.
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buzzbee
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« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2011, 07:05:11 AM »

This same line of thinking came along when diesels replaced steam locomotives.And when tractors replaced mule teams.
  Automation and innovation is what has put America at the top for so many years.This is what has allowed us to have the richest "poor" in the world. Sadly,by being able to have this level of poor,it has created a level in society that has no incentive to move from that category.
 
 These constant changing technologies are the best way for growth.We just need to be the leaders,not the followers.The best way to get there is to not let government dictate where the new investments go,but business that risks capital(invests) for a chance at a reward(profit).

 
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« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2011, 09:03:54 AM »

Quote
Sadly,by being able to have this level of poor,it has created a level in society that has no incentive to move from that category.

true statement.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2011, 10:09:38 AM »

This same line of thinking came along when diesels replaced steam locomotives.And when tractors replaced mule teams.
  Automation and innovation is what has put America at the top for so many years.This is what has allowed us to have the richest "poor" in the world. Sadly,by being able to have this level of poor,it has created a level in society that has no incentive to move from that category.
 
 These constant changing technologies are the best way for growth.We just need to be the leaders,not the followers.The best way to get there is to not let government dictate where the new investments go,but business that risks capital(invests) for a chance at a reward(profit).


The answer is education. But, when politicians debate evolution and intelligent design as biology curricula, I guess the battle is already lost ?

Don't forget the North-American culture where being a lawyer, doctor, banker or a footballer is valued more than a scientist/engineer.

Look at China, 8 out of 9 government officials are scientists. Why do you think China invests so much into automation and manufacturing ?
Did you know they are the largest investor in clean technologies ?

In Europe, only Germany still has a strong manufacturing industry (and they do pretty well irregardless of the social programs they have).

Not to worry, I'm sure the investment bankers with come up with newer, virtual, products for sale.
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L Daxon
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« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2011, 10:30:03 AM »

Let's see. ATMs have been around for how many decades.  And they are just now responsible for Obama's 9.1 unemployment rate?  Yah, that sure sounds like a structural problem to me.

At least Obama is doing his part by adding new jobs in the teleprompter industry. grin
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linda d
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« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2011, 01:20:51 PM »

Go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics website. Find the number of tellers working for the first year of ATMs (1984) and then the number of tellers working for the last available data. You will see that the number of tellers has increased. This does not take into account the number of programmers, manufacturers, maintenance people, or even the people needed to fill the machine.
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« Reply #18 on: June 22, 2011, 02:01:57 PM »

i think you're missing the point. obviously if we outlawed atm's today the economy would not be fixed by tomorrow. the point is that we are losing jobs, not just to machines, but also the one's being sent overseas and it is really not helping us come out of this depression ( some might call it a recession, but not me ) .

during the great depression America went to war, while at home we began cranking out bombs, bullets, tanks, ships and planes like there was no tomorrow. it was this industry that enabled us to recover because of the infrastructure that existed at the time. today everything is made in china or whoever else can make things the cheapest. our infrastructure is lost. and the lowly bank teller or whoever else that loses their job to a machine or downsizing or whatever is one more person out of work, one more person that is not able to pay taxes and buy things which is how our economy is driven.

yes modernization is great, and yes machinery can make our lives easier, but it does come at a cost.


Quote
Go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics website. Find the number of tellers working for the first year of ATMs (1984) and then the number of tellers working for the last available data. You will see that the number of tellers has increased. This does not take into account the number of programmers, manufacturers, maintenance people, or even the people needed to fill the machine.




i wonder if maybe that's not just because there are more banks today ? there used to be two banks in my town back in the mid 80's and one of them was brand new and now there are more than  i can count , and there are 4 within 200 yards of one another ( not an exaggeration )



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« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2011, 06:31:27 PM »

From the beginning even people like Marx and Engels did not believe that the United States would become a Dictatorship of the Proletariat.  The Leftist, the Libs, and Progressives recognized that the American Worker was more intrested in becoming a millionair himself than in burning one at the stake. 

Now we have a President who is using his bully pulpit to spread bull manure in order to encourage American Workers to wage class warfare on the economy.  Just remember, during class warfare the first causality is the ECONEMY.

In the old USSR the Communist Party membership was about 3% of the total population.  If Abraham Lincoln delivered his Gettysburg address in the former Soviet Union, Old Abe would have had to say, "... So that government of the 3%, by the 3%, and for the 3% ......."

The most frighting thing is not the possibility of a class war in this country, but the possibility that the USA will turn inwards on itself like China did under the Manchu or Mandarins.  In China this created a society where even the locomotive was once viewed as a threat to someones "rice bowl".  The negative hype pushing "natural" "organic" "holistic" "treatment free" and "non-GM" crops is the tip of a spear aimed at the heart of the USA. Even Commrad Moralise of Bolivia had enough sense to approve GM crops to bring down the cost of Bolivians' food.   It is the racist leftist who are scare mongering the dictators and strong men of Africa into starving their populations.  This is being done to make rich white Westerners feel good about their pathetic lives while the lives of Black Africans are sacrificed on the alter of a white mans' god, political correctness.  Meanwhile the dictators and strong men use the food weapon given them by the leftist to wage swollen belly genocide on rival tribes and political enemies.
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