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Author Topic: They Killed My Bees!!  (Read 3995 times)
sc-bee
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« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2009, 04:17:16 PM »

If you do plan on pursuing as stated above document. Pictures surely would not hurt, sample of bees, and witnesses (probably not family). Contact the agency that handles pesticide use in your area. Have them look before clean-up(because you can not prove where the pictures were taken as silly as that may seem).
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Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2009, 05:01:02 PM »

I wanted to get documentation and pictures, so I called some of the tv stations. I had one that was coming out today, but last night we had thunderstorms! The bee yard is a muddy mess, but so is my lawn! They refused to come out until it was sunny weather!  huh The dead bees are still quite thick on the ground in front of the hives, but if I wait until sunny weather...well, you know.  Sad

I made calls to some other places to try and make reports, etc. It seems that all I get now is answering machines, so the offices are closed for the weekends...everything always happens on the weekends!   angry

I had some brave folks take a look at the piles of dead bees for my witnesses.
Not sure if they would really go to bat for me on this or not though.

I think today calls for some home made pina coladas and sitting down in front of the tv....can't beat satellite tv ans pina coladas!

Brenda


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sc-bee
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« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2009, 08:21:04 AM »

>I think today calls for some home made pina coladas and sitting down in front of the tv....can't beat satellite tv ans pina coladas!

Maybe after the Pina-coladas you will have a whole new perspective.

Is the loss really worth the hassle and future repercussions?
« Last Edit: June 09, 2009, 07:55:35 AM by sc-bee » Logged

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Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2009, 10:12:12 AM »

Someone needs to do something in this county for sure. The county were I live has an underground lake, or aquifer. The aquifer used to be 'pure water' and now it has enough nitrates and other chemicals in it that a bottled water company (who was interested in the aquifer for their water source) told anyone using this water, that it had too high of a carcenogenic content for drinking!

This county has the leading rate for cancer in the state, and I also was told it now had the highest cancer rate in the country; maybe the world!

I can count (from house to house) right down the road I live on, people who I knew all of my life, who recently died from cancer....I lost I lost 6 neighbors within 5 miles...my father also has cancer and he lives within half a mile of me...plus there are many more who are facing a battle with cancer now.

At one of the vegetable fields, a year or so ago, they discovered some 55 gallon barrels buried in the field. They were ordered to be dug up and removed by the farm manager. Anyone who tried working around them got deathly ill. One of the head farm advisers was walking around the area and broke through the tops of one of the barrels with his leg. His leg was 'burned' by the chemicals it contained; supposedly the skin was coming off. The EPA did not know what it was in the barrels! Now the creepy part...as someone removed the barrels in the middle of the night!  This was in a field not too far from my property.

Back in the 60s, they started growing veggies here. Horse radish, potatoes, carrots, greenbeans, pumpkins, popcorn, squash, sweetcorn, etc. It became the Imperial Valley of the Midwest; signs stating such are at all of the entrances to the county. They used more and more chemicals and now seem not to care what happens or how they use them. The newer No-Til method of farming is also using more and more chemicals that we are all exposed to; whether it be directly as in my case, or indirectly, as to those handling the products, or eating the produce. Put it this way, I only eat the veggies that I grow! I know what they use on the foods produced here and want no part of it.

I bought part of my old family farm and wanted to stay here. It has been in the family since 1852 when my grandfather's ancestors came here from Germany. It used to be a good place to live.

Brenda





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kathyp
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« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2009, 10:33:08 AM »

i know a couple of place where they use no chemicals.  let me know if you want the GPS coordinates.  oh....the life expectancy is 40 something, but they die chemical free!
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Rich V
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« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2009, 10:37:58 AM »

You might want to check with your state agriculture office. Illinois has a web site where you can file a complaint. They won't take any action for reimbursement, but they'll make their life miserable by going through all their pass records. You will get a call next time they spray. Sorry about your bees.
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Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2009, 11:54:17 AM »

i know a couple of place where they use no chemicals.  let me know if you want the GPS coordinates.  oh....the life expectancy is 40 something, but they die chemical free!

