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Author Topic: Help diagnose a lost hive  (Read 4443 times)
T Beek
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« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2011, 05:39:41 PM »

Robo, thanks for more complete explanations of your viewpoint:).

KathyP, not sure yet what your up to Wink.  

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« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2011, 06:13:38 PM »

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KathyP, not sure yet what your up to

maybe i'm not being clear?  if a hive is properly ready for winter the last thing it needs is airflow allowing the heat to suck out.  is that better?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2011, 06:20:42 PM »

I have the luxury of a pretty mild climate - we get a few nights in the teens and that's about it - but if the bees aren't flying in the day I don't open the hives.
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« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2011, 06:40:29 PM »

Robo, thanks for more complete explanations of your viewpoint:).

No problem, and I respect your viewpoints.   It is always good to get multiple view points out there so that folks can make an informed decision on their own. 
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« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2011, 08:03:58 PM »

T-beek

Im on the LCO Reservation right now.  I live in Eau Claire and keep bees in Chippewa County.  Im thinking it would be nice to keep bees up here in the middle of Chequamegon-Nicolet National Forest north of here by barns or somewhere and have a few organic colonies. 

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« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2011, 08:19:12 PM »

Everybody has a right to own opinion, but, some are prety weak, to say the least and I continuously wonder what is there with this upper entrance thing that so terrifies people?  This well known concept has been around in Europe for at lest two centuries, if not more?  
Remember - beekeeping is supposed to be about bees, their needs and not needs and likes/dislikes of us, people!  Until people drop their personal opinions/likes/dislikes, bees will continue to fail.

About failing queen?
Sure,could be?  
But, bees are to know that first, long before beek catches on, that queen is failing and they should have dealt with it?  The times where queens lasted 7 to 9 years are long gone.  
That hive was only 6 months old (first year keeper?) at best and already a failing queen?  Possible but not likely.  I in all of my 56 years of beekeeping have only encountered a few such failures - bees catch such things long before they come to my attention.  Remember; their lives depend on it!
One should safely tuck away the notion about a feral hive in a tree?   Far too often I encounter such bold scenarios.  We are not talking about no feral hive here.  We have a dead and dying hives that are dropping like flies (pardon the pun) all over the world.  The answer; in a tree is so and so...  That does not help none cause we are comparing sour apples with oranges.  This is not just American problem, or Canadian?  It is happening all over and this is only the start.  Sorry, but so it goes, the facts speak for themselves. . .  
Tree itself IS an upper entrance!  The trunk itself, dead or alive, is a living wick for all the moisture and ails of a feral swarm that found refuge - home in such a cavity!

The analogy of open door and open flue in the fireplace?
That is exactly the scenario one must stay away from!  That is CROSS-draft of which I have already preached a lot on this very forum!  Sure, everybody knows that it will suck out most of the warmth of the house?
But, it is a common knowledge that bees don't heat the hive.  They heat only its own cluster.  Any heat that escapes from there goes strait up and under the inner cover where it condenses and drips back if not insulated.  
(There is your moisture of which some think that is not there, impossible even???)  
The interior of the hive is often colder than the exterior.  Tests have long ago proved, that it takes about 72 hours for the temperature to equalise in the hive with temps from outside and vice versa.  (longer if hive is insulated)

Some 'house' analogy would now come handy here though?  I build many a houses in my time and know all about them.  Build one last summer - all alone, despite my advanced age.  
You young bucks...  Have you ever held a 2x6x16 feet on one end, up on the roof and nail it on exact place where a rafter is called for?  I think not!  Carried 4x8 play and  over 100 bundles of shingles up the ladder, alone?  Not many I bet.  Do it when you aproach 70?  Than we will talk some more...

For this "door&chimney" would have to be like this:  Open door = (bottom hive entrance.  
Plus: Fireplace/flue scenario?  
That open flue would have to be directly above the open door to resemble real hive conditions!  Than the draft would go straight up and gently draw with it the moist and dead air from the house.  
Not across the whole house, from the main door, if only open a crack, and to the fireplace, wherever that may be?  That would be deadly scenario, both, for people (in winter) and most certainly for bees - anytime for them!

