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Author Topic: Varroa Mite Control?  (Read 7148 times)
snmyork
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« Reply #40 on: June 30, 2011, 08:03:10 AM »

OK guys, I am still wanting to know what methods you use to control mites. I still am finding from even local beeks to use sugar shaking, and splitting the hive. The use of small cell or natural comb also is a help. I do a lot of research before I do anything and if you know a better way than please fill free to tell me. The reason for my first post on going as chemical free as possible is to keep the chemicals inside the hive at a small amount. As a society we think that when a problem arises to put chemical or use chemicals to make it better. I do not want that for my bees. If I need to use mite-away that is fine. I just want the best option for me.
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Finski
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« Reply #41 on: June 30, 2011, 10:50:36 AM »

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Dear sir. Use your own brains.

There are at least 20 recommended effective method to treat varroa, but you as a new beekeeper put so idealistic borders to the theatment, that probably this generation cannot help you.

"to rear varroa tolerant bee stock". Yes, splended. I t has been done 30 years in many countries. Numerous break outs have been done but the final goal waits..

No one want to think that varroa too develope its existence.

I use European Union Varroa Groups recommendations. I HAVE NOTHING MY OWN TRICKS.  I am not even going to waste my only life for varroa. In British forum some said that using hose recommendations is against law. Yes, it is nice to see some beekeepers sit in prison after killing 25 000 mites with wrong method.
 
You may kill mites but only with aproved method.......


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Scadsobees
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« Reply #42 on: June 30, 2011, 02:31:06 PM »

As Finski said, there are lots of methods.  Finski's getting pretty feisty again, though.... grin  Feisty Finski!

No method is the silver bullet.  Most work a little bit, none work all the way.  Many have been tried, touted, but have fallen out of favor.  Mineral oil fog coming to mind, as well as vinegar fog.

Brood break
Out breeding the mites, keeping young queens - search for Mel Disselkoen, he has interesting methods

Faithfully powdering with sugar can help a bit.
Screened bottom boards
Freezing frames of capped drone brood
essential oils
equipping the nurse bees with tiny pry bars

I use apiguard, although will forgo that this year for some nosema meds.

Garlic works somewhat against the blood-suckers, but I feel it works best if I keep a bucket of holy water around for the bees to take in.  Boy...and the sparks and smoke when I open that top cover!!



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Rick
Hethen57
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« Reply #43 on: June 30, 2011, 02:41:10 PM »

Let the flaming begin, but I couldn't resist after hearing this same discussion for years now with no real "solution."  huh  Here are the conclusions I have reached:

Find magic "feral bees" (mostly just escapees from someone else's packages), buy magic bees from someone who doesn't treat (you don't even need the bees, just the queen, because she is the only one reproducing bees), don't do anyting and your bees will "evolve" (if they don't die first, else try again...you will probably not live long enough to see any change, but the package sellers will get rich and you may get lucky...), sugar dust, sugar and garlic, small cell, frames of drone comb, use MDA splitter method, put them in a top bar hive, atguard, thymol, oxylic vapor, oxylic drip, mineral oil vapor, place rotting banana on inner cover, and use a screened bottom board.  One of those things, or some combination of them, should work.... shocked

...and bee sure to feed Honey-B-Heathy and enzymes in your sugar syrup to build resistance...

 grin
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-Mike
Finski
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« Reply #44 on: June 30, 2011, 02:58:28 PM »

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Yes, that hokkus pokkus list. We keep bees and feed mites with bees. That must be basic idea.

Do you know that Devil does not live in the Hell any more.
Yes, when Stalin came to Hell, Devil moved to Heaven.
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T Beek
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« Reply #45 on: June 30, 2011, 05:57:24 PM »

Just say 'no' to treatments.  Sure, bees will die, likely by the trillions, but we must let weak bees die so they can defend this scurge 'themselves'.  The survivors will rule and if they could they would thank us.   I often feel that the best thing we homo-sapians could do to help out honeybees would be to stop keeping honeybees for awhile, likely a LONG while to have any real effect.......

But first we must overcome 'human' arrogance (yeah, that's gonna happen) over other living creatures.

thomas

" people go to Heaven for the weather, people go to Hell for the company.  Why is Hell so crowded?HuhHuh
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Hethen57
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« Reply #46 on: June 30, 2011, 06:28:41 PM »

Why do that?...you would probably have a better chance spending your annual bee package money on Lotto tickets.  Rather than random chance selection, why not be scientific and get queens from the guys who already have the survivors that do this?  Very quickly, all of our hives would be populated with "treatment free" offspring and we wouldn't have to treat either.  If we all did this, instead of continuing to buy all those other inferior queens that come with the packages, theoretically we should be able to beat Varaoa in a few years and end this discussion.
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-Mike
Finski
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« Reply #47 on: June 30, 2011, 08:14:32 PM »

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Here we are. Best cure is survivors. It means nothing can be done. Just wonder.


We have saying from II WOLRD WAR:  A Finnish soldier is equal 10 Russian soldier but then came the eleventh ....

Varroa douple itself in month .......100....200....400....800.....1600....3500....7000....14 000..25 000

in 9 months 250 fold....
....
Hurray! Survivors are coming!


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« Last Edit: June 30, 2011, 08:25:37 PM by Finski » Logged

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Finski
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« Reply #48 on: June 30, 2011, 08:27:36 PM »

Why do that?...you would probably have a better chance spending your annual bee package money on Lotto tickets.  Rather than random chance selection, why not be scientific and get queens from the guys who already have the survivors that do this?  Very quickly, all of our hives would be populated with "treatment free" offspring and we wouldn't have to treat either.  If we all did this, instead of continuing to buy all those other inferior queens that come with the packages, theoretically we should be able to beat Varaoa in a few years and end this discussion.

yes, why?

