Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
October 24, 2014, 09:46:01 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: ATTENTION ALL NEW MEMBERS
PLEASE READ THIS OR YOUR ACCOUNT MAY BE DELETED - CLICK HERE
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat  

Pages: 1 [2] 3  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: An ethical question  (Read 4954 times)
BjornBee
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3773


Location: Lewisberry, PA


« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2011, 04:32:22 PM »

I think anytime you need to ask if something is ethical, you have already answered the question yourself.  Wink

As a beekeeper who has bees on other people's property, let me comment on what I ask of the property owner....

If you see my bees swarm, please understand that this is my way of keeping my numbers up, and keeping your bill lower.

If you see my bees swarm, see if you can determine which hive it came from. I need to know this and it saves me time and labor checking all the hives.

If you see my bees swarm (and this is defined as any swarm whether in flight or settled on a tree) stop and spend a dime to call me.

In return, I will among other things.....

Call you when someone left the pump on filling up the water tank and it is overflowing.

Write down that number of the car that happens into the orchard and I know they are filling up their trunk with apples.

Call you when the cows get out or anything else happens and I know it needs attention.


I had one farmer who thought calling his neighbor to let him have my swarms was the right thing to do. And I had another who collected my swarms one season so he could get into beekeeping, and would not need to pay for bees the following spring. Both those instances had me removing the bees within 24 hours.

I provide a service and can not be expected to be there to "properly manage" my bees as some suggest. But I have great relationships with my customers and they know very clearly what I expect, and what they get in return from me.  And even though they allow me to pick up drops in the orchards in the fall, I still ask every time if I can fill the truck. It's the right thing to do.

And I add one more thing.....anyone who blames a beekeeper that is was his fault through not doing his job that a swarm was issued, is just wrong in my opinion. It's a weak justification on poor ethics to suggest that a beekeeper had it coming, or was somehow worth crapping on by allowing his bees to swarm. Self justification for bad behavior...that's all that is.

Do yourself a favor, and ask the beekeeper. I bet he won't mind. And in the end, you will have done a good thing, and don't need the need to "hide" your traps or trance around wondering if he is going to show up and catch you doing something you feel in your gut you find wrong.
Logged

www.bjornapiaries.com
www.pennapic.org
Please Support "National Honey Bee Day"
Northern States Queen Breeders Assoc.  www.nsqba.com
Countryboy
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 239

Location: Central Ohio


« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2011, 11:14:20 PM »

In terms of ethics, use the inverse tense of the golden rule.  Do not unto others, as you would not have them do unto you.

anyone who blames a beekeeper that is was his fault through not doing his job that a swarm was issued, is just wrong in my opinion. It's a weak justification on poor ethics to suggest that a beekeeper had it coming, or was somehow worth crapping on by allowing his bees to swarm. Self justification for bad behavior...that's all that is.

I provide a service and can not be expected to be there to "properly manage" my bees as some suggest.


Let me get this straight.  You admit that you don't do your job (properly manage bees), yet you expect others to pick up the slack for you?  You even want them to try to figure out what hive the swarm came from?  Why don't you just let them manage your bees for you?

If you see my bees swarm, please understand that this is my way of keeping my numbers up, and keeping your bill lower.


Oh, give me a break.  That's ridiculous.  Competent beekeepers do NOT rely on swarms to keep their numbers up. (Skep beekeepers excluded.)  Competent beekeepers know that catching a swarm is unreliable.  Competent beekeepers split their hives before they swarm, which keeps their numbers up.

If you're too busy to properly manage your hives, then you accept losses due to swarming.  If I'm too busy to control weeds in my fields, I accept crop losses.  I don't expect others to help pull weeds because I am providing a service or growing food they will end up eating.  That attitude shows why the first welfare case in North America was a beekeeper. 

I am thankful for landowners who allow me to put my hives on their land, especially when they are paying me to have hives there.  I ask landowners to notify me if they happen to see problems of vandalism or theft.  I gladly notify farmers if I see fences down, gates open that are supposed to be shut, livestock out, people stealing crops, etc.  I would NEVER imply that I would not do that if a landowner didn't help me manage my hives because I was too lazy/busy to do my own job.  I do those things out of appreciation to the landowner, not in return for them helping me manage my hives.

Self justification for bad behavior...that's all that is.


