Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
December 25, 2014, 05:52:03 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: Beemaster's official FACEBOOK page
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat  

Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: R.E.M. Health Care Video  (Read 1338 times)
mick
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1450


Location: s/e melbourne australia (-)37.50S 145.0E


« on: September 23, 2009, 03:48:10 AM »

Far be it from me to comment on US politics rolleyes But I will leave it up to REM this time with this official video you may find interesting.

100 billion USD per year to be in Iraq. How many billion for decent healthcare?
Logged
Irwin
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2342


Location: Lakeside OR

howdy all


« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2009, 08:20:05 AM »

Wheres the link huh
Logged

Fight organized crime!  Re-elect no one.
buzzbee
Ken
Administrator
Galactic Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 5533


Location: North Central PA


WWW
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2009, 05:16:18 PM »

And the video you speak is is brought to you by no other than moveon.org. i am always suspicious of anything they co-sponsor.
When we talk about the money spent on Iraq,no one ever mentions people that may be out of work when the war stops. All the ammunition,military equipment,food and so much else is providing jobs to somebody. This all gets lost in what Iraq war costs. How many paychecks are creates? I would really like to know.How many civilians at supply depots have kept their jobs because of the war?  It's not money that just disappears. These people buy homes,buy cars,buy groceries,buy electricity,etc,etc.  Which in turn creates more jobs.
maybe where we reaklly need to reel in spending is on foreign aid. That should pay for a lot of healthcare. When there are natural disasters around the world,maybe we should say sorry,got health care to think of.
Why don't we let the government fix medicare that they have been running,then fix social security which consumes 15 percent of everyones paycheck,then when they get all of that at peak efficiency,maybe we can let them tinker a little with everyones healthcare.

« Last Edit: September 23, 2009, 08:55:13 PM by buzzbee » Logged
mick
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1450


Location: s/e melbourne australia (-)37.50S 145.0E


« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2009, 03:30:47 AM »

I dunno the gremlins got it.
Logged
reinbeau
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2502


Location: Hanson, MA and Lebanon, ME


« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2009, 07:16:36 AM »

The gremlins were smart  Wink
Logged


- Ann, A Gardening Beek -  ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Click for Hanson, Massachusetts Forecast" border="0" height="150" width="256
Irwin
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2342


Location: Lakeside OR

howdy all


« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2009, 09:54:08 AM »

If moveon did I guess I didn't miss much.
Logged

Fight organized crime!  Re-elect no one.
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15329


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2009, 10:52:28 AM »

wars don't last forever.  social welfare programs do...and expand.

you assume that we don't have or get decent health care?  that would be why people from all over the world, including those who get "free" health care, come here for treatment?
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
mick
Queen Bee
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1450


Location: s/e melbourne australia (-)37.50S 145.0E


« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2009, 04:12:29 AM »

Sick people will do whatever it takes and go wherever they can to get the best treatment if they can afford it.

The world over wants affordable health care. Pay doctors and nurses what ever they deserve IMO. Which is more than they get now. Hospitals charging thousands a day for the bed, meals and nurses and everything else is extra and itemised. (I read once that a bandaid was charged at 15 bucks in a US hospital.) is a disgrace.

I just feel sorry for you up there having to pay so much for insurance that doesnt cover much. I reckon your system of having employer provided insurance is to blame for the high cost of health insurance. Your insurance cost is, in reality deducted from your annual wage. So your system lowers real wages and drives up the cost of healthcare. Rich get richer poor get poorer. Theres your fear and consumption again. Have half the country worried about getting sick and they too worried to worry about anything else.

Drug companies release a cancer drug thats costs 10 grand per month for treatment. The government here applies some formula that no one can understand and subsidises some of these drugs but not others. The drug companies know that this happens, thats why they charge so much. They argue that they have to get back the money they spent on research.

Fair enough, but they expect to get it all back in a couple of years.

So why dont a few Governments combine and research and make cheaper drugs? because its all about money not health. The drug companies spend more on lobbying and advertising and defending law suits brought about by releasing drugs too early in their quest for profits.

By changing one Molecule of a treatment, the clock that was running on the patent is reset to zero. Thats why tablets become capsules, then liquids, then sprays, then disolvable tablets etc. Its not better treatment, its making more money. You cant change an old now unrestricted medicine, like Paracetamol  by a Molecule and patent it. You can only make money out of new drugs.

University researchers look back to old medicines that failed and consider what other benefits they might have, thats how Botox came about. Its now "curing" Spasticity and a bloke here is out of his wheelchair for the first time in 20 years thanks to its relaxing his affected muscles.

Theres no cure for cancer apart from surgery in some cases. Some cases fix themselves.Gene research, DNA and all that jazz has now revealed the body fights off cancers all of your life. Ever wonder why you feel crook for a few weeks and the doctor cant find anything wrong? Its your body fighting off another cancer most likely. Just occasionally one forms that your body has no solution to. Thats when it gets diagnosed.