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danno
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« Reply #49 on: July 01, 2011, 08:03:51 AM »

"A Finnish soldier is equal 10 Russian soldier but then came the eleventh ...."

Finski
Hope you dont mind a american born Norwegen on you side.  By now you should be getting the idea that this is a battle that cant be won here.   
« Last Edit: July 01, 2011, 08:39:35 AM by danno » Logged
Finski
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« Reply #50 on: July 01, 2011, 03:49:36 PM »

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What battle, where?

Half of Norwegian hives have not varroa.
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danno
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« Reply #51 on: July 01, 2011, 04:19:12 PM »

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What battle, where?

Half of Norwegian hives have not varroa.
if you haven't noticed this site has a huge following of powder sugar shaking members.   Oxalic is also illegal here so on top of so many site members that dont want to put anything in there hives, you have the "thats not legal crowd"   What I was trying to say to you is I have personal experience with oxalic.  Most here dont and never will.   this is the battle I am talking about.   
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Finski
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« Reply #52 on: July 02, 2011, 11:54:48 AM »

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In many countrie it is said that oxalic acid is illegal= not accepted.
However beekeepers have used 10 years oa. First gasifying, then sprayding and then tricking. No oe knows when you use oa.

Sugar dusting is waste on time. It is one hive owners fun club job. Nothing serious.

Oxalic acid is practically free = a bad business.


In England many said that oxalic acid is illegal. However Defra had recommend its use 5 years. That is time when varroa group find the results.

I have teached to many forums how to use oxalic acid. Folks are not able to read with english language from google researches. However they want to use 15 years old tricks.

I have studied biology in University and issues are not odd to me.
That I do not understand that so many want to find his "own receipt"  to do that and that. Idiots they are.

Michael Bush is a big guru on forums, but when you look, his systems or varroa tolerant bees are not mentioned in single university research. Michael uses oa-gasifying and does not understand trickling.

This has been same BS seven years. It is going worse when those "stupid and busy" guys write their advices.

I have met so much losses for varroa that I do not want play "me inventor" -game.

I am a  little bit angry about the issue. So much vain writing years and years.


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T Beek
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« Reply #53 on: July 02, 2011, 01:39:21 PM »

Finski angry?  I couldn't tell grin

thomas
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Finski
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« Reply #54 on: July 02, 2011, 05:22:44 PM »


But if sugar shaking is second best, shake it.
If waiting a miracle is the best, you wait it.
Mean while I kill mites with chemicals.

I have studied chemistry and genetics in university. I have played with vrroa 30 years. Funny thing but I can handle this case.
You have problems, not me.


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BlueBee
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« Reply #55 on: July 02, 2011, 06:40:26 PM »

Finski, you are wise.  I listen to you.  However mites are worth money here in the USA, maybe we don’t want them dead?  The researchers at Michigan State University are willing to pay a premium for hives WITH LOTS OF MITES.   The more mites the better!

http://www.michiganbees.org/2011/06/yes-your-mites-are-worth-some-money/

It might be bad for businesses if we killed off all the mites with Oxalic acid.
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Finski
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« Reply #56 on: July 02, 2011, 10:08:36 PM »

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Jeeee. Eiffel tower of Paris has been sold 3 times to US BUSINESSMAN.

I have read that you are diamond hard sellers but I think that you are hard byers too.

To pick mites from bees you need sheap labour force. That is a stif point.
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #57 on: July 03, 2011, 07:29:27 PM »

Finski,

It is my belief it's happening again.  A few years ago you dragged your superiority of knowledge in the face of everyone on this forum.  Eventually you and I had some harsh words over that and you left the forum for a while because of the amount of animosity that developed from your braggadocio.  Now your abrasiveness so coming to the fore again and I see history repeating itself. 

Finski, I would put my knowledge of beekeeping up against yours any day of the week.  I admit you have one area of strength in the art of beekeeping I lack, keeping bees in very cold conditions.  But just because you are successful as a cold weather beekeeper, and have a college education, doesn't mean you have a right to be so in your face with what knowledge you dispense.   There are a lot of college educated beekeepers on this forum who choose not to make a big deal over it.   

I believe it is the intent of this forum to share the collected knowledge of every member, regardless of their degree of experience, to the betterment of all.  My grandfather, who was a minister, used to say, "The arrogant man reaps contempt as his primary crop."  Please ratchet back on the arrogance and impart your wisdom with patience and compassion, it will be much better received.
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Life is a school.  What have you learned?   Brian      The greatest danger to our society is apathy, vote in every election!
T Beek
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« Reply #58 on: July 04, 2011, 01:38:14 PM »

 applause applause  Thanks Brian, tried to relay that sentiment earlier in this post but was ignored.

thomas
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rdy-b
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« Reply #59 on: July 04, 2011, 04:53:57 PM »

In response to garlic, the use of it is pretty much the same as for using sugar shakes.  For mite control the treatment I've found is no treatment, let the bees figure it out.  It takes about 6-8 years to get your bees to the point that they can survive even with a moderate mite load, and learn how to control the mite load so it never gets larger than moderate.

But if you like treatments garlic is as good as powdered sugar, flour, cornstarch, and other finely ground powders.
gota be careful when you chose to dust your bees for mite protection-powdered sugar will not dry out and kill young and developing LARVE -theres more to it than just finely ground powders when it comes to larvae well being-something to think about--RDY-B
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