The previous post is full of self justification for bad behavior by a beekeeper.
Logged
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Online Online

Gender: Female
Posts: 15199


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2011, 11:41:11 PM »

i don't know any of the pollinators that care if their hives swarm or care to do anything about it.  i ask.  they say they are to busy to chase swarms.  they put their hives in the field, pull honey supers, and then take their hives home.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
BjornBee
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3773


Location: Lewisberry, PA


« Reply #23 on: March 05, 2011, 04:53:19 AM »


Let me get this straight.  You admit that you don't do your job (properly manage bees), yet you expect others to pick up the slack for you? 

Yeah...you read that right. What part are you confused about?

I don't go round casting stones and calling each and every beekeeper a lazy bum, suggesting they did not do their job, or pointing fingers because they missed a swarm. You do, and other may, but not me. Sure I try to use good swarm management. I do what I can. But I, as well as many others, do miss a swarm from time to time.

And yes, my farmers do call me. I have a great relationship with them. They have no problems picking up the phone and giving me a call. I fail to see why you have a problem with that. Jealousy perhaps? I don't know....and could care less. Maybe your attitude plays into it.

I simply stated how I run my business. Seems that was a reason for you to get all nasty and go beyond telling your opinion, and attack my own way of doing things. I simply stated my own opinion that I do not feel that every beekeeper out there who misses a swarm, should be labled as a bad beekeeper or made to suggest they failed to do their job. I guess for a beekeeper with a few hives that are micromanaged, by a beekeeper with too much time on their hands, and the wrong attitude towards others, while casting stones, this could be expected.

The rest of your post is just a rant on weeds and other nonsense, so I'll withhold any further explanation. Most is filled with innuendos and additions to what my comments actually state.
Logged

www.bjornapiaries.com
www.pennapic.org
Please Support "National Honey Bee Day"
Northern States Queen Breeders Assoc.  www.nsqba.com
Acebird
Field Bee
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 955


Location: Utica, NY

Just getting started


« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2011, 08:21:52 PM »

Ooh, ooh, get the gloves this could be good!  grin
Logged

Never thought I would do it!
iddee
Galactic Bee
******
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 6135

Location: Randleman, NC


« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2011, 08:33:11 PM »

I think countryboy must be a CNN reporter. He sure can twist a story a million miles from it's original meaning.
Logged

"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*
backyard warrior
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 475

Location: NE PA


« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2011, 08:45:07 PM »

I have to agree with Bjorn i think its the right thing to do to be honest with someone and help each other out any other way it is someone taking advantage of somebody else trying  to make a living. Chasing someone else's swarm of bees is like someone going to a lobster pot and opening it up and taking some of  the lobsters out of the pot because the pot is too full.  The man is there with his bees and if the bees werent there no swarms would be there typically speaking, for the most part i just think without asking the beekeeper you arent doing the right thing.   Chris
Logged
Countryboy
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 239

Location: Central Ohio


« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2011, 09:15:57 PM »

Most is filled with innuendos and additions to what my comments actually state.

You clearly stated that IN RETURN for landowners informing you of swarms, you would let them know of problems on their farm.

I should probably add - if I see livestock out because a tree fell on a fence, or someone drove through a fence, I will alert the landowner.  If a landowner's livestock gets out because they have neglected upkeep on their fences, then I won't bother calling.  If they were concerned about keeping their livestock contained, they wouldn't neglect to keep the fence in working order.  Any farmer who let his livestock get out, and then expected everyone to call him when his livestock got out would not be treated warmly in the community.

If you cared if your hives swarmed, you would be out there doing swarm prevention.  If you have the time to chase swarms, you have the time to do swarm prevention. 

Any beekeeper who claims that they don't have time to properly manage their bees, and expects landowners to call them about swarms, is a disgrace to other beekeepers.  You should be ashamed of yourself.

I am not jealous of a beekeeper who is too lazy to take the time to manage their hives, but they will find the time to chase swarms from their own hives if they can get someone else to babysit their hives.  In the hour it takes to go get a swarm, they could have prevented swarms in a yard or two.

I guess for a beekeeper with a few hives that are micromanaged, by a beekeeper with too much time on their hands, and the wrong attitude towards others, while casting stones, this could be expected.


