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Author Topic: supers are on mite are strong  (Read 3893 times)

Offline danno

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supers are on mite are strong
« on: July 09, 2009, 09:44:38 AM »
I have a colony that is very strong with 3 supers going well.  Yesterday I found a very high mite load and if I dont jump on them this colony will colapse.   If I pull the supers to treat I fear they will swarm.  Last night I came up with a plan to put a 3rd deep with foundation to give them room and  something to do and start the treatment.  Will this work and does it make sense?  Any comments would be appreciated

Offline danno

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2009, 10:26:14 AM »
36 veiws 24 hours and no answers?  Thanks!   I'll figure it out for myself

Offline joker1656

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2009, 10:48:00 AM »
I have had a few posts like that, danno.  I don't know why.  Kinda thought maybe I was getting black balled...LOL 

I wish I could help you, but I am a newbie.  I will say it sounds plausible.  I have heard that the main thing is to give the queen enough room anyway.  Since that is what it sounds like you are doing, I would guess that it would work.

I would be interested in the results.       
"Fear not the night.  Fear that which walks the night.  I am that which walks the night, BUT only EVIL need fear me..."-Lt. Col. David Grossman

Online kathyp

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2009, 10:57:53 AM »
if the people who view your posts don't have an answer, do you really just want folks to post any old thing?  to my knowledge, you have done nothing to make people not want to answer you...until now.  perhaps no one has a good answer for you?

it might also be that people don't look in this forum regularly.
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline danno

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2009, 11:16:29 AM »
if the people who view your posts don't have an answer, do you really just want folks to post any old thing?  to my knowledge, you have done nothing to make people not want to answer you...until now.  perhaps no one has a good answer for you?
kathyp maybe i should have asked a question about the Obama or something about the economy.   Sorry I had a bee related question

Some probably many on here have had this same problem.  5 boxes, 2 deeps and 3 mediums filled with a monster colony and a very high mite count.  Its early July and they need a 21 day treatment.  What to do?   Do I pull supers and crowd them down hopeing they'll stay put for 3 weeks?   Do I just wait until after the thistle is done hopeing they dont crash and treat on schedule with all the rest.  Or do I pull supers and give them more room w/ another deep and treat them NOW

Offline Vibe

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2009, 11:40:55 AM »
Some probably many on here have had this same problem.  5 boxes, 2 deeps and 3 mediums filled with a monster colony and a very high mite count.  Its early July and they need a 21 day treatment.  What to do?   Do I pull supers and crowd them down hopeing they'll stay put for 3 weeks?   Do I just wait until after the thistle is done hopeing they dont crash and treat on schedule with all the rest.  Or do I pull supers and give them more room w/ another deep and treat them NOW
Wouldn't dusting with powdered suger help them to self groom the mites down to a level that would hold them over until after the summer? This would avoid any medication contamination of the honey.
But hey. I'm a newby as well and not in a position to give knowledgeable advice.
The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them know anything about the subject.
- Marcus Aurelius -

Offline joker1656

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2009, 11:56:14 AM »
Two things:

First off, I understand your question a bit better, Danno.  I am not qualified to answer.  I thought you were asking about the addition of the deep.  I see now that the question was more about timing of treatment. 

Secondly, I was kidding about being black-balled.  I was attempting to lighten up a bit. 

I definitely see your point about the posts, though.  I don't see why some posts, not mine neccessarily, get few responses.  They are legitimate questions about bees, yet others about off topic subjects get myriad responses. 

Maybe it is the mood.  Maybe no one has a good answer.  Regardless, I generally get questions answered.  It is frustrating when they aren't, though.

Sorry, I am of little help.  I think supers need to be removed for powdered sugar treatments, though.  NOT sure, but I think so.
"Fear not the night.  Fear that which walks the night.  I am that which walks the night, BUT only EVIL need fear me..."-Lt. Col. David Grossman

Offline annette

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2009, 12:15:46 PM »
I was one of the beeks who viewed your post, but I do not treat my bees so I did not have any answer.

Someone will come forth soon, I am sure

Annette

Online kathyp

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2009, 12:19:05 PM »
if it were me, i'd pull the honey supers and do the PS, then put the honey supers back on. if you are worried about them tracking PS into honey, leave the honey supers off for a few hours, but put them where they won't get robbed.

i don't know about others, but i don't check each and every forum every day. when i have time, i catch up.  i saw this one because i looked at the unread posts section this morning.

we all do our best to answer questions as we can.  there are a few very knowledgeable people (not me) who take the bulk of the questions most of the time.  it is unreasonable to think that those few would be able to jump on every question, every time, and give you quick answers.  if you want to get snarky about who answers what, and on what forum, go for it.  i can guarantee that it won't get you better answers, faster.

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline danno

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2009, 12:51:52 PM »
Heres the thing.   I have about 30 mostly strong colonies.  They were all treated this spring.  This one has a problem with mites and many  bees now have deformed wing virus.   I want to nip it in the butt now this weekend and in about 2 hrs  I will be off line for a few days.   I will not treat with honey supers on.  I have used powdered sugar but I think I am to late for that now.   I will most likely use organic acid starting Sat.  I have also wanted to try a heavy smoking with sumac.  Sumac is high in tannic acid (another organic)and I would think it alone might knock a few mites down.  Thistle is coming on fast and this colony would have produced 100#s   I hate to take it out of production but dont want to loose it to mites or to swarming.   Anyway thanks for the help.   

