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Author Topic: Found--Two dead queens at the hive entrance  (Read 2008 times)
twb
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« on: April 01, 2009, 07:58:10 PM »

One of my hives is down to about 7 or 8 frames of bees in a single med. brood box.  Tonight it is 45 degrees.  Bees are done flying for the day so I'm casually checking all entrances and I find two dead queens at the same hive's entrance.  One is pale yellow/blonde and the other dark/black.  Interesting.  I suppose those bees will need to be checked for a queen and then combined with another hive if none is found?  What would you think?
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"Pleasant words are a honeycomb, sweet to the soul and healing to the bones."  Proverbs 16:24

Sincerely,
TWB
kathyp
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« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2009, 08:04:54 PM »

maybe you had several hatch out and those were the losers?
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2009, 07:50:34 AM »

Agree with kathyp.  Survival of the first to hatch!

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JP
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« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2009, 08:26:57 AM »

maybe you had several hatch out and those were the losers?

Would be my guess also.


...JP
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Rich V
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« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2009, 09:22:42 AM »

A fight to the finish.
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JP
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« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2009, 09:40:19 AM »

Catfight gone bad! chop chop


...JP
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BeeHopper
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« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2009, 04:09:13 PM »

All of the Above  Smiley
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JhnR
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« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2009, 04:35:38 PM »

Maybe she looks like my avatar....
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twb
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« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2009, 08:01:17 PM »

A quick update is in order.  Today I did an inspection and found a virgin queen being chased around aggressively in the hive.  I kept hearing a slight, high pitched buzzing like when you squish a bee and it's still able to buzz.  When I found the unmated queen I decided she or bees near her were making the noise.  All very interesting, that's for sure.  I found 5 more dead or nearly dead queens outside the hive, too.

Since our drones aren't out yet I think the hive is hopeless except for the new, mated queen I am fortunately able to get tomorrow.

This has been very fascinating to observe and it raises more questions than answers.  Why didn't the first queen to emerge kill all others in their cells?  I saw 3 more capped queen cells yet today.  Why are they killing and dumping their only hopes for having a queen?
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"Pleasant words are a honeycomb, sweet to the soul and healing to the bones."  Proverbs 16:24

Sincerely,
TWB
kathyp
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« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2009, 08:06:07 PM »

i wouldn't be so quick to requeen.  chances are, you'll waste your money.  you are early yet, as we are.  if it were my hive, i'd keep an eye on it and wait.  you can always requeen later if you need to.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
JP
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« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2009, 09:08:43 PM »

Do you know what superscedure cells are vs swarm cells?

I would love to look at your hive to see what's going on in there but as Kathy said, don't requeen.

Virgin queens will fight to the death with a victor, survival of the fittest at play here. You want that survivor, she will be your queen.

The high pitched noise you heard was piping. Virgin queens do this to locate other queens so they can rip open their queen cells and kill them.

Aren't bees fun? Wink


...JP
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Irwin
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howdy all


« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2009, 09:16:24 AM »

I wish you had a vid recorder so we all could see.
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BeeHopper
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« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2009, 09:45:15 AM »

Maybe she looks like my avatar....


 grin
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BeeHopper
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« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2009, 09:47:03 AM »

twb,

kathyp and jp are good mentors, follow their lead.  grin
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twb
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« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2009, 08:35:25 PM »

Do you know what superscedure cells are vs swarm cells?

Aren't bees fun? Wink


...JP

Yes, I believe I do and they seem like emergency queen cells to me.  Your encouragement not to requeen has me puzzled, though.  I see no drones or cells for drones so it would be weeks before they are available to mate.  I do have that mated queen in my house as we speak,but I could just take a frame or two of capped brood from another hive and start a nuc with her to wait and see on this hive as you say.  Could you give your reasoning for waiting though?  Thanks.  And yes, the mystery and wonder makes bees fun.
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"Pleasant words are a honeycomb, sweet to the soul and healing to the bones."  Proverbs 16:24

Sincerely,
TWB
JP
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« Reply #15 on: April 03, 2009, 08:48:03 PM »

Twb, what we are saying is you more than likely have a queen now in the hive you have mentioned.

Unless I am missing something, this hive has produced several queens right? You have seen at least two dead and one live in the hive correct?

I can only assume you do have a queen, the victor, who has killed the other virgins in that hive.

If I were you I would thoroughly check that hive for the queen. After her nuptial flight, if she makes it back in the hive, she will start laying somewhere between 3 and 5 days.

I would check the hive for a queen and I would suspect you will find her based on your details thus far, and use the recently purchased queen in another set up, perhaps a nuc.

Remember, if you introduce your purchased queen in a queen right colony they will most likely kill her.


...JP
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"Good friends are as sweet as honey" Winne the Pooh

My pictures can be viewed at http://picasaweb.google.com/pyxicephalus
and
http://picasaweb.google.com/112138792165178452970

My Youtube videos can be viewed here: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=JPthebeeman&aq=f

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twb
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« Reply #16 on: April 04, 2009, 10:21:04 PM »

At your encouragement I will "wait and see" on the hive that kicked out 7 unmated queens so far.  I did start a small nuc today with the caged mated queen, so hopefully our coming winter-like weather will not do them in.  I did see some capped drone brood in a hive today so if they wait a bit before sending her out to become "a lady" maybe she will get mated.  It still seems to early around here for that.  But it will be interesting to "wait and see".  How long before laying workers becomes an issue if no matings happen?
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"Pleasant words are a honeycomb, sweet to the soul and healing to the bones."  Proverbs 16:24

Sincerely,
TWB
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