I have never known a beekeeper with several hives to manage, who would even ask landowners to call them if their hives swarmed.  The only beekeepers I have ever known to do that are small time beekeepers.  Any beekeeper running many hives doesn't have the time to chase swarms - their time is more valuable doing other aspects of beekeeping.

The only time I have known of serious beekeepers collecting swarms was if it was close by and it was a 5 minute job to get it.  (Unless a swarm call is nearby to me, I refer them to a different beekeeper - and I'm still small time.)

I've even known of large apiaries telling swarm calls that they are a registered apiary so they can't collect swarms.

Seems that was a reason for you to get all nasty and go beyond telling your opinion, and attack my own way of doing things. I simply stated my own opinion that I do not feel that every beekeeper out there who misses a swarm, should be labled as a bad beekeeper or made to suggest they failed to do their job.

I don't think you really understood me.  I could care less if a beekeeper's hives swarm.  It's none of my concern if they don't take the time to manage their hives.  What I do have a problem with, is when a beekeeper won't take the time to properly manage their hives, but expects others to pick up the slack for them by calling them when their hives swarm - which is EXACTLY the way you said you run your operation.
Logged
backyard warrior
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 475

Location: NE PA


« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2011, 09:25:22 PM »

I dont know bjorn i guess he is right  rolleyes
Logged
iddee
Galactic Bee
******
Online Online

Gender: Male
Posts: 6135

Location: Randleman, NC


« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2011, 09:41:30 PM »

And this is the way I read this thread........................
Anything can be made into anything the writer wants.....;....





"Two boys are playing hockey on a pond in a Chicago park when one of the boys is suddenly attacked by a crazed Rottweiler.     
Thinking quickly, the other boy takes his hockey stick, shoves it under the dog's collar, twists it and breaks the dog's neck, saving his friend.       
A reporter is standing by, sees the incident, and rushes over to interview the boy.   
"Young Cub Fan Saves Friend from Vicious Animal" he starts writing in his notebook.   
"But I'm not a Cub Fan", the little boy replies.   
"Sorry but since we're in Chicago , I just assumed you were", says the reporter and starts writing again.   
"Sox Fan Rescues Friend from Horrific Attack," he writes in his notebook.   
 
"But I'm not a Sox Fan either, " the little boy replies.   
"Sorry but since we're in Chicago , ' I just assumed you were," says the reporter and starts writing again.       
"Bears Fan Rescues Friend from Horrific Attack," he writes in his notebook.   
 
"I'm not a Bears Fan either," says the boy. "Oh... I assumed   
 
everyone in Chicago was either for the Cubs, Sox or Bears.   
 
What team do you root for?" the reporter asked.   
 
"I'm a Packers fan," the boy replies.       
The reporter starts a new sheet in his notebook and writes...   
 
"Little Bastard from Wisconsin Kills Beloved Family Pet" "
Logged

"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*
BjornBee
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3773


Location: Lewisberry, PA


« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2011, 10:08:59 PM »

  What I do have a problem with, is when a beekeeper won't take the time to properly manage their hives, but expects others to pick up the slack for them by calling them when their hives swarm - which is EXACTLY the way you said you run your operation.

Why do you have a problem with the way I manage my hives, my operation, or swarms. Are you my mother?

Do you really have a problem and get all worried about others with little things like this all the time?

Or is this more about nothing, except nitpicking little things about others?

If a beekeeper had hives on my property, I would certainly feel obigated to call the beekeeper if I saw a hive swarm, or found one hanging on a tree. And for the same respect I show to others, is what I also expect from them.

One thing I know in life is scum, usually make excuses for other scum. One thief, has no problems with another thief. And one person with low morals, always feels comfortable defending others with low morals.

You had bees on my property.....I would call you. And if I had bees on your property, you have made it clear that this is not your job, you would have no respect for me, and would rationalize probably not calling me by suggesting that I was lazy.

That is the difference between you and me. I would call that farmer when the water pump stayed on and the tank was over flowing. I would call that farmer when the cows got out. And I would say something about the folks in the orchard when they were not supposed to be there. You see....that is who I am. And I would not as you have suggested, call the farmer lazy, or feel that he was not doing his job by having such items happen. My farmers know I would give them a call. And my farmers also know that if they see something with my hives....whether a swarm, or a lid blown off...they do the right thing and call me.

Sorry if your view of others is less than what I experience. The old saying is "You want a good neighbor...be a good neighbor". "You want a good friend, then be a good friend".