Offline Natalie

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2009, 01:05:04 PM »
There are quite alot of new members to this board so 36 of them probably viewed your post and moved on because they don't know the answer.
I know I don't.
People like Michael, Iddee, JP and Brian who answer alot of questions aren't always on here 24 hours a day, they seem to come on and answer alot of questions every couple of days and maybe they just haven't gotten to yours yet.
Patience is a virtue. ;)

Offline tshnc01

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2009, 01:34:55 PM »
Danno,

Seems to me your logic about getting the supers off, adding another deep and treating is good.  Another option might be to do a "cut down split" per Michael Bush's website http://www.bushfarms.com/beessplits.htm#cutdowncombine.  You could leave the supers on the hive without the brood and let the bees continue to work the thistle (making the most of the honey crop).  As this hive is also raising a new queen, it would break the brood cycle and hopefully help with the mites.  The second hive (the one with the brood), you could go ahead and treat.

...Tim

Offline danno

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2009, 01:41:18 PM »
Danno,

Seems to me your logic about getting the supers off, adding another deep and treating is good.  Another option might be to do a "cut down split" per Michael Bush's website http://www.bushfarms.com/beessplits.htm#cutdowncombine.  You could leave the supers on the hive without the brood and let the bees continue to work the thistle (making the most of the honey crop).  As this hive is also raising a new queen, it would break the brood cycle and hopefully help with the mites.  The second hive (the one with the brood), you could go ahead and treat.

...Tim

Thanks Tim!   This is one route that I didn't consider

Offline iddee

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2009, 09:27:37 PM »
>>>>The Heartland Apicultural Society (HAS) will host its annual summer conference July 9-11 (Thursday – Saturday)<<<<

>>>>July 9-11, 2009 NCSBA Summer Meeting, Wilkesboro, NC <<<<

Please forgive us.

With both HAS and NC beek's summer meeting being held Thurs. thru Sat., you should have warned us ahead that you would have a question. Then all 4 or 5 thousand of us could have canceled our plans and stayed home to answer it.

Let us know in time next year and we will reschedule both events.
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

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Offline Cindi

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2009, 10:34:56 AM »
Danno, where's your O.A. vapourizer?  Why haven't you used that on this colony, you need to help them immediately, they will collapse soon if you don't, plain and simple.  There are probably thousands of mites on that colony.  Get that vapourizer in their and treat them, period.  You know how I feel about not treating mites.  It is integral to this colony, period.  Have a great and most wonderful day, that great health too.  Cindi

PS. You don't have time for that 21 day treatment with formic acid.  Oxalic acid three treatments several days apart.
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Offline David LaFerney

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2009, 02:02:25 PM »
36 veiws 24 hours and no answers?  Thanks!   I'll figure it out for myself

I read it, but I'm not qualified to answer.  However, I would make this observation - try to use a subject line that really sums up what the post is about, I bet a lot of people scan subjects and then only read posts that they think will be interesting. 

Your subject "supers are on mite are strong" is certainly a lot better than "Please Help!" or something like that, but "supers are on mite are strong - What should I do?" might have grabbed the attention of the experts a bit better. 

Might try "supers are on mite are strong - how 'bout them wacky Dems?"

 ;)
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Offline danno

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2009, 08:46:55 AM »
Danno, where's your O.a. vapourizer?  Why haven't you used that on this colony, you need to help them immediately, they will collapse soon if you don't, plain and simple.  There are probably thousands of mites on that colony.  Get that vapourizer in their and treat them, period.  You know how I feel about not treating mites.  It is integral to this colony, period.  Have a great and most wonderful day, that great health too.  Cindi

PS. You don't have time for that 21 day treatment with formic acid.  Oxalic acid three treatments several days apart.

I started friday and will hit them again maybe wed then again beginning of next week.    This colony has a screened bottom board that I put the insert in coated with conola oil.  I checked it on Sat evening and found only a few mites and some pollen all being hauled out by ants.   The only thing they are leaving is the wax scale.  I'm sure its working but would sure like to see some dead.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 04:30:44 PM by danno »

Online kathyp

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #17 on: July 13, 2009, 05:02:28 PM »
i have a hive that had a very high mite count.  i was fussing about it on ventrillo one night.  i checked it the other day and the mite count is very low now.  this is a hive that i have never treated.  it came from a swarm out of a tree hive that throws two or three swarms a year.  i had debated treating this hive, but will wait now and see how they look in a couple of weeks.  

there are two that came from pollination hives that look like they may need to be treated this year.  you just never know how they'll do with mites until you have a chance to observe them for a bit.
.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #18 on: July 13, 2009, 08:24:43 PM »
I just got back in town from HAS.

>a very high mite load

Define this.  How many?  What method?

Partly I probably wouldn't have responded because we obviously have different philosophies:

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesphilosophy.htm

>They were all treated this spring.

So I'm not sure you'll appreciate my advice.

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesfoursimplesteps.htm
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Offline applebwoi

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Re: supers are on mite are strong
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2009, 01:33:37 AM »
Hi Danno,
    I posted a similar question on another forum and also got few answers. Finally got a few and obviously there are some very different opinions about the best way to deal with the situation.  You have the treaters and those that don't.  I think Tim's comment perhaps is the best idea.  I've decided to wait until August and if they make it that long, I may do something to help them through the winter and if they don't make it to the end of August, so it goes.  Not much help here but at least a response.