Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
December 18, 2014, 04:03:28 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: ATTENTION ALL NEW MEMBERS
PLEASE READ THIS OR YOUR ACCOUNT MAY BE DELETED - CLICK HERE
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat  

Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: why i don't buy queens or packages!!  (Read 2061 times)
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« on: July 15, 2009, 12:56:31 PM »

i posted about my moment of weakness and the queen i purchased.  she was accepted and is laying well.  3 + frames of brood in a beautiful patten...and one giant, beautiful, supersedure cell, probably about ready to open. 

i know what's going to happen.  she'll emerge and kill the queen i bought.   she'll go on her mating flight.  swallows will eat her.  i'll end up with a queenless hive. 

every year, new beekeepers complain that the package/queen they bought....and usually paid extra for marking, is superseded.  this seems to be more the rule these days than the exception.  i don't know why, but there must be a logical reason. 

my only solution is to go out with the shotgun and do target practice on the swallows.  i don't care if the hive make a new queen, but the odds of this one surviving are low.

i guess this is more a venting than anything else, but maybe some of those who raise queens can shed a little light?
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
asprince
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1702

Location: Fort Valley, Georgia


« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2009, 01:06:27 PM »

Kathy, since the it seems that your hive is hell bent to supersede their queen, and events could play out as you have written, how about banking your existing queen in a nuc box with a couple of frames of bees. If the new queen is eaten by the swallows, you can reintroduce her to the hive and hope they will accept her the second time.

Steve
Logged

Politics is supposed to be the second oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resembalance to the first. - Ronald Reagan
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2009, 01:10:16 PM »

thanks for the idea.  if it were earlier in the year, that would be a great idea.  now i think is i lose her, i'll just combine this nuc with a late swarm i picked up.  both could use the numbers.  if i had not had a moment of weakness and purchased this queen that i did not need, this is what i would have done in the first place.  smiley
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
iddee
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 6294

Location: Randleman, NC


« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2009, 03:32:10 PM »

Yep, Kathy, beat yourself up for spending unnecessary funds on bee stuff. You are the first one to ever do that.   huh


 NOT
Logged

"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*
oldenglish
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 272

Location: Snohomish, WA. USA


WWW
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2009, 03:49:36 PM »

If your hive was queenless could they have started the supercedure before the new queen was introduced ?
Also why not just cut out the cell ?
Logged

kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2009, 04:03:56 PM »

Quote
Yep, Kathy, beat yourself up for spending unnecessary funds on bee stuff. You are the first one to ever do that.

are you trying to tell me, in your gentle yet crusty old way, that i am whining?  evil  scolding accepted Cry


Quote
If your hive was queenless could they have started the supercedure before the new queen was introduced


no.  i started this nuc just for this queen and gave them only capped brood.  i introduced the cage the day i made the nuc and am reasonably certain that there was no brood of queen making age added.  could i have missed a stray egg or two?  even if i did, with the queen in there, i would have expected them to not feel the need to start one, or having started one, to tear it out when she was released and laying.

if i take the cell out and they are bent on replacing her, they will make another.  if i take the cell out and something happens to her, or she turns out to be poor quality, i have gained nothing.  there is a chance that she will avoid the swallows and make it back. that would be best.  if she does not, combining still will be a good option.
except for moving frames with queen cells in order to make nucs, i do not dispose of them.  it's a great way to end up with queenless hives.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Wes Sapp
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 133

Location: Aiken, SC


« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2009, 06:58:55 PM »

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,22901.0.html
Logged

Wes Sapp
iddee
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 6294

Location: Randleman, NC


« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2009, 07:32:36 PM »

>>>>are you trying to tell me, in your gentle yet crusty old way, that i am whining?   scolding accepted.<<<<

Just remember, one of the first signs that someone likes you is they start teasing you.  evil

I was just saying what you did was perfectly normal for us nutty beeks.
Logged

"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

*Shel Silverstein*
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2009, 09:08:39 PM »

wes, i believe that was a reference to removing queen cells before you have installed the new queen.  after installing her, if they decide to replace her, removing queen cells may or may not work.  may not, more likely from what i have read.  better to let them try it and perhaps succeed than to end up with a queenless hive.  that said, the hive will not be lost.  at worst, it will be combined with a swarm i have that has a very strong queen.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
tandemrx
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 241

Location: Whitewater, Wisconsin


« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2009, 09:41:27 PM »

I guess I don't see the supercedure as a problem - even with the buying of the queen.