Thomas?  Didn't I tell you that people don't read and if they do, it is only what interests them - they only pick the stuff that gets surely stuck in their craw?

Anyway, don't you people fret no more, I will not disturb your piece and simple-mindedness on this forum no more.  Do as you will, for that is what have you been doing until now.  Learn as you will...
It is all fine with me.  
I did not come here to lock horns with those who are equipped so and waiting for someone who has something real and time-proven to say and share?  
I came because of the people.  I came to help those who asked for it and firstly I came to help those poor bees, cause they are stuck between the rock and a hard place and such thinkering is not helping them none.  I aim, I hoped to help poor bees, because they have no voice!  They are stuck in those ill prepared boxes and are forced to live there - not by their own design - but simply by fate.  Human hands put them in peril and human hands must help them, for they can not help themselves.  
We took that choice away from them and now they suffer!
Is that fair?
I think and hope not!
Just the other day I read, on some other forum, where someone else also gave up on free help that he selflessly offered!  At the end he said something like this:  "Have it you ways, I have no time nor inclination to argue.  Do as you will, I just pity those poor bees.  On the end it comes simply down to this: "You have dead bees - I have live ones!"

And that, my friends, there in the passing wind goes all the knowledge and the difference that  it could make.

Nobody even heeded: "Learn on the mistakes of others, not on your own."  
We, the old timers, we already paid our dues.  Nobody offered help than - like it is offered now. Free help for the mistakes that are made again now!  We went through that long ago, we paid dearly, bees paid dearly.  Long time ago we erred and we learned from that - does anybody think that we would still be around if we didn't?  Learn right, I mean. . . .

Now I go back to lurking and shaking my old head in disbelief and sorrow. . .
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2011, 09:12:09 PM »

Everybody has a right to own opinion, but, some are prety weak, to say the least and I continuously wonder what is there with this upper entrance thing that so terrifies people?  This well known concept has been around in Europe for at lest two centuries, if not more?

And something I was introduced to by my mentor back in 1959.
 
Quote
Remember - beekeeping is supposed to be about bees, their needs and not needs and likes/dislikes of us, people!  Until people drop their personal opinions/likes/dislikes, bees will continue to fail.

Correct, the question should always be, "what is best for the bees?"

Quote
About failing queen?
Sure,could be?  
But, bees are to know that first, long before beek catches on, that queen is failing and they should have dealt with it?  The times where queens lasted 7 to 9 years are long gone.
That hive was only 6 months old (first year keeper?) at best and already a failing queen?  Possible but not likely.  I in all of my 56 years of beekeeping have only encountered a few such failures - bees catch such things long before they come to my attention.  Remember; their lives depend on it!

These days bees are subjected to a whole host of chemicals placed in the hive to cure varroa & tracheal mites, hive beetles, wax moths, ants, slugs, and even mice. Then they forage where they encounter another avalanche of fungicides, herbicides, and pesticides. Purchased queens are being superseded by receiver hives as soon as sufficient eggs are produced to enable rearing a replacement. The foraged nectar is dehydrated, concentrating the various "..cides" into a toxic mixture. It's nearly impossible to get good queens, except from an organic beekeeper, and impossible from any beekeeper where the state requires chemicals for the treatment of parasites be utilized in anytype of commercial beekeeping business.

Ventilation is necessary to get as much of that junk out of the hive as possible, don't you think that during the evaporation process of turning nectar into honey that a certain amount is going to mix with the atmosphere within the hive?

Quote
One should safely tuck away the notion about a feral hive in a tree?   Far too often I encounter such bold scenarios. We are not talking about no feral hive here. We have a dead and dying hives that are dropping like flies (pardon the pun) all over the world.  The answer; in a tree is so and so...  That does not help none cause we are comparing sour apples with oranges.  This is not just American problem, or Canadian?  It is happening all over and this is only the start.  Sorry, but so it goes, the facts speak for themselves. . .  
Tree itself IS an upper entrance!  The trunk itself, dead or alive, is a living wick for all the moisture and ails of a feral swarm that found refuge - home in such a cavity!

Couldn't have said it better.

