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Author Topic: so now UBL is dead  (Read 5271 times)
kathyp
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« on: May 02, 2011, 12:08:37 AM »

will the radial element feel the need to follow him or avenge him?  what will happen in Pakistan?  with the elements in AQ that have been clamoring for another big act, have their way and try to pull one off?

yes...i am happy he's gone.  it needed to be done.  my gut says to temper happiness with extreme caution...
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2011, 12:34:12 AM »


yes...i am happy he's gone.  it needed to be done.  my gut says to temper happiness with extreme caution...

You are right.  I'm celebrating but terrorism is not over.  I think this will be a big boost to US confidence and will deflate AQs stature.   This makes it clear to any terrorist that eventually.... no matter how long it takes.... the US will bring justice to those who attack us.  It's a good night.
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« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2011, 03:54:10 AM »

"His greatest hope, he told supporters, was that if he died at the hands of the Americans, the Muslim world would rise up and defeat the nation that had killed him." - last line of an excruciatingly long NYT article.

I'm not sure how to call this one on whether Bin Ladin died at the hands of the "Americans" I heard that Obama gave him an iPod loaded with his speeches and he killed himself 15 minutes in. It even explains why ohbummer was in such a rush to claim credit. - My "comment"

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« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2011, 07:25:36 AM »

Dead? Buried at sea? I think/hope he is being water boarded somewhere for information. My comment.

Steve
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« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2011, 07:41:08 AM »

they should have burned him!!!!!!!!
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« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2011, 07:52:22 AM »

"His greatest hope, he told supporters, was that if he died at the hands of the Americans, the Muslim world would rise up and defeat the nation that had killed him."

they should have burned him!!!!!!!!

That's what OBL would have wanted.  Burying him where no shrine can be erected.... that's  the best end for such evil.
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« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2011, 08:19:30 AM »

Let the conspiracy theories begin. No body-no confirmed kill.

He may be on a remote island with Elvis, Marilyn Monroe and Dale Earnhardt.

He may be gone, but Im curious to see if this will dampen the fires of AQ or just fuel them further.
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« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2011, 08:38:35 AM »

It has been announced that the mission was to kill bin Laden, not to capture him.   All the planning was to avoid giving his supporters any chance to rally around him.  Burial at sea for someone who is not a sailor is not an honorable end.   The fish are dining well today.
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« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2011, 08:51:52 AM »

Let the conspiracy theories begin. No body-no confirmed kill.

He may be on a remote island with Elvis, Marilyn Monroe and Dale Earnhardt.

He may be gone, but Im curious to see if this will dampen the fires of AQ or just fuel them further.

I can't see Elvis being impressed with that.
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« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2011, 01:46:01 PM »

We'll finally get to see the pictures of his corpse, the proof, right around October of next year. rolleyes
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« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2011, 02:12:19 PM »

Good to see Osama go just as much as anyone.  I wonder though about who the american people will give credit to.  Will it be Obama and his mighty pen or the real men and women who made it happen?  We need heros in this country especially at times like these.  We need someone like Sgt. York not the president to be that hero.  But in the end it will probably be Obama he is really good at taking credit for things almost like Al Gore.  A real president would have had a slice of humble pie took no credit and praised the work of so many fine men and women for a job well done. 
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« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2011, 02:33:36 PM »

Quote
A real president would have had a slice of humble pie took no credit and praised the work of so many fine men and women for a job well done.  


he deserves credit for making the call, but there were a lot of "I"s and "my"s  in his speech.  he is not a humble man.  the bulk of the credit goes to intel and military.  i think most people understand that.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2011, 03:00:01 PM by kathyp » Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2011, 03:08:23 PM »

  I wonder though about who the american people will give credit to. 

Who would have been blamed if bin Laden had gotten away again... like he did at Tora Bora?   The buck stops with the Commander in Chief, whether for credit or blame.
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kathyp
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« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2011, 03:42:39 PM »

very true.  just as bill Clinton was blamed for not taking him out when he had the chance.  just as carter was blamed for the failed rescue.  the skipper is responsible for all that happens on his ship.

but when WE consider who should get the biggest share of the credit for any operation, i think we understand that no matter who is in charge, it's the guys on the ground that make it work....or not.

it's like shooting the pirates.  doing it was a good call.  make the shots was excellent.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2011, 07:19:27 PM »

When things work out, everyone looks like a genius.  But I credit Obama for the courage to take a huge risk.  It would have been politically safer to do nothing.  If our military folks had failed  (or if the high value target turned out not to be bin Laden) Obama would have looked foolish and could have been destroyed politically.  But he trusted his military guys and put the mission above his own political safety.  There was real courage there that we haven't seen in a politician for awhile.

There was also a huge amount of strategic planning that goes into such a mission.  The Pakistani government, at some level, must have been involved in protecting bin Laden.  He was 4000 ft. from the Pakistani Military Academy, their equivalent to West Point.  I think the Pakistanis knew where he was and planned to use their nearby military forces to protect bin Laden. 

And the disposal of bin Laden's body, according to Islamic tradition and at sea, was the perfect move that reflected an understanding of the local culture that has not previously been the hallmark of US foreign policy.
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kathyp
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« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2011, 07:32:30 PM »

Quote
When things work out, everyone looks like a genius.  But I credit Obama for the courage to take a huge risk.  It would have been politically safer to do nothing.  If our military folks had failed  (or if the high value target turned out not to be bin Laden) Obama would have looked foolish and could have been destroyed politically.  But he trusted his military guys and put the mission above his own political safety.  There was real courage there that we haven't seen in a politician for awhile.

yup.  credit where credit is due.

Quote
And the disposal of bin Laden's body, according to Islamic tradition and at sea, was the perfect move that reflected an understanding of the local culture that has not previously been the hallmark of US foreign policy
.

intellectually, i understand why they did this, but to be honest, i don't give a rats rear for "sensitivity", cultural, or other.  i would have preferred to do the Mussolini and take the consequences.  having watched some of the be-headings, i think he deserved nothing less.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2011, 08:37:27 PM »

I agree he was caught on obamas watch more power to him at least he did that right.

I also agree bin laden should be hanging from a pole in front of the pentagon who gives a da!@ about their religion we killed him he should be buried when we want him buried. He should be paraded through the country right behind the 9/11 flag  that is currently crossing the country.

just saying,

Keith
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« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2011, 09:21:55 PM »

Oh, I'd like to see his head on a pike.  But the pictures will be shown shortly and I'll bet that will be just as good.  grin

The reason for the cultural and religious sensitivity is strategic.  AQ recruitment depends in large part on convincing stupid, naive young men that they are fighting for their country and their faith when they fight America.  Respect for their culture is a good practice in any case, but in this instance it will save American lives.
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« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2011, 10:51:08 PM »

Respect for their culture is a good practice in any case, but in this instance it will save American lives.
Only to the degree that it hinders absolutely nothing.
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« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2011, 01:37:53 AM »

Quote
And the disposal of bin Laden's body, according to Islamic tradition and at sea, was the perfect move that reflected an understanding of the local culture that has not previously been the hallmark of US foreign policy

personally i would have liked to see his head on a pole in the middle of kabul, he doesn't deserve better treatment than the thousands who are dead because of him.
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