You needed a queen, you bought a queen, you ended up with a queen.  Smiley

Just consider the purchased queen "hired interim management" . . . . a consultant so to speak, just filling the gap until management decides on the new CEO.   cheesy

Logged
Scadsobees
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3198


Location: Jenison, MI

Best use of smileys in a post award.


« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2009, 11:20:13 PM »

Well, if you are afraid of the hive going queenless either way, why not kill the supercedure cell and see what happens?

Probably will leave the queen at least till she's laying well, then use one of HER eggs and supercede with.  At least you've introduced some new genetics if that was your intention.

Rick
Logged

Rick
Dubhe
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 23


Location: Lawng Eyeland, NY


« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2009, 10:06:16 AM »

I wouldn't destroy the cell, after all the bees may sense that the original queen might have a problem.  Rather than bank the original in a nuc, I'd set her up in a hive body over the original hive with a cloake board in between.  Some food, capped brood, and a couple of shakes of young bees.  Face the cloake entrance the opposite way.  Now you can wait for the new queen to emerge below, give her a chance to lay, and see how she does.  Don't like what you see, recombine.  If she turns out okay, pinch off the old queen or use her for a split (which you essentially have).

Good luck
Logged
dragonfly
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 468

Location: 30 mi west of DFW, Tx


« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2009, 11:24:26 AM »


every year, new beekeepers complain that the package/queen they bought....and usually paid extra for marking, is superseded.  this seems to be more the rule these days than the exception.  i don't know why, but there must be a logical reason. 


I suspect it's a bee logic thing. Wink
Logged
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2009, 11:34:49 AM »

well, i'm going to leave them alone and see what happens.  iddee was correct.  i was whining.  the reason for the post is scattered around this site, so i won't recap it.  no great loss if i end up with no queen...except for the money i spent on a queen i didn't need  Crygrin .

i counted 1/2 a dozen swallows having dinner over my hives last night.  maybe it was in celebration of her mating flight!!
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
TwT
Senior Forum
Global Moderator
Galactic Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3384


Location: Walker, La.

Ted


« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2009, 11:41:51 AM »

i posted about my moment of weakness and the queen i purchased.  she was accepted and is laying well.  3 + frames of brood in a beautiful patten...and one giant, beautiful, supersedure cell, probably about ready to open.  


Kathyp sorry to hear that but if it happens that way you kinda asked for it, if that bought queen is laying well then why do you leave the cell in the hive? if that bought queen is doing well and I wanted to keep her then I would remove the cell or the frame its on and make a nuc. sometimes we can manage a hive better than bee's, this sounds like one of them! why take the chance on a vigin queen getting mated and losing a hive when you got a good laying queen going already, just take out the cell, easy to me, dont see why to take the chance
Logged

THAT's ME TO THE LEFT JUST 5 YEARS FROM NOW!!!!!!!!

Never be afraid to try something new.
Amateurs built the ark,
Professionals built the Titanic
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2009, 11:48:22 AM »

i thought about removing it and i thought about making another nuc.  it's late for a nuc here + i didn't want this one in the first place.  as for removing the cell, i thought about that also, but passed on it.  it's real beauty.  huge!  if they don't like the queen they have, and this one makes it, it may work out well.  if they don't like her and keep doing this, i am going to end up queenless anyway. they'll be kicking out drones soon. 

i decided to let it go and see what happens.  wish this had happened earlier because i sure would have pulled that frame and made a nuc.  wish i'd taken a picture.  maybe i'll go see about getting one later....if it's still there.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
TwT
Senior Forum
Global Moderator
Galactic Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3384


Location: Walker, La.

Ted


« Reply #16 on: July 16, 2009, 11:50:18 AM »

just one more question, how long has the new bought queen been in the hive?
Logged

THAT's ME TO THE LEFT JUST 5 YEARS FROM NOW!!!!!!!!

Never be afraid to try something new.
Amateurs built the ark,
Professionals built the Titanic
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 15316


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #17 on: July 16, 2009, 12:01:22 PM »

a couple of weeks.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Irwin
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2343


Location: Lakeside OR

howdy all


« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2009, 08:27:34 AM »

Good luck Kathy grin A person needs to vent every now and then Smiley
Logged

Fight organized crime!  Re-elect no one.
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.363 seconds with 22 queries.

Google visited last this page December 05, 2014, 06:09:12 AM