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Author Topic: who was behind the FCC over internet coup today?  (Read 3285 times)
FRAMEshift
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« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2011, 12:08:26 PM »

you can do your own youtube searches and look at the socialist USA and communist USA sites.  they are pretty open about what they are doing and about working with the democrat party to do it.
I suspect they are engaging in a little ego boosting.  They would like to think they are on the inside of a powerful party.  I don't think that's true these days.  The only time I saw real socialists inside the Democratic Party was when McGovern won the nomination.  Those guys really were socialists and very dangerous but they didn't win because of the choice of members of the Party.  McGovern was in charge of the rules for delegate selection and he was the only one who actually understood the very complex rules.  So he used those rules to win against the wishes of the majority of Democrats.  Which of course is why he only carried Massachusetts. Look, there are neo-Nazis who brag about how their tea party Republican candidate will send the blacks back to Africa.  That does not mean thats the platform of the Republican Party.
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if you looked at the people and organizations that were behind this FCC thing, (they are in the article) you see that they are all progressive groups with the usual suspects behind them.  soros being perhaps the most notable, not just because of this, but because he's also buying into various media outlets.  
What I look at is Slashdot.org.  There are some people there who really understand what is going on with broadband "shaping".... the use of selective blocking of packets to control who gets theirs through.  Those guys are very smart and very much in favor of free speech.  And they are in favor of net neutrality... IF you define it as requiring carriers not to discriminate based on who is sending the packets.  Now I agree with you that tacking on a bunch of other rules is a bad idea.  But if packet discrimination is allowed, that alone will destroy free speech on the internet because at some point that power will be used for political as well as economic purposes.
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you seem like an intelligent person yet you give the  impression that you feel you need the government to look out for you.  some evil profit seeking company might take advantage of you if your beneficent government doesn't step in a act in your best interest?  do you really believe the government acts in the best interest of the individual?  our founders sure didn't.  that's why they wrote a constitution designed to LIMIT government and protect people from it.
As bad as government sometimes is, it is still much more transparent and influenced by the public will than large corporations are.  Yes, I think that I as an individual need government protection from the unethical practices of some companies.  Ask the Enron employees who had their 401ks locked while the top management sold their shares.   Ask the people (including my daughter) who got salmonella poisoning because some factory manager in Georgia decided he didn't really need to keep rats out of the peanut butter processing vats. Etc, etc, etc.

Companies have money as their chief moral good.  That is a useful motivation for free market efficiency, but requires a layer of government regulation for protection of the public.  Yes, I want to see competition in the internet carrier business, but I don't want to see those companies regulating who can say what.
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kathyp
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« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2011, 12:48:54 PM »

lets say i accept your reason for the FCC getting into the internet.  what happens whenever government gets involved in any free market thing?  does government ever limit it's involvement, or does it continually expand regulation and control?

go back and look at McGovern and the people who supported him.  look at policy.  very little difference in stated intent, and where there is a difference, the mcgovernites were more conservative.  might explain why GM was such an obama supporter?  additionally, if you look at congress as a whole, even the liberal wing was far more conservative than most of the left of congress are now.

look at the policy issues that are embraced on those US socialist and US communist pages.  how many have been implemented in full or in part, and how many have been brought up in congress?  do you consider that to be a coincidence?  why has this whitehouse had so much personal interaction with the unions and union bosses?

transparent government?  surely you jest?  you won't have to worry about companies regulating who can say what...and where has that happened?  you will have to worry about the government saying who can say what. the same people who are saying that certain kinds  of speech should be regulated as hate speech, or that every site should be required to air all sides of an argument. 

 i choose the market to control business, because as you say, profit motivates and if they piss people off they lose profit.  does government have any motivator?  no....other than control.  do they care if they piss people off?  no...and you can't vote the FCC out.  it's not accountable to anyone.

i don't think that they will be able to jump right to limiting speech, but i predict that they will float the idea of something like  requiring licenses for all sites soon.  it will not end with the phantom "neutrality".
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
FRAMEshift
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« Reply #22 on: January 02, 2011, 04:55:35 PM »

 It's not what McGovern said publicly that bothered me.  I was in college when McGovern was running.  His campaign manager came to one of my classes.  He was very clear that he and McGovern were socialists.  Yes, he used that word.  He was very ideological and was a total Marxist.  Obama is not that at all, as far as I can tell.  

