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Author Topic: What Happend Dead Bees  (Read 2836 times)

Offline Dave360

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What Happend Dead Bees
« on: August 29, 2010, 02:41:58 PM »

 Friday night just before dusk I was checking the water buckets in my bee yard and heard a lot of buzzing and noticed that it looked like one of my hives was going to swarm bees spilling out of the entrance and a lot of bees in the air some flying in circles like orientation flights some flying ever which way (new beek so have never seen one swarm but have hived a swarm)  so i put new swarm lure in one of my swarm trap hives and fresh lemon grass oil on the other  then pulled up a seat and watched as it got darker they settled back on front of the hive like a swarm sort of like a tear drop not like bearding so i figured they would stay put till morning as it was now fairly dark and i would brush into new hive in the morning. got up early and found hundreds of dead bees on landing board and hundreds of dead bees on the ground in front of the hive took some pics then waited till sun was fully up bees from inside hive started removing bees from landing board took more pics and put bees from landing board and some from ground in mason jar didn't open hive till later that evening as it was a little cool in am when i opened the hive all seemed fine inside bees quiet didnt see a queen but saw some larva and plenty of caped brood no sign of shb or wax moth damage   so i was wandering if any one new what might have happened.  my thought was maybe they had gotten into some pesticides ? /  I changed water and put new towels in buckets in case it was some how bad but rest of hives (7) seem ok

      Thanks David

Offline kathyp

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2010, 02:48:38 PM »
sounds like robbing.
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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Offline JP

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2010, 05:37:25 PM »
I'm thinking they were robbed as well. See any wax cappings on the bottom board?


...JP
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Offline Dave360

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2010, 08:15:33 PM »
no cappings screened bottom board but i have weed fabric under hive and all frames looked good i have seen robbing and have one hive that if i put on jar of sugar water (hole in cover ) they seem to invite robbers in  but this didn't look like robbers / the swarm on the out side all clustered up i checked about 2 hrs after dark swarm LOOKING cluster was still on hive  where robbers usually go home for the night i thought

   Thanks Dave

Offline tecumseh

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2010, 08:51:48 PM »
do you still have a small cluster hanging to the outside of the hive?  were the dead bees workers or drones?

it almost has the sound of a queen mating although the time of day sounds wrong.  given that you only noticed this hive at the end of the day this could simply mean this was the end of the process.

I would likely take a stick and poke thru the clump to see 1) is there a queen in the clump and 2) is she a laying queen or not.

If there is a queen in the clump and the dead bees are workers then it could qualify as a hostile take over   
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Offline kathyp

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2010, 09:02:08 PM »
could also have been a small swarm that thought better of it and returned.
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline AllenF

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2010, 09:22:49 PM »
My first guess would be robbing.   Second guess would be a AHB swarm flew into your hive right before. 

Offline Dave360

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2010, 10:25:28 PM »
hadn't thought about AHB  but swarm seemed to come from this hive / if swarm left and then returned would civil war break out
when i checked in the morning not all bees in piles were dead some were just very sick acting walking  away to die ?
i will look at pile of dead bees to see if i can find a queen  
is ther any place i could send dead bees to

 thanks all Dave

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Offline tecumseh

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2010, 08:34:44 AM »
you would send any sample to the Texas Apiary Inspection Service at Texas A&M University.  Your county extension agent should be able to forward the sample for you.  This service is free.

good luck...
I am 'the panther that passes in the night'... tecumseh.

Offline JP

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2010, 01:51:32 PM »
What they need from you is at least 100 specimens in a jar of alcohol.


...JP
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Offline Jim 134

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2010, 06:04:45 PM »
You can send the bees to USDA for a free DNA test for AHB   


United States Department Agriculture in MD.

Bee Research Laboratory
Bldg. 476, BARC-East
Beltsville, MD 20705
(301) 504-8821


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Offline AllenF

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2010, 07:43:50 PM »
Is that a feeder I see on top of that hive in the pic?

Offline Dave360

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2010, 08:14:26 PM »
yes it is a feeder jar type under bucket with a hole in top cover /
to send bees i didn't put in alcohol just in mason jar they dont look so good any more (2 days ) to late to add alcohol ?
what kind rubbing ?


  Thanks Again

Offline Jim 134

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2010, 08:31:14 PM »
yes it is a feeder jar type under bucket with a hole in top cover /
to send bees i didn't put in alcohol just in mason jar they dont look so good any more (2 days ) to late to add alcohol ?
 


  I do not know.






what kind rubbing ?


  Thanks Again
 
HOW TO SUBMIT SAMPLES FOR DIAGNOSIS


Samples of Adult Honey Bees

Send at least 100 bees and if possible, select bees that are dying or that died recently. Decayed bees are not satisfactory for examination.
   Bees should be placed in 70% ethyl or methyl alcohol as soon as possible after collection and carefully packed in leak-proof containers.
Alternatively, bees can be placed in a paper bag or loosely wrapped in a paper towel, newspaper, etc. and sent in a mailing tube or heavy cardboard box. AVOID using plastic bags, aluminum foil, waxed paper, tin, glass, etc. because they promote decomposition.



  BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)
"Tell me and I'll forget,show me and I may  remember,involve me and I'll understand"
        Chinese Proverb

"The farmer is the only man in our economy who buys everything at retail, sells everything at wholesale, and pays the freight both ways."
 John F. Kennedy
Franklin County Beekeepers Association MA. http://www.franklinmabeekeepers.org/

Offline tecumseh

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Re: What Happend Dead Bees
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2010, 07:40:21 AM »
I use denatured alcohol which I obtain from a paint store.

where you send the sample will somewhat determine how long it will be before you obtain the information back.  for me (I hand deliver the sample) the Texas Apiary Inspection Service can get you an analysis in about 2 weeks.  The USDA address is likely to take much longer than you think (every time I check there waiting list is monthS long).

I think perhaps AllenF was asking if you had feed on the hive???  If yes then this might explain quite a bit.  ie a leaky feeder and the syrup drip in running out of the hive where the cluster of scavangers has formed.
I am 'the panther that passes in the night'... tecumseh.