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Author Topic: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless  (Read 13719 times)

Offline luvin honey

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I ran out of paint stir sticks, so I've been adding them in with just a groove and nothing sticking out at all. They've been building on them fine so far.
The pedigree of honey
Does not concern the bee;
A clover, any time, to him
Is aristocracy.
---Emily Dickinson

Offline Michael Bush

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>I ran out of paint stir sticks, so I've been adding them in with just a groove and nothing sticking out at all. They've been building on them fine so far.

If you put an empty frame between two drawn brood comb or two capped honey combs they will draw it fine with no other guide.  Otherwise you must have just been lucky.
Michael Bush
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Offline luvin honey

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>I ran out of paint stir sticks, so I've been adding them in with just a groove and nothing sticking out at all. They've been building on them fine so far.

If you put an empty frame between two drawn brood comb or two capped honey combs they will draw it fine with no other guide.  Otherwise you must have just been lucky.
Yes, these are in 4-year-old hives with perfect comb on either side.
The pedigree of honey
Does not concern the bee;
A clover, any time, to him
Is aristocracy.
---Emily Dickinson

Offline BlevinsBees

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I've found that any more than 1/4" and the will draw on both sides of the starter strip creating double comb that's a mess to make right.
President, San Francisco Beekeepers Association
habitatforhoneybees.com

Offline JAYBEE

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Started my first 2 hives 5/20/12. 5 frame nuc in the middle and 2 foundationless frames on one side and 3 on the other. I used foundationless frames from Kelly. I did not wax them. In 6 days they have filled a complete frame in each hive and have starts on 2 others. What a sight, a full frame of perfect brood comb. Will post photos when I can(new member). Was careful to level the hives. Bees are bringing in pollen and nectar dawn to dusk and have not been fed. The bees have been awesome, very gentle. Carnolian and Minnesota hygienic mix. Install and first inspection without a sting, although one hive got closed a little early due to headbutting.

Offline jataylor

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Would be very interested in seeing pictures of how the frame should look before you install also if someone has a picture of using the sticks as starter strips.  Also looking forward to seeing that drawn brood comb. :)

Offline Beregondo

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I don't buy any sticks at all to use as starters.

I just get wedge to frames and turn the so it points downward and attach it to the top bar with two 1/2"staples.

It works very well.

You do have ensure your hive is level side to side though, as if it is not when the bees hang from the strip they will not be lined up with the frame and the comb (being built straight down) will slant to one side as well.

On deep frames, I also run 20 lb test fish line tightly through the wiring holes to support the soft comb until it hardens.
I lost a brood comb or to on hot summer days before I learned that fix.

Michael B, Thanks of your website.
It has been a great help to me.
I bought the book primarily to recompense all your hard work.
(And have since given it  a lot of use.)

Offline Foxhound

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I put paint stirrer sticks on my frames. I didn't break them in half and they hung  about 1" below the top bar. This was a mistake, as the bees essentially wasted the space to either side of the paint stirrer. Or they built comb on either side of the stick, rather then on the bottom of the stick.

Offline luvin honey

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I put paint stirrer sticks on my frames. I didn't break them in half and they hung  about 1" below the top bar. This was a mistake, as the bees essentially wasted the space to either side of the paint stirrer. Or they built comb on either side of the stick, rather then on the bottom of the stick.
I hope I wasn't misleading or forgot that detail. I cut mine so they only stuck out about 1/4 inch below the bar. I'm sorry you have a mess :(
The pedigree of honey
Does not concern the bee;
A clover, any time, to him
Is aristocracy.
---Emily Dickinson

Offline Rurification

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We used craft sticks this year too.  At 1/4", the bees were building on either side, but not the center.  We pushed them up so they were showing between 1/8 and 1/16".  That was better.    After a couple of months we noticed that the comb was way off at the bottom and then we realized that the earth had shrunk so much because of the drought that the hives were out of level.   We leveled them again and things have been better.

It's really important to get your hives level. 

Also, we tried a few different types of frames - the slat ones, and the ones where you push the wedge over, then staple it in place and the ones with a plain old wedge.  The bees don't seem to care.  I like the plain wedge ones best [from Kelley].   Less fuss.

Offline Foxhound

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I put paint stirrer sticks on my frames. I didn't break them in half and they hung  about 1" below the top bar. This was a mistake, as the bees essentially wasted the space to either side of the paint stirrer. Or they built comb on either side of the stick, rather then on the bottom of the stick.
I hope I wasn't misleading or forgot that detail. I cut mine so they only stuck out about 1/4 inch below the bar. I'm sorry you have a mess :(


No I did that earlier this year. It wasn't because of your advice.

Offline JPBEEGETTER

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #31 on: September 16, 2012, 06:29:37 PM »
On my top bar hive , I took the top bar and clamped a piece of cotton string in the middle and then took soldering iron and waxed the string...Have all combs drawn in the middle and very strong comb attachment.. NO FALL OFFS.. So am going to do the same in my 6 langs, when i need more supers..

Offline Intheswamp

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #32 on: September 17, 2012, 10:33:10 AM »
You didnt put them in the dryer did ya? For some reason, my friggin clothes dryer keeps shrinking my jeans to where they wont fit any more.
I might have the same brand of dryer as you do, VK9, the same thing's happening to my jeans! 

Ed
www.beeweather.com 
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Offline Foxhound

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #33 on: September 17, 2012, 10:42:29 PM »
The whole space space across the top bar doesn't need to be filled. I guest it would be best practice to fill it, it is fine to leave gaps. If given the choice, I would fill to the sides, and leave the space in the middle.

It probably doesn't matter though.

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2012, 10:29:52 AM »
>It probably doesn't matter though.

The ends matter because they tend to curve them without any guidance.  The middle matters because they often start there and may not be aware of the guides further down.  A small gap doesn't matter much, but a big one does.
Michael Bush
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
-------------------
"Everything works if you let it."--Rick Nielsen

Offline JPBEEGETTER

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2012, 05:46:49 PM »
On top bar hives they tend to curve the ends toward the front, you can (if you check your hives ) slice the curved part and straighten it
and press the end down gently and they will get straight again..

Offline Fox Creek

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #36 on: October 08, 2012, 01:01:58 AM »
I also used the uncut paint stir sticks. I Elmer'ed glued the sticks into the frames. As M. Bush suggests, place these between frames with comb. My Carnolians have no problem building comb this way.

Offline bailey

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Re: How far out does the pop sickle stick need to stick out for foundationless
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2012, 09:46:40 PM »
if you have a doctor friend get some tounge depressers from him/her.
the easiest i have found is just break the wedge bars out, assemble the frames, turn wedge bar sideways and staple it in place sideways.   
works great but try to always put a new frame between drawn frames otherwise cross combing will happen.
bailey
most often i find my greatest source of stress to be OPS  ( other peoples stupidity )

It is better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool than to open ones mouth and in so doing remove all doubt.