You are worried that the FCC will go beyond neutrality and regulate content on the net.  I will join you in opposing that.  But the fact that they might eventually try that is not a reason to back off from net neutrality.  

Yes I think government is more transparent that business.  There is the Freedom of Information Act, which has screwed up many a power hungry bureaucrat.  If the FCC tries to register websites, you will know about it.  If Comcast blocks your email message because they don't like your politics, you will never know.  That's why I say that government is more transparent.
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AllenF
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« Reply #23 on: January 02, 2011, 05:11:58 PM »

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kathyp
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« Reply #24 on: January 02, 2011, 05:37:12 PM »

obama sure likes to surround himself with Marxists.  maybe they just make him feel all warm and fuzzy.  not sure how you can look at policy and policy wish list and not call him a Marxist.  we have never had a president closer to Karl than this one! 

you might have missed this as the media pretty much ignored it.  you can google for more info.  the actual doc seems not to be available anymore from this site, but when i have time i search around for it on the UN site.  they have a habit of leaving docs floating around even when they don't really want them out. 

http://www.thinkatheist.com/forum/topics/obama-administration-has?page=4&commentId=1982180%3AComment%3A157009&x=1

we shall see.  history is on my side with this.  i think we will all live to regret it.  if nothing else, it will cost those of us who are heavy internet users more money.  sure to do in some companies like netflix and now the game console manufacturers have all adapted for streaming.  how about things like vonage.....
but hey....it's all good.  government  will protect us.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
kathyp
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« Reply #25 on: January 02, 2011, 05:58:33 PM »

http://www.osce.org/fom/documents/26169

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eugene-volokh/is-the-obama-administrati_b_307132.html

these two will cross your eyes, but there are many  more if you want them.  if you want to know how this "protection" by governments works, look at Canada and many European countries.  what do they have in common?  well, besides no free speech, which they are not really guaranteed anyway, they all require that the government be able to control and regulate communications....including the internet. 

and from the site you like...although the poster seems to have entirely missed the point....

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/10/12/17/1258230/UN-Considering-Control-of-the-Internet

http://www.itnews.com.au/News/242051,un-mulls-internet-regulation-options.aspx
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2011, 11:18:25 PM »

Kathyp and Glenn Beck, my heroes. 

Read some of the stuff being put out by those Obama has surrounded himself with, read their books, the op-eds, speeches, etc.  If that doesn't sound socialist (at the least) then I guess I'd better get the lens on my glasses painted black because I must be blind.

The blind people are those who don't or won't recognize a socialist when they hear one.
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Life is a school.  What have you learned?   Brian      The greatest danger to our society is apathy, vote in every election!
kathyp
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« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2011, 12:02:38 AM »

never been huge Glenn Beck fan, but i give him huge credit for the background stuff he did on admin people and others around obama.  something that the rest of the media chose not to do.  he doesn't seem to be afraid to take on the big boys.

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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Jerrymac
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« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2011, 06:21:58 PM »



Could Congress shut down YouTube with Internet-blacklist bill?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20110106/cm_csm/354566
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AllenF
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« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2011, 06:26:08 PM »

They would not shut it down, just place enough fines (tax) on them to make it worth it for each violation they could fine.
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kingbee
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« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2011, 11:41:34 PM »

... the best current example would be the housing market.  government demands that risky loans must be made and underwrites the risk.  eventually, it all falls apart....who'd a thunk it?...

Just before he took over the House Committee in charge of housing and banking four years ago, Democrat Congressman Barnet Frank said this,

“Homes that are occupied may see an ebb and flow in the price…but you’re not going to see the collapse that you see when people talk a bubble.”

Please tell us what you meant by that, Congressman Frank. 

Now I ask you good people, “Would you buy a used car from this gentelman?"
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