Not hard concepts to follow.

The only concept that I have a hard time following is your anal approach on caring, responding, and worrying so much as to what I do, don't do, and what relationship I have with my customers.

Maybe you should focus your energy on building better relationships, (if you have any) and know that others are doing far better than the suggested relationships you must have, based on the attitude you display.

It's simple......I call the farmer when the cows get out, and he calls me when the bees swarm. He is happy, and so I am. And I am not interested in any other arrangement less than that.

Try it some time. you may like it.  Wink
Logged

www.bjornapiaries.com
www.pennapic.org
Please Support "National Honey Bee Day"
Northern States Queen Breeders Assoc.  www.nsqba.com
backyard warrior
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 475

Location: NE PA


« Reply #31 on: March 05, 2011, 10:15:14 PM »

thats my theory in life as well i guess thats why being a truck driver sucks so bad cuz everyone is looking out for themselves and it doesnt matter where you drive on the east coast everyone is worried about number 1   sad but true. No offense beemaster Jersey drivers are at the top of the list i have family there and when they come to visit here in the country they drive 10 feet off of each others bumper thinking someone might get in front of them.    butt kick
Logged
Acebird
Field Bee
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 955


Location: Utica, NY

Just getting started


« Reply #32 on: March 06, 2011, 08:17:27 AM »

Quote
Any farmer who let his livestock get out, and then expected everyone to call him when his livestock got out would not be treated warmly in the community.

I don't know about this one countryboy.  I don't think there is a farmer here that takes such a non shellant attitude about their livestock.  They have a lot at stake.  it costs big bucks for livestock and if one gets out and you hit it with your car the farmer looses the animal and pays for your car.  The last thing a farmer wants is his livestock getting free.  OK maybe chickens...

Quote
No offense beemaster Jersey drivers are at the top of the list i have family there and when they come to visit here in the country they drive 10 feet off of each others bumper thinking someone might get in front of them.
   

Different driving skills in different parts of the country.  You would like it here.  Ma and Pa get out in the left lane on divided highways and drive at 30MPH.  You might think that their signals don't work but they are driving brand new cars.  I guess when Pa is driving he doesn't like people blowing by him 70mph in the left lane.  He doesn't notice it in the right lane because Ma has got his view blocked and by now he can't hear her screaming in his right ear cause that one is already deaf. grin
Logged

Never thought I would do it!
Acebird
Field Bee
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 955


Location: Utica, NY

Just getting started


« Reply #33 on: March 06, 2011, 08:21:53 AM »

Quote
It's simple......I call the farmer when the cows get out, and he calls me when the bees swarm. He is happy, and so I am. And I am not interested in any other arrangement less than that.

Working together for the benefit of both ... How could we spread that concept around?

You got my vote on this one Bjorn.
Logged

Never thought I would do it!
edward
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1199


Location: BÖNAN SWEDEN

FEED ME HONEY or I`ll smash your screen !


« Reply #34 on: March 06, 2011, 09:55:16 PM »

If you put up a bait hive , it is better that they end up in a hive than i a chimney , or in the wall of some ones house.

The bee keeper might not mind , you maybee doing him a favour , but honesty is best in the long run.

mvh edward  tongue
Logged
Countryboy
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 239

Location: Central Ohio


« Reply #35 on: March 06, 2011, 11:40:17 PM »

Why do you have a problem with the way I manage my hives, my operation, or swarms. Are you my mother?

I could care less how you manage your hives, swarms, etc. - as long as it does not affect me.  When you try to justify bad behavior on your part, that affects me as a beekeeper by giving me a bad name.  The court of public opinion will convict me of being guilty by association, simply because I am a beekeeper also.

I have a problem with ANYONE who asks others around them to cover their butt because they are too lazy/incompetent/irresponsible/etc.  If you won't make the time to manage your hives to control swarming, don't ask anyone to watch for your swarms.  If you cared if your hive swarmed or not, you would have taken steps to control swarming.

Do you really have a problem and get all worried about others with little things like this all the time?

I won't stand back quietly when I see lazy people asking others to support their bad behavior.  (I despise welfare cases.)  People have a moral duty to speak out against bad behavior.

One thing I know in life is scum, usually make excuses for other scum. One thief, has no problems with another thief. And one person with low morals, always feels comfortable defending others with low morals.