Quote
The analogy of open door and open flue in the fireplace?
That is exactly the scenario one must stay away from!  That is CROSS-draft of which I have already preached a lot on this very forum!  Sure, everybody knows that it will suck out most of the warmth of the house?
But, it is a common knowledge that bees don't heat the hive.  They heat only its own cluster.  Any heat that escapes from there goes strait up and under the inner cover where it condenses and drips back if not insulated.  
(There is your moisture of which some think that is not there, impossible even???)  
The interior of the hive is often colder than the exterior.  Tests have long ago proved, that it takes about 72 hours for the temperature to equalise in the hive with temps from outside and vice versa.  (longer if hive is insulated)


Correct again. The vent must be on the same side and directly above the entrance to avoid cross drafts that will rob the hive of heat as well as moisture. If the hive is slanted forward, the moisture will run downhill to the vent and out of the hive.  

Quote
Some 'house' analogy would now come handy here though?  I build many a houses in my time and know all about them.  Build one last summer - all alone, despite my advanced age.  
You young bucks...  Have you ever held a 2x6x16 feet on one end, up on the roof and nail it on exact place where a rafter is called for?  I think not!  Carried 4x8 play and  over 100 bundles of shingles up the ladder, alone?  Not many I bet.  Do it when you aproach 70?  Than we will talk some more...

For this "door&chimney" would have to be like this:  Open door = (bottom hive entrance.  
Plus: Fireplace/flue scenario?  
That open flue would have to be directly above the open door to resemble real hive conditions!  Than the draft would go straight up and gently draw with it the moist and dead air from the house.  
Not across the whole house, from the main door, if only open a crack, and to the fireplace, wherever that may be?  That would be deadly scenario, both, for people (in winter) and most certainly for bees - anytime for them!

Meaning improper or careless location of the vent can doom the hive.  If you want to grow mold and ruin your ceiling remove the vents from the attic.   
For the bees, in today's world, a vent is necessary to allow the foul mix of chemicals to escape from the hive or  let them die from asphyxiation.  We can't live in a house full of natural gas or C2

Quote
Thomas?  Didn't I tell you that people don't read and if they do, it is only what interests them - they only pick the stuff that gets surely stuck in their craw?

If you only read one book about bees you are bound to repeat the experience of the person who wrote the book.  Read several books and you find out there's several points of view, and you also have a larger cache of knowledge from which to draw conclusions when something goes wrong (and it well).  The contents of this forum is akin to a 3rd volume to go with "The Hive and The Honey Bee" and "The ABC & XYZ of Beekeeping."  Use it, Heed it, consult it frequently.

Quote
Anyway, don't you people fret no more, I will not disturb your piece and simple-mindedness on this forum no more.  Do as you will, for that is what have you been doing until now.  Learn as you will...
It is all fine with me.  
I did not come here to lock horns with those who are equipped so and waiting for someone who has something real and time-proven to say and share?  
I came because of the people.  I came to help those who asked for it and firstly I came to help those poor bees, cause they are stuck between the rock and a hard place and such thinkering is not helping them none.  I aim, I hoped to help poor bees, because they have no voice!  They are stuck in those ill prepared boxes and are forced to live there - not by their own design - but simply by fate.  Human hands put them in peril and human hands must help them, for they can not help themselves.  
We took that choice away from them and now they suffer!
Is that fair?
I think and hope not!
Just the other day I read, on some other forum, where someone else also gave up on free help that he selflessly offered!  At the end he said something like this:  "Have it you ways, I have no time nor inclination to argue.  Do as you will, I just pity those poor bees.  On the end it comes simply down to this: "You have dead bees - I have live ones!"

And that, my friends, there in the passing wind goes all the knowledge and the difference that  it could make.

Nobody even heeded: "Learn on the mistakes of others, not on your own."  
We, the old timers, we already paid our dues.  Nobody offered help than - like it is offered now. Free help for the mistakes that are made again now!  We went through that long ago, we paid dearly, bees paid dearly.  Long time ago we erred and we learned from that - does anybody think that we would still be around if we didn't?  Learn right, I mean. . . .

Now I go back to lurking and shaking my old head in disbelief and sorrow. . .