I would be 'dead before I got there' at my age!  shocked

What DO THEY DIE OF??? Snake bites!? Bullets??  huh

Brenda
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kathyp
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« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2009, 12:00:00 PM »

things like malaria, nasty little worms that get into their eyeballs and livers, cholera, famine, etc.  disease that used to be common in this country, but most here have never seen.

  http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~njpchsgc/pce/cholera_epidemic1849.htm
the age list is interesting.

http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/entry.php?rec=487

http://www.cdc.gov/malaria/history/eradication_us.htm

DDT saved millions of lives and was never proven to do harm, yet it was banned.  it was the most effective chemical and no other has been developed and approved that has worked as well.  millions have died since it was banned.  that's a trade off.  worth it?  depends on where you live....it's use is probably the most important factor in pretty much wiping out malaria in the US last century.

chemicals are a trade off.  proper use gives us the lifestyle we enjoy.  they have their downside, but they have their legitimate uses also.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2009, 12:12:32 PM by kathyp » Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #28 on: June 09, 2009, 09:55:21 AM »

[
DDT saved millions of lives and was never proven to do harm, yet it was banned.  it was the most effective chemical and no other has been developed and approved that has worked as well.  millions have died since it was banned.  that's a trade off.  worth it?  depends on where you live....it's use is probably the most important factor in pretty much wiping out malaria in the US last century.

chemicals are a trade off.  proper use gives us the lifestyle we enjoy.  they have their downside, but they have their legitimate uses also.
[/quote]

Yes, well spoke, but you'll be in the minority for that statment.  Thanks for speeking up. Not everything that comes out of a sprayer is bad, and everyone is as fault as to why our food producers grow the way they do.  How many complain when butter, milk, or what ever goes up 20 cents.  We are the cheepest feed people in the world, I know of no farmers that look forward to going out to spend more money to spray their crops.  If everyone had to go out and produce all of what they needed to live for a year they sure would look at it differently.  And for those of you that do produce 100% of your need you can pat yourself on the back.   What happens in pesticide kills to bees is bad, but they can be replaced, and the farmer, applicator, or who ever did it should be responsible to replace them as well as that years lost crop.  There seems to be so much anger dirrected at the big bad farmers,  or any farmer, but just think about it for a minute of how it got to be that way.  The way things are going it won't be to many more years you'll all be able to go to the store andonly find food produced in another country, and our farms here will lay idle able to heal itself from all the evils.  There are sulutions to these problems, unfortunatly things have to swing really far in one direction before it can start swinging back. 

Camp (most likely just shot myself in the foot again, but it'll heal)
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kathyp
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« Reply #29 on: June 09, 2009, 10:01:59 AM »

Quote
Camp (most likely just shot myself in the foot again, but it'll heal)

 grin

i would be sick to find all my bees dead and i am not unsympathetic here.  i just think balance is important.  this was probably not an intentional malicious attack.  it is another good example of why we must be vigilant and continue to communicate with, and educate people....understanding that there is no cure for stupid, and SH.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #30 on: June 09, 2009, 10:28:46 AM »

Yesterday evening, I was notified that they would be spraying again by air near my property. I was pleased on the heads up and covered the hives so they would not get sprayed. Today is another rainy day, so most of the foragers would not be likely to go far afield anyways. Still, I covered them so they would be out of harms way. I asked about what it was that would be applied, as well as the safe re-entry time.....I was told it was safe after 12 hours. That if my bees were kept in for 12 hours they would be safe.

They just sprayed the 'finger high' greenbeans with a product called "Bifenture". Someone seen 'tiny spiders' in the greenbeans. Spiders?  huh

Highly toxic to bees.....I just did a search online and read about it. It was applied to small pre-bloom greenbeans this morning by air and within 150 feet of my property line. However, when it is applied during the post-bloom in greenbeans, the bees must be removed from the area for a period of five days.

So, after the greenbeans bloom, there is no doubt that I will have to move my hives I have here in my permanent bee yard off of my own property for five days to another location. I know that they will be spraying this product again. After all, they sprayed today because of spiders. rolleyes

Yes we do need to educate people....DDT is not harmless....I am an Oceanographer  shocked and  back in my college days, we studied the effects of DDT in Biology. It slowly builds up and is retained in the system, such as the kidneys, fatty tissues, glands, testes, etc. Use this link and you can calculate just how much DDT your body could handle.

http://www.chem.duke.edu/~jds/cruise_chem/pest/effects.html

Brenda
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kathyp
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« Reply #31 on: June 09, 2009, 11:31:50 AM »

lots of things are potentially liver toxic. Tylenol is one.  perhaps i should have said that none of the problems blamed on DDT were ever proven to be because of DDT.  it was banned because of an activist journalist who wrote a book and stirred up the masses. 