Some people say they get a few extra weeks or months or days by using, taking, doing all sorts of things. Im sure there are as many expensive new drugs that do nothing as do something. You cant complain much if you are 6 foot under. No one can sue. Youd be better off arranging the sale of your corpse back to the drug company for research, get a bit of ya money back. Southern style economics.

We had aone quack here in the 70s, Milan Brich. Started off his miracle cures by having people stand in pits of manure. Then he moved onto all sorts of pills. potions, machines until he was run oout of town and moved to the US did the same thing, got caught and fled to Switaerland where he vanished. No doubt with the millions he made back then.

Some of these modern drug companies are no better than he was.

I want to know what really happens up there if you get sick, say have a hearta in the middle of a mall, spend 14 days in intensive care, 20 days in CCU, 2 weeks in a ward. You have no insurance, you earn 40 grand a year, the bill is $200,000. Do you have to pay it? Can you pay it off? Can you apply for a grant or something? or did they not even bother with CPR?
Logged
reinbeau
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2502


Location: Hanson, MA and Lebanon, ME


« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2009, 04:29:41 AM »

Mick, you surely do make lots of judgements about how things are over here with very little actual experience or facts.  Your post is based on the assumption that most here have inadequate or nonexistent  lousy health insurance - that isn't the case.  70% of the Americans polled were very happy with the insurance they had.  The lamestream media isn't the place to learn much about America.
Logged


- Ann, A Gardening Beek -  ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Click for Hanson, Massachusetts Forecast" border="0" height="150" width="256
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15329


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2009, 01:14:19 PM »

Quote
Hospitals charging thousands a day for the bed, meals and nurses and everything else is extra and itemised. (I read once that a bandaid was charged at 15 bucks in a US hospital.) is a disgrace.

that's because it's not a consumer system.  it's 3rd party payer and the consumer never sees the bill or shops for care. 

Quote
I just feel sorry for you up there having to pay so much for insurance that doesn't cover much.

we do pay a lot.  not because it covers to little, but because it covers to much.  also, because it's usually through an employer instead of the consumer being able to shop their own insurance.  there are many state mandates on what insurance must cover.  why am i paying for pregnancy coverage and prostate exams in a group plan?  i don't need it!

Quote
So your system lowers real wages and drives up the cost of health care. Rich get richer poor get poorer. Theres your fear and consumption again. Have half the country worried about getting sick and they too worried to worry about anything else.

that makes no sense.


Quote
So why dint a few Governments combine and research and make cheaper drugs? because its all about money not health.

we have government funded research here.  not much comes of it.  most breakthrough in treatment come from the private sector.  and yes, profit is a great motivator!  not just profit on the discovery, but stock investments from the private sector.

Quote
defending law suits brought about by releasing drugs too early in their quest for profits.

that's not why they get sued.  they get sued because people expect to always have a good outcome.  all drugs and procedures carry risk.  even aspirin can kill you.  the drug companies get sued because we have a court system that does not consider merit, but only considers outcome.  reform in this area would help a great deal with cost in all areas of medicine. 

Quote
I want to know what really happens up there if you get sick, say have a hearta in the middle of a mall, spend 14 days in intensive care, 20 days in CCU, 2 weeks in a ward. You have no insurance, you earn 40 grand a year, the bill is $200,000. Do you have to pay it? Can you pay it off? Can you apply for a grant or something? or did they not even bother with CPR?


you get the care.  the hospital eats the bill.  we all pay for that, but what we pay is far less than what a government plan would cost us all in care and dollars.  i don't think people should be able to walk on a bill.  you should pay for what you get even if it's 20 bucks a month.  i can't walk out of the grocery store with food just  because i need it.  there is a great deal of public assistance available both through the feds and the states.  many people choose not to take advantage of it.  there are people who do not have insurance because they can not pay for it.  they are a small number and they could be taken care of by changing insurance laws and make an affordable insurance pool available to them.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Highlandsfreedom
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 451


Location: Mesquite, TX


WWW
« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2009, 01:53:18 PM »

http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=8517719
Logged

To bee or not to bee that is the question I wake up to answer that every morning...
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15329


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #11 on: September 25, 2009, 02:04:52 PM »

was ABC one of the networks that refused to show the ads for groups that are against the "public option".  the argument aside, does it not bother you a bit that the networks are pushing an agenda?

ah, here it is.

http://www.politicsdaily.com/2009/08/28/abc-and-nbc-refuse-to-run-ad-critical-of-obama-health-care/

you can google it. there are several articles about it.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.75 seconds with 23 queries.

Google visited last this page December 11, 2014, 03:08:15 PM