Don't go, you're a good mentor to those who listen and those who should.  For those who should listen, as with most newbees, a mentor much have an extraordinary amount of patience.  But good mentors are hard to find, are highly prized, and their knowledge is sorely missed when no longer available.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 11:19:40 PM by Brian D. Bray » Logged

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« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2011, 09:20:44 PM »

Anyway, don't you people fret no more, I will not disturb your piece and simple-mindedness on this forum no more.  Do as you will, for that is what have you been doing until now.  Learn as you will...

Now I go back to lurking and shaking my old head in disbelief and sorrow. . .

Hello Trot,

Please don’t leave!  I read EVERY word you type and think you have great input.  I’m sure a lot of the silent majority feels the same way.  There are a lot of open minded people out here and we certainly value your inputs.  I’m using insulated hives like Finski, so maybe I can’t apply all your ideas, but I have still gained a lot of insight about bees from your posts.  You clearly have a real love of bees.
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« Reply #28 on: February 20, 2011, 09:48:22 PM »

edited out by me because it was....witchy.... Sad
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 10:01:42 PM by kathyp » Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #29 on: February 21, 2011, 09:15:06 AM »

Trot and Brian, you guys (and a few others) are the reason I even come around here. Either of you would be greatly missed if you decided to stop adding your experiences with such eloquence.  

We can't let the naysayers get us down. They're stuck for their own reasons and we have to accept that its OK, or it can drive you crazy.  

I don't come here to change anyones mind, only to share what works for me and mine and to learn from 'everyone', even those I may disagree with, Robo Wink.   A disagreement over methods shouldn't equate as some kind of challenge to anothers methods, not here on the web anyway, its way to easy to just shut people down and out.   Some of the 'disagreements' on this site 'have' proven very informative, but too often digress to the point of irrelevance.  Some of us should 'pretend' we are right in front of those we are addressing before typing a word.  Its a worthy exercise.

Regardless of the type of forum some will always be looking for a fight, as if beekeeping (life) were some kind of competition.  Hhmmm, ITS NOT Smiley

PS; (besides bee stuff my other most common ongoing project these days is building bookcases Smiley
, never have enough)

thomas
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 09:44:23 AM by T Beek » Logged

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« Reply #30 on: February 21, 2011, 09:30:14 AM »

Thats a lot of valuable time wasted that could be used for more productive things like building beehives.  What a shame!
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« Reply #31 on: February 21, 2011, 09:42:14 AM »

Thats a lot of valuable time wasted that could be used for more productive things like building beehives.  What a shame!
yeh I know, but my body won't let me do too much else these days.  We're practically relatives bee-nuts (well I believe we all are actually).  Spent many years at LCO, 1st at WOJB 84-93, Drove a Hayward School bus route through the rez for 6-7 years and worked at the LCO Housing Authority for 5-6 years during the 90's).  We'll have to get together once the weather breaks and talk bees, don't you think?

thomas
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« Reply #32 on: February 21, 2011, 10:13:54 AM »

Quote
Regardless of the type of forum some will always be looking for a fight, as if beekeeping (life) were some kind of competition.

would that be like the people who insist that you accept what they say or they will take their marbles and go home?  Trot has a lot of knowledge and what he writes is defiantly worth reading.  however, he does not have the right to demand (implied) our respect.  on ventilation, i disagree with him.  that's ok with me.  it seems not to be ok with him.  
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #33 on: February 21, 2011, 10:18:47 AM »

Everybody has a right to own opinion, but, some are prety weak, to say the least and I continuously wonder what is there with this upper entrance thing that so terrifies people?  This well known concept has been around in Europe for at lest two centuries, if not more?  
Remember - beekeeping is supposed to be about bees, their needs and not needs and likes/dislikes of us, people!  Until people drop their personal opinions/likes/dislikes, bees will continue to fail.
Weak?  You are right, everyone is entitled to their own opinions,  but just because you don't agree does not make them weak.  I have no problem with people deciding to use upper entrances.  My concern is when people promote it as the "only" or "best" way.   That is exactly what you are doing by calling anyone's opinion that differs from yours as weak? If upper entrances are required, why is it that for decades many beeks had losses in the 5% range with no upper entrances?