even though many hearings were held, the absolute connection between things like egg shell thinning in predator birds, was not made.   the argument went like this:  DDT gets into water.  DDT gets into fish.  Birds eat fish.  Birds are having problems.  DDT must be to blame.

i am not trying to be a chemicals apologist.  i just detest that kind of logic.  i also detest activists who think that protecting dinner on the hoof is more important than protecting the health and wellbeing of people.

i am glad that the farm and sprayers are communicating with you.  hopefully, you will not experience more loss.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Scadsobees
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« Reply #32 on: June 09, 2009, 01:08:33 PM »

even though many hearings were held, the absolute connection between things like egg shell thinning in predator birds, was not made.   the argument went like this:  DDT gets into water.  DDT gets into fish.  Birds eat fish.  Birds are having problems.  DDT must be to blame.


DDT banned.  Birds getting better now.  tongue

The green beans probably had spider-mites.  Nasty little creatures.
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Rick
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« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2009, 03:19:56 PM »

Welcome to agribusiness! I am an organic CSA farmer, my husband a conventional grain farmer, so I have the joy of seeing this from both sides.

Growing organically is HARD work. Are folks willing to pay the premium?

Growing conventionally has huge costs, too. Again, are people willing to pay what their food is worth? Apparently not, so the gov't subsidizes the system. The other costs are simply put off for generations. If people expect to pay less for their food (in proportion to earnings) than most places on earth, you have to understand the price has simply been shifted elsewhere (contaminated groundwater, huge dead zones in the ocean, depleted soil, etc.)

By the way, I don't know of ANY food growers who are wealthy. Whether conventional or organic, they are all simply out their busting tail, trying to grow the best crops possible in a crazy gambling system, little appreciation, the ups and downs of weather and markets. It truly is a labor of love that more and more are simply forced out of.

But, it is sickening to have lovely bee hives that are in danger of dying because of these chemicals. How are your bees doing so far, RRA?
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The pedigree of honey
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Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2009, 03:41:05 PM »

I am still in business for now, but my profits have been cut down to where I might be standing on the street this fall with a sign.....begging for money!

I depend on the honey sales as a major part of my income, so this year's weather and the spraying have me tightening down the belt some.

Brenda
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trapperbob
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« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2009, 04:18:19 PM »

I feel very fortunate, the farm my bees are on is next to a lot of other farm ground and the farmer that leases it always stops by and tells the owner of the farm where the bees are what day he will be spraying and he only seems to spray herbicides. Says the weeds do more damage to the crops he grows than the bugs. He also tries to spray as early in the morning as possible before the bees start flying. And all I did was catch him in the filed a few years ago and introduce myself and asked if he could let the owner of the small farm know maybe  2 days to a week before he sprays and he always does and I always give him a couple of quarts of honey to say thank you. I feel for your loss if the problem can't be resolved I would not put bees on this property any more no matter how good the honey flows from that area.It is just not worth it. Try to talk to the owner of the farm first and in person if possible. Do not get angry and lose your temper in any way. The foreman may have not told him since you say your not on good terms with him. If that does not work go talk to a lawyer and see what options you may have. I have found most farmers to be very good people though.
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Rebel Rose Apiary
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« Reply #36 on: June 23, 2009, 08:47:50 AM »

The property that I have the bee yard on has been in my family since ah...1852! I bought part of the family farm and have bees there ever since I have had bees. I also live on the same property that I have my bees on. I even moved them close to my house to keep them away from the sprays and trespassers.

It is hard to find any place to move my hives to. With so many of the farmers having kids or grandkids that run 4-wheelers all over their property, they do not want the bees there, as they are worried that the kids will either hit the hives with 4-wheelers and get stung to death, or try opening up the hives and get stung to death. I had a couple of good locations to move them to, but in each case, it was right next to a state highway! Too easy for theives to get to them or for someone to try robbing them for honey and getting stung to death.

Brenda
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kathyp
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« Reply #37 on: June 23, 2009, 10:16:12 AM »

Quote
With so many of the farmers having kids or grandkids that run 4-wheelers all over their property, they do not want the bees there, as they are worried that the kids will either hit the hives with 4-wheelers and get stung to death, or try opening up the hives and get stung to death

if you own the property, then the above falls under NMP.  the kids would only do one of the above, once.  call it....self training.....
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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