Is that why you are making excuses for your bad behavior?
The inverse is also true.  People who have a problem with others being irresponsible or lazy tend to be harder working and responsible.  They do what needs to be done, and they don't ask others to call them if their hive swarms because they neglected to manage it properly.

You had bees on my property.....I would call you.


And I would tell you that if you were worried about the swarm, to go get a box of your own and put the swarm in it.  Enjoy your bees.

And if I had bees on your property, you have made it clear that this is not your job, you would have no respect for me, and would rationalize probably not calling me by suggesting that I was lazy.

I wouldn't need to rationalize, nor would I need to suggest anything.  The facts speak for themselves.  (Besides, you already admitted that you don't manage your hives properly to control swarming.)

That is the difference between you and me. I would call that farmer when the water pump stayed on and the tank was over flowing. I would call that farmer when the cows got out. And I would say something about the folks in the orchard when they were not supposed to be there. You see....that is who I am.

But are you a person who has enough brains to recognize the difference between swarms due to neglecting your responsibilities, and livestock getting out due to outside influences like a damaged fence or outside influences like thieves?  

There is a big difference between consequences of our own actions, and consequences of actions by others or outside influences.

And I would not as you have suggested, call the farmer lazy, or feel that he was not doing his job by having such items happen.

Once again, it should depend on if it was an accidental, or if it was intentional neglect.  Are you going to call a farmer when their livestock keeps walking through a broken down fence every single time you are there?  Or are you finally going to realize that you are wasting your time trying to help someone who is too lazy/irresponsible to help themselves?  If they were that worried about keeping their livestock in, they would maintain the fence.

And my farmers also know that if they see something with my hives....whether a swarm, or a lid blown off...they do the right thing and call me.

There is a difference between neglect and accident.  I would hope the farmers would realize there is a difference.  

Sorry if your view of others is less than what I experience. The old saying is "You want a good neighbor...be a good neighbor". "You want a good friend, then be a good friend".

Being a good neighbor and being a good friend does not involve picking up the slack for them due to them being lazy/irresponsible.  That actually makes you a bad friend, and a bad neighbor by enabling them to be lazy/irresponsible.

Don't forget that good fences make good neighbors too.

The only concept that I have a hard time following is your anal approach on caring, responding, and worrying so much as to what I do, don't do, and what relationship I have with my customers.

Because you are trying to rationalize and justify not properly managing your hives (your words) and expecting others to pick up the slack for you.  I could care less if you manage your hives properly or not - but don't expect others to pick up the slack for you when you don't properly manage your hives.  Grow a pair - be a man, and accept the consequences of your decisions.  If you won't take the time to properly manage your hives, accept that swarms will fly away and don't expect anyone to call you about it.

Maybe you should focus your energy on building better relationships, (if you have any) and know that others are doing far better than the suggested relationships you must have, based on the attitude you display.

I find that the relationships I build, folks know where I stand.  They know I accept full responsibility and the consequences/rewards of my decisions, and I expect them to accept full responsibility and the consequences/rewards of their decisions.

It's simple......I call the farmer when the cows get out, and he calls me when the bees swarm. He is happy, and so I am.

Did his cows get out because of a decision he made?  Did he neglect to maintain a fence, or did the livestock get out due to accident?
You've already admitted that the bees swarm due to your neglect.  If he calls you, of course you're happy because he just covered your butt.  
If his livestock gets out due to accident, and you call him - he's happy, because he thinks you're being a good neighbor.  In reality, all you did was give him a kiss while you took advantage of him.  (After all, you did say that you calling him about his livestock being out was conditional upon him calling you about swarms due to your neglect.)

Try it some time. you may like it.

No thanks.  I'm not interested in giving anyone a reach-around while I screw them over.  (I don't care if they would be happy with the kiss or not.)  I'd prefer to treat them fairly, and have my dignity.

Try it sometime.  You may like it.  I'm sure they will.

I don't think there is a farmer here that takes such a non shellant attitude about their livestock.

I've known of farmers who let livestock starve to death so they could collect insurance.
I've known of farmers who drag their feet getting their crops harvested, and wildlife decimates their crops through the winter ('Late Nate' comes to mind).
I've known farmers whose livestock kept getting out and eating neighboring farmer's crops - and he only fixed the fence when the grain farmer ordered the hired hands to shoot the livestock on sight if they were seen eating the crops.