Quote
About failing queen?
Sure,could be?  
But, bees are to know that first, long before beek catches on, that queen is failing and they should have dealt with it?
This is also one of the problems I have with your arguments.  Bees know best, let bees do what they decide, yada yada yada,  oh, except for sealing the nest, don't let them do that they don't know they need extra ventilation.

Quote
 The times where queens lasted 7 to 9 years are long gone.  
Very true.

Quote
That hive was only 6 months old (first year keeper?) at best and already a failing queen?  Possible but not likely.
This is where I disagree.   Why are we hearing of so many package bees immediately attempting to supersede queens?  Let's assume they know best,  do they weigh the current resources/conditions to determine if the risks of attempting to raise a new queen outweigh the faults with the current queen?   If they raise a queen from the egg of the current "bad" queen,  is there a chance that the bad traits will be passed down?  You may disagree, but I truly believe a good portion of winter losses can be attributed to the poor quality queens that are commercially available.  Whatever the cause maybe,  whether it is propagating traits of weak queens that have been nursed along with medication,  or the use of chemical treatments that are detrimental to the queens.

Quote
One should safely tuck away the notion about a feral hive in a tree?   Far too often I encounter such bold scenarios.  We are not talking about no feral hive here.  We have a dead and dying hives that are dropping like flies (pardon the pun) all over the world.  The answer; in a tree is so and so...  That does not help none cause we are comparing sour apples with oranges.  This is not just American problem, or Canadian?  It is happening all over and this is only the start.  Sorry, but so it goes, the facts speak for themselves. . .  

 
Why is it that folks always want to equate feral with trees?   95% of the ferals I deal with are not in trees.  In fact, they are in structures that are more similar to a Langstroth than a tree.  Is a 2x4 wall cavity of an unoccupied building with no insulation and clap board siding more like a tree or a Langstroth.   How about a owl house made out of 3/4" pine?   You can ignore what the ferals are doing, but I will continue to look to them for guidance.  They don't seem to be experiencing this world-wide phenomenon you describe.   Now maybe because they experienced great devastation a decade ago with varroa.  But that seems to point towards survival of the fittest, and not the medicated, nurse along weak bees that we have been doing.  

Quote
Tree itself IS an upper entrance!  The trunk itself, dead or alive, is a living wick for all the moisture and ails of a feral swarm that found refuge - home in such a cavity!
Some maybe, but the majority of the tree colonies I see are more likely to have a mid or bottom entrance.   The same goes for ferals in structures (which aren't a "living wick")
Quote
Anyway, don't you people fret no more, I will not disturb your piece and simple-mindedness on this forum no more.  Do as you will, for that is what have you been doing until now.  Learn as you will...
It is all fine with me.  
I did not come here to lock horns with those who are equipped so and waiting for someone who has something real and time-proven to say and share?  
Why not stick around and share your experiences, obviously some people agree.  Why is not my real and time-proven methods equally as valuable to be shared, discussed and compared?

Quote
I came because of the people.  I came to help those who asked for it and firstly I came to help those poor bees, cause they are stuck between the rock and a hard place and such thinkering is not helping them none.  I aim, I hoped to help poor bees, because they have no voice!  They are stuck in those ill prepared boxes and are forced to live there - not by their own design - but simply by fate.
Although we may disagree on certain practices,  I for one am glad you are here and share your thoughts and what works for you.   I do not want this place to be a one method place.  It benefits no one.  I want multiple, and even opposite views expressed so people can make their own educated decisions.  We don't need more Lemming beekeepers, we need more beekeepers who understand the rationale behind what they are doing.  



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« Reply #34 on: February 21, 2011, 10:24:03 AM »

We can't let the naysayers get us down. They're stuck for their own reasons and we have to accept that its OK, or it can drive you crazy.  

That is a two way street my friend.  I won't argue that bees can survive with upper entrances,  that has been proven by many.   I will dispute the fact it is required.   
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« Reply #35 on: February 21, 2011, 01:29:46 PM »

I don't know man, I can accept that at least for some, it (it being top entrances) is/are required in order to have their bees survive.

