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Author Topic: Govt reversal on mammograms  (Read 2707 times)
Keith13
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« on: November 17, 2009, 10:07:00 AM »

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575371,00.html

Ya think this has anything to do with the great healthcare we are about to receive.
I hate conspiracies but could they begin to reduce what the govt has mandated as needed check ups now in heading off what will be provided in the future through our new great universal care

Am I crazy to think this way?

Keith
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Irwin
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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2009, 10:18:09 AM »

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,575371,00.html

Ya think this has anything to do with the great healthcare we are about to receive.
I hate conspiracies but could they begin to reduce what the govt has mandated as needed check ups now in heading off what will be provided in the future through our new great universal care

Am I crazy to think this way?

Keith
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kathyp
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« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2009, 11:36:11 AM »

hang on to your prostates, boys.  those PSA tests are going to go the same way  evil

what they just gave us is the NHS guide to mammograms.  here is the thinking:  most women do not get breast cancer until they are over 50.  those who get it younger, often get a more aggressive form of cancer.  because not many fall into the 2nd group and because their outcomes are usually not as good anyway, there is no percentage in catching their cancer early. 

watch also for groups beginning to recommend drug uses and restrictions.  after all, no point in using those expensive breast cancer drugs just to give someone a small chance of living. 

the drug recs will come for many different diseases that are expensive to treat.  got to start getting the folks used to less!
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

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Keith13
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« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2009, 01:26:13 PM »

apparently Fox news seems to agree maybe I'm not crazy

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/11/17/critics-health-care-rationing-new-breast-cancer-screening-recommendations/

Keith
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annette
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« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2009, 01:38:40 PM »

This made me  totally crazy.  After so many years of yearly mammograms, etc.  Now this reversal.  I don't trust anything that is said anymore.

Very suspicious!!!
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kathyp
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« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2009, 01:49:38 PM »

i don't know why anyone would be surprised.

in the house bill there is a section about imaging machines.  i can't quote it so i probably shouldn't bring it up, but you can look it up.  it has a provision for evaluating use of things like MRI machines.  if they are not being used to 75% of capacity, they will be moved to a place that will use them, or disallowed. 

now....i'm not sure how they are going to do this since they say they are not taking over health care.  that was one nugget i found skimming thought that monstrosity.  imagine how many more are tucked into it?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2009, 03:43:49 PM »

Doctor told me the other day that unless you test postive for the hpv virus then you only get a pap every 3 years.
Apparently they believe the hpv is the biggest factor in getting cervical cancer so if you don't have that then you must be fine, of course you won't know if you are fine for at least three years.
Use to be every year, mandatory. In fact you couldn't get  refills on your birth control pills to go past 12 months without your pap being done. Thats how they got you in the office for your yearly exam and pap test, by only giving you a years supply.
Times are a changin.
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« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2009, 06:09:59 PM »

I saw in the newspaper this morning (and then again on another site) that a new study has showed that un-insured patients are more likely to die after emergency room visits than insured patients. Imediately lifestyle choices of the un-insured and  economic decisions made by doctors(the good ones won't stay where they don't get paid) popped into my head but I didn't see either of those factored into the article rolleyes.  It pretty much just said that if you are un-insured you are more likely to die from the same thing that an insured person would survive...  Me-thinks I'm being manipulated.  What really bothers me is that they are arrogant enough to think we'll all buy it. angry
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reinbeau
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« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2009, 06:54:46 PM »

Britain advises mammograms at and after age 50.  Of course they have a higher death rate from breast cancer than we do - but we're trying really hard to be just like them, so why is anyone surprised at this new 'advisory'?  It's got nothing to do with your health and everything to do with their wallets.
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2009, 07:29:46 PM »

"The bulk of the world’s knowledge is an imaginary construction."--Helen Keller
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« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2009, 07:48:01 PM »

Just another little tid bit.  I heard a radiologist, that specializes in reading mammograms, on Tom Sullivan's radio show this afternoon.   According to her, this is not the first time they have raised it to 50 years.   I guess the same thing happened when Hillarycare was being pushed.   Then about 12 months after Hillarycare died,  they lowered it back down to 40.....Go figure
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indypartridge
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« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2009, 06:55:44 AM »

My wife was 41 when first diagnosed with breast cancer. Her friend was in her early 30's when diagnosed. I've watched my wife march in the "Pink Parade" of survivors at the Komen Race for the Cure in Indy, along with hundreds of other women who sure looked to be considerably younger than 50.
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Keith13
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« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2009, 08:32:46 AM »