There are responsible farmers, and there are irresponsible farmers.  There are responsible beekeepers who properly manage their hives to control swarming, and there are irresponsible beekeepers who choose not to properly manage their hives to control swarming.

People should be smart enough to be able to recognize the difference.

BTW, it is nonchalant, and not non shellant.

it costs big bucks for livestock and if one gets out and you hit it with your car the farmer looses the animal and pays for your car.

If the farmer is too lazy to maintain the fence, he has only himself to blame.  He should have thought of the cost to begin with.
If a beekeeper is too lazy to manage a hive to prevent swarming, he (or she) has only themself to blame.  They should have thought of the cost of losing a swarm before they decided they didn't want to make the time to manage their hive properly.

It is a whole lot easier to plan ahead and act accordingly, than to fly by the seat of your pants and try to catch swarms after they have flown the coop.  An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2011, 08:28:05 PM by Countryboy » Logged
edward
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1199


Location: BÖNAN SWEDEN

FEED ME HONEY or I`ll smash your screen !


« Reply #36 on: March 07, 2011, 07:07:50 AM »

 soapbox rant you seem a bit hostile , are you having a bad day ? rant rant soapbox
Logged
Scadsobees
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3198


Location: Jenison, MI

Best use of smileys in a post award.


« Reply #37 on: March 07, 2011, 09:18:36 AM »

Trying to keep wild animals from doing wild animal things is like trying to contain the contents of a 2-liter  bottle in your hands.

Unless you keep ALL of your hives so weak in that they CAN'T swarm.  But that would be like breaking your cows legs so they CAN'T go through a fence.

But I think most of us here agree...a simple chat with the beekeeper and grandpa would be simplest and easiest.  To assume anything when the getting the answers is so easy would be...well...stupid!
Logged

Rick
Countryboy
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 239

Location: Central Ohio


« Reply #38 on: March 07, 2011, 08:41:18 PM »

Trying to keep wild animals from doing wild animal things is like trying to contain the contents of a 2-liter  bottle in your hands.

That's not what was being discussed though.

Unless you keep ALL of your hives so weak in that they CAN'T swarm.

'Keep' implies management on your part.  Once again, that's not what was being discussed.  What was being discussed was a lack of management.

I have no problem with giving folks a hand-UP if they need it, but I do have a problem giving someone a hand-OUT because they are too lazy/irresponsible to help themselves.

If livestock gets out, the farmer will usually get them back in, and then repair the fence so that it does not happen again.  If the farmer does not take steps to prevent the livestock from getting out again, he will soon find little sympathy from others and they will quit informing him that his livestock is out and they will quit helping him get them back in.

When a beekeeper is too lazy/irresponsible to properly manage their hives to prevent swarming, it is the exact same scenario as the farmer who won't repair the fence, and the livestock keep getting out.  When a beekeeper is too lazy/irresponsible to manage their hives to prevent swarming, but EXPECTS to have swarms (how they maintain numbers) and EXPECTS the landowner to call them when there is a swarm, that is a welfare mentality.  They want others to do the work for them, but yet they want to reap the benefits.

I was in the FFA when I was in high school.  Part of the closing ceremonies is the phrase, "Above all, honest and fair in the game of life."  It bothers me when I see people who are not honest and fair, and who have the welfare mentality of looking for hand-outs, especially when those people are involved int he agricultural endeavor of beekeeping.
Logged
backyard warrior
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 475

Location: NE PA


« Reply #39 on: March 07, 2011, 09:10:11 PM »

Dear countryboy i feel that you are very knowledgable about bees and  i respect your knowledge about bees. But i will tell you this i know bjorn has lots of hives and responsibilites he sells honey, he sells nucs, he does pollination services as well.  He is very knowledgable about bees he answers many of my personal phone calls that im very appreciative of.  I think what he meant by ill watch yours you watch mine is that if a hive happens to swarm and the farmer sees it that he wants him to call him as the same if he sees something the farmer should know.  I understand your part as a lazy beekeeper but bjorn isnt one of them.  He knows how to manage bees and he is very helpful to others so if you are implying that he is a lazy beek and doesnt take care of his hives i dont think you know him too well   Thanks  Chris
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.582 seconds with 22 queries.

Google visited last this page October 09, 2014, 04:20:15 PM