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Author Topic: Dysentery  (Read 2433 times)
tefer2
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« on: January 20, 2011, 11:58:07 AM »

Upon checking on one of my yards yesterday, this is what I found. If you have not seen Dysentery, this is what it looks like.





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« Last Edit: January 21, 2011, 08:10:38 PM by tefer2 » Logged
tefer2
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2011, 12:01:20 PM »

 About a cup of dead bees out front in the snow. Not a good sign.




« Last Edit: January 21, 2011, 08:12:55 PM by tefer2 » Logged
AllenF
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« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2011, 12:03:47 PM »

Just happened?
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tefer2
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« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2011, 12:11:25 PM »

  Yes, just noticed them yesterday. It happened in the last week. This yard got 2 gallons each of Fumagilin-B this fall.
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AllenF
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« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2011, 12:20:09 PM »

Maybe the snow had them blocked off from getting out?   You can drench the meds over the bees with a double strength ratio if we get a warmer couple of days (ya right) if it looks like they stay sick.
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tefer2
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« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2011, 12:30:55 PM »

They got 2 entrances, top and bottom. Cleaning the snow from entries was why I stopped. I don't think it will get warm enough for couple months.






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kathyp
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« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2011, 02:16:31 PM »

looks pretty normal for winter bees that might have been in for a long period and finally got a chance to fly. 
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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tefer2
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« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2011, 02:35:56 PM »

I have a bunch over at this yard. Most have a few streaks on the front. This hive is the only one with the dark color markings on the front. A lot more dead bees than the rest also.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2011, 08:17:48 PM by tefer2 » Logged
AllenF
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« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2011, 09:45:29 AM »

Found this at a hive summer.


Then found the sick bees below the hive.



They last a couple of days down there.   Drenched meds over the hive and they are still with us today.  (or at least a couple of weeks ago during the last warm day we had)
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tefer2
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« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2011, 11:50:33 AM »

AllenF, your streaks look a little lighter in color than mine. This is how it starts and it gets a lot darker as they progress with it. I've had a few clear up with time, but not to often.
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BjornBee
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2011, 07:37:22 AM »

tefer,

Does fumagilin-B hold down dysentery? No. It specifically states on the bottle it is used for nosema.

Does dysentery have anything to do with nosema? While nosema causes dysentery, dysentery is not always caused by nosema.

Now stay with me.....Have you ever taken 10 days of antibiotics? Maybe for Lyme, or some other problem. Many people when taking antibiotics, (and I know I do) come down with the runs. Those same antibiotics that kills the harmful diseases being targeted, also kills off the good stuff like enzymes, beneficial bacteria, etc.

Before CCD rolled around, a few people were looking at the impacts of such broad based medications, and the impacts of changing the gut makeup within the bees.

Except for one year when I treated one yard to compare to the other yards, I never treat for nosema. I maybe have 1 hive in 50-100 that gets the craps. And I have never had a problem with nosema even though I have had my bees tested several times over the years.

I don't feed sugar syrup in the fall except for a few hives. And that is from platform feeders that are emptied by bees actually able to process the syrup every day. I think hive top feeders that allow bees to feed 24 hours a day might be bad for several reasons including excess moisture in the hive promoting mold, etc. I have also seen many situations of others where syrup is more than a few days old and is moldy. (If you actually see mold growth, the syrup started going bad long before that time.

As with most things bad in the hive that causes loss, this is one of them that I feel is advanced by bee management.. Poor feed, blasting the bees with antibiotics, and other factors all play into very unhealthy situations.

You fed with fumagilin so nosema should not of been the cause of dysentery. So you as the beekeeper need to think of the reasons why they have it. Poor feed, moisture and other contributing factors....or perhaps the feeding of medication itself played into it.

I have never seen in the field studies by beekeepers (not the manufacturer or some paid university level grad student who is seeking funds). My own testing showed no difference in dysentery levels, and no difference in overwintering rates of hives treated and not treated.

If you scan down to the bottom of this link page, you can see my hives without and treatment, and the overall average of other beekeeper hives, many of which had been treated with fumagilin.

http://www.bjornapiaries.com/researchatbjorns.html

Your bees had the runs. Probably not from nosema. So the question is why?

I hope this helps.
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tefer2
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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2011, 09:12:31 AM »

 I have my bee's split into two locations this winter so as to access different management idea's with them. This yard got Fumagilin the other one did not. My thoughts are that they have worked up to where the meds are now and the Dysentery may of came from consuming the medication. I guess I can rule out Nosema. The weather will not allow us to look for other reasons until spring.
 

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BjornBee
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2011, 10:02:32 AM »

I have my bee's split into two locations this winter so as to access different management idea's with them. This yard got Fumagilin the other one did not. My thoughts are that they have worked up to where the meds are now and the Dysentery may of came from consuming the medication. I guess I can rule out Nosema. The weather will not allow us to look for other reasons until spring.
 



How or when did you feed fumigilin?

Late season medication feeding usually results in the bees packing in the syrup at the last moment, all around the cluster. This allows the bees to use up, and fend off, any disease early in the season and while the medication is still potency. If your feeding meds, and your bees are not using it immediately, your really just throwing money away, and perhaps compounding the dysentery by having bees feeding on tainted syrup with old antibiotics that are doing more bad than good.
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tefer2
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« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2011, 10:27:04 AM »

Fumagilin was delivered in two gallon top feeders during the second and third week of Sept. I guess I don't really know where they put it or when they consumed it. This is the only hive in the group that appears to have this problem so far.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2011, 12:44:28 PM by tefer2 » Logged
tefer2
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« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2011, 12:56:46 PM »

Bjork, so what you are saying if treating, Nosema treatments should be applied just before closing up for season. Do you think that mid Sept. would be to soon for our climate ?
I know that they will not take the syrup if below 50 degrees most times.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2011, 09:44:07 AM by tefer2 » Logged
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