I saw in the newspaper this morning (and then again on another site) that a new study has showed that un-insured patients are more likely to die after emergency room visits than insured patients. Imediately lifestyle choices of the un-insured and  economic decisions made by doctors(the good ones won't stay where they don't get paid) popped into my head but I didn't see either of those factored into the article rolleyes.  It pretty much just said that if you are un-insured you are more likely to die from the same thing that an insured person would survive...  Me-thinks I'm being manipulated.  What really bothers me is that they are arrogant enough to think we'll all buy it. angry

A majority of us bought it last November

Keith
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kathyp
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« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2009, 09:55:13 AM »

doing mammograms for women under 50 is not cost effective.  it leads to unnecessary test being done.  they are expensive.  younger women often get a more aggressive form of breast cancer.  treating them is expensive.  the only thing that's not expensive is the mammogram.

get used to it.  it's going to be a numbers game if they get their way.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2009, 10:12:54 AM »

Perhaps if you are younger and have a big family history of breast, prostate, ovarian cancers, you should ask about genetic testing for one of the breast cancer genes.  Where I am, if you are positive for the gene, they will encourage annual screening from a much younger age.

Lone
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reinbeau
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« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2009, 02:23:05 PM »

doing mammograms for women under 50 is not cost effective.  it leads to unnecessary test being done.  they are expensive.  younger women often get a more aggressive form of breast cancer.  treating them is expensive.  the only thing that's not expensive is the mammogram.
I hope you're just quoting the bs flowing in the media and you don't actually believe this.

Quote
get used to it.  it's going to be a numbers game if they get their way.
Unfortunately that's the truth.
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kathyp
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« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2009, 03:03:44 PM »

it's true.  if cost is the consideration, early mammograms are not cost effective.  since cost will be the consideration in a government health care plan, this is the way the need for tests will be determined.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2009, 04:06:44 PM by kathyp » Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2009, 03:36:36 PM »

For Medicare the doctors who are in the top ten percent for procedures ordered or something like that will be penalized.  That mean doctors will be scared to order tests for granny or gramps.  How wonderful.  I cant wait to get old.  Might as well take the pistol and take a walk to the stump.   Oh wait, wont have a pistol.  Guess I will have to take all my medication at once.  Woops, wont have any medication.  Guess the bridge will have to do.
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reinbeau
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« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2009, 05:20:56 PM »

it's true.  if cost is the consideration, early mammograms are not cost effective.  since cost will be the consideration in a government health care plan, this is the way the need for tests will be determined.
I understand it's true, I just refuse to give credence to it.  It saves lives, and that should be the point.  I don't buy into the economic reasoning, especially when it comes to lives.  Seems to me I've seen you go against that grain, too.
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kathyp
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« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2009, 05:36:44 PM »

Quote
I don't buy into the economic reasoning, especially when it comes to lives

i don't either.  just trying to point out that this will be the way decisions will be made.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #20 on: November 18, 2009, 05:56:21 PM »

What about the self breast exams. They are telling us not to do them either until you are 50. Because we might find something like a lump that would need a biopsy that in turn may turn out to be nothing and then all that worry and cost for nothing. Pretty outrageous.
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« Reply #21 on: November 18, 2009, 06:12:39 PM »

What about the self breast exams. They are telling us not to do them either until you are 50. Because we might find something like a lump that would need a biopsy that in turn may turn out to be nothing and then all that worry and cost for nothing. Pretty outrageous.

From what I heard on tv last night they (self breast examination) had no significance at all in detection and prevention increases and they will get ride of funding for training and education women how to do it altogether but tell women to be aware of there breasts.
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Keith13
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« Reply #22 on: November 20, 2009, 08:32:44 AM »

http://www.2theadvocate.com/opinion/70588177.html

Comments from a Dr. at local cancer center. It just blows my mind the recent reversal by the govt.

Keith
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« Reply #23 on: November 20, 2009, 12:02:07 PM »

Now they did a similar reversal on pap smears, not that I disagree.

Its cheaper and easier to let a few women die of it than it is to do the vast majority of the tests needlessly.  It is only a few.

Whether or not we agree with it or not, regardless of their intentions, the timing on these recommendations is just awful.
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« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2009, 07:30:08 PM »

Now they did a similar reversal on pap smears, not that I disagree.

Its cheaper and easier to let a few women die of it than it is to do the vast majority of the tests needlessly.  It is only a few.

Whether or not we agree with it or not, regardless of their intentions, the timing on these recommendations is just awful.

Hh, contere, I think the timing is just perfect to make think a bit more about what they'll really be getting.
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« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2009, 11:03:44 AM »

Western medicine is nothing but an artificial belief system.  Those beliefs were always based on financial issues.  They changed dramatically when insurance came into common usage and will change dramatically again when the financial issues change.  As is already happening.
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