As exampled; some have been successfully using top entrances for a very long time which doesn't say "anything" (positive or negative) about anyone Else's methods.  

The main factor I've come to believe is that beekeeping is largely a "regional" endeavor, something most KIT & Bee sellers don't even acknowledge much.  In other words, successful beeks are those who seek the advise from those beeks who've been keeping bees successfully in 'their' area the longest, its what the great majority do one could suppose.  

I've changed my methods and uses of equipment alot since I first caught this bug and I'm STILL evolving and will until I stop keeping bees.

I think that way to often sides are drawn unnecessarily, like lines in the sand.  And if anyone thinks I've done that to anyone here, then I apologize Smiley and will be more careful in the future, but will also call it out when i see it happening Wink

thomas
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 01:51:12 PM by T Beek » Logged

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« Reply #36 on: February 21, 2011, 01:35:07 PM »

and will be more careful in the future, but will also call it out when i see it happening Wink

Fair enough.  We all get too emotionally involved in a discussion at times......
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« Reply #37 on: February 21, 2011, 01:41:18 PM »

Interesting discussion, and really supports what I've heard about beekeepers as a group. Smiley

For what it's worth, I'm going to try an upper entrance on my hives this year.  A local expert at a recent seminar said he uses them in is area and even cited some local researcher who went with a bottomless hive for a winter to prove that air flow isn't as dangerous as some would think, and that insulation isn't as helpful as some think.  I'm sure there's a limit and at some point too much air flow is harmful, but it seems reasonable to me that some is ok.

If nothing else, it will ensure my bees always have a way out for cleansing flights.

In regards to procuring bees, does anyone have a recommendation for a good source of bees and queens?  I would "go local" but it would seem our local suppliers just get truckloads in from the south and west.

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« Reply #38 on: February 21, 2011, 02:00:35 PM »

If you want local, Ask around for beeks selling NUCs.  Make them promise that they're giving you LOCAL bees.  There's at least one about an hour from me, but he doesn't have any until July 4th, which tells me they are likely his bees and not just shipped North.  NUCs are great for a newbie, wish I'd known someone selling them when I sarted out.

Otherwise you may have to settle for shipped bees, of which there are several very good suppliers (and even more availability if your willing to drive to get them).  Don't wait much longer though, the push is on RIGHT NOW so put your order in.

thomas
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« Reply #39 on: February 22, 2011, 10:39:38 PM »

An upper entrance is not required, an upper vent is.  An upper entrance provides an entrance and a vent, look at it as economy of use.
But a means of venting from the bottom is still needed (notice I didn't say required) to provide adequate ventilation be it from SBB, slatted racks, bottomless hive, or reduced lower entrance some means of air flow is necessary for the health of the hive.

In a regular beehive bearding develops quite often during the late spring and throughout the summer.  Bees beard as much to provide ventilation as it is to cool the hive due to crowding.  If bees near the entrance are watched closely it should soon dawn on an observer that some of the bees aligned along the entrance portion of the bottom board are fanning their wings to push air into the hive and another part are fanning their wings to pull air out of the hive, they are airconditioning the hive.  Inside bees are fanning air up one side and down the other in an effort to keep the hive from overheating.

Forage bees returning to the hive land on top of the fanning bees, and enter the hive, forage bees leaving the hive climb up the box a ways and then take off.  Meanwhile the bees aligned along the entrance of the hive (Often referred to as washboarding) continue pushing air in and pulling air out, circulating the air to vent the hive.

The beekeeper in placing an upper entrance/vent (hopefully leaving the lower entrance operational) makes the work of the bees doing the airconditioning less strenuous on the bees as they only have to move the air in two directions, in and up, they no longer have to move it sideways, down and out.

When the bees are heavily engaged in "washboarding" you can actually feel the air movement with your hand, both the in on one side and out the other side of the entrance.  Remove the top for inspection and the air flow stops being returned to one side of the entrance, instead it all flows up and out.  If one watches the entrance where the bees are busy fanning, they can actually see the bees on the return side actually shift there stance and begin fanning in the opposite direction than they had been.

That's why proper ventilation works, the bees are going to do it anyway, feral or domesticated, so why not help.
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