Need Bees Removed?
International
Beekeeping Forums
April 16, 2014, 02:19:42 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: 24/7 Ventrilo Voice chat -click for instructions and free software here
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar bee removal Login Register Chat(1)  

Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: changes to our medical care?  (Read 3113 times)
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 14802


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2009, 06:05:04 PM »

Quote
Aren't we all in this together or are some people more equal than others?  Why can't the US come up with a real plan?  Oh yes not to mention the outrageous drug prices that have bus loads of Americans coming to Canada to fill prescriptions for one third or less.

we are not all in this together.  we have people who do not produce or contribute and want what i have.  why is that fair.  because they exist, they should have?  why should any of us work if we are going to follow that line of thinking?  i have no problem providing for those who can not take care of themselves.  i have a big problem providing for those who will not take care of themselves, and for people who consistently make poor choices.

our prices are high because unlike you government, ours does not subsidies.  if yours and others did not, prices for us would come down.  why don't you get your government out of the drug business if you are concerned about the prices we pay?

Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
hongsi
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 34


Location: surrey british columbia canada

jook fung


WWW
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2009, 05:31:37 PM »

For the record Canada has used CT scan, PETA scan and MRI from '72,'73 and '82 respectively.  Less than 8% of UK citizens choose private insurance according to Wiki.  BUPA the largest and most comprehensive plan does not cover pregnancy and a host of other problems mostly old age related.  I don't want to sound naive but just why does Hilary want an all inclusive state funded medical system just like every other western industrial nation for the US?
Logged

There will be a time when the old shall be new again  ovid
reinbeau
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2502


Location: Hanson, MA and Lebanon, ME


« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2009, 06:09:51 PM »

It's simple.  It's because we don't want the government in charge of an individual's health.  They can't do anything right, and they're going to control the who, what, when, where and why of my health care?  I don't think so.
Logged


- Ann, A Gardening Beek -  ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Click for Hanson, Massachusetts Forecast" border="0" height="150" width="256
Jerrymac
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 6047


Location: Wolfforth Texas


« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2009, 06:36:26 PM »

I did not read all of this..... YET

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_and_American_health_care_systems_compared
Logged

rainbow sunflower  Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.   rainbow sunflower

 Jerry

My pictures.Type in password;  youview
     http://photobucket.com/albums/v225/Jerry-mac/
gmcharlie
House Bee
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 244


Location: Southern IL


« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2009, 07:44:40 PM »

no offense hongsi( please bear with me I am trying to be nice as this is not the huffington post)  but your saddly mistaken about the entire us health care.   first of   40  million is a bogus number,  secondly,  Most of that number (myself included)  do not want health insurance,  why would I want to pay for a bunch of crap that will tell me I am not covered anyway?  I am self insured,  I pay my own bills.  (unfortunatly our goverment has seen it so we CANNOT buy a catasropic plan)
MOST importatnly  ALL  your great health care comes from the American system  The "high priced drugs" you whine about were invented here  by compinies to make a profit,  preferably a big one.  the same can be said about anything from heart surgery to bunions.....  Well intention russians or cannucks have no incentive to invent anything,  and a a result  don't.   
Sorry if i wanted socilized health care I would live in Cuba or.....  I don't  I don't want to pay for transexual operations in Cuba and not be able to help my mom (or me later) with her meds because my damm taxes are to high,  or not get treatment becase shes too old by some silly formula!     

We have places in the world for that type of health care,  funny no one is moving there.........(darn the luck)  I resect your opinion,  but not your facts!
Logged
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 14802


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #25 on: February 21, 2009, 07:49:34 PM »

Quote
I don't want to sound naive but just why does Hilary want an all inclusive state funded medical system just like every other western industrial nation for the US?

because hillary is a liberal.  liberals believe that it is the governments job to take care of people.  they do not trust people to make their own choices.  in their minds, the government should have a say, if not run, all aspects of life.  the more dependent people are on government, the more secure government is.  the more liberals give people, the more secure their jobs are.

liberals as socialists to one degree or another.  they believe that what i have earned should be given to government to redistribute to those who have not earned.  

yes, you have MRIs, etc.  it's just that you can't get access to them when you need them.

i am pretty familiar with the medical system in GB.  it sucks.  long waits.  inadequate meds.  not enough beds or surgons...you may have to travel across country to get something like bypass surgery...after you wait months for it (if you don't die).   you can't get  new meds for diseases if they are not approved and they won't be approved if they cost to much.  hospitals are falling apart and dirty.  they have high rates of in hospital infection.  they have open wards and communal eating on wards which facilitates spread of infection.  t hey are still using '70 SOC for treatment of diabetes and wound care.  suggested fixes have included rationed care for elderly (they already have it but don't know it) and active euthanasia for infants and ill.
Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
hongsi
New Bee
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 34


Location: surrey british columbia canada

jook fung


WWW
« Reply #26 on: February 23, 2009, 10:47:01 AM »

Has jerrymac read up on Wiki comparison.......YET?  I bet if he has he has had a big....... SURPRISE!  The stats show a marginally better show for the Canadian health system overall with a slightly longer life expectancy and a better overall state of individual health.  Drugs are cheaper here for a great many reasons all resulting from the expressed wish of the people who still feel that the government is an extension of their expressed will.  We feel confident that our state run institutions are there because we want them there.  Our recently failed gun control debacle is proof positive that here if people don't want something it won't be forced on them. People want their firearms for very valid reasons but maintaining a home arsenal for overthrowing a bad government should it become necessary?.....GOOD HUMOUR.  But what the hell if it gets you out in the bush or on the range thats fine.
Logged

There will be a time when the old shall be new again  ovid
kathyp
Universal Bee
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 14802


Location: boring, oregon


« Reply #27 on: February 23, 2009, 11:12:23 AM »

Quote
We feel confident that our state run institutions are there because we want them there.  Our recently failed gun control debacle is proof positive that here if people don't want something it won't be forced on them. People want their firearms for very valid reasons but maintaining a home arsenal for overthrowing a bad government should it become necessary?.....GOOD HUMOUR.  But what the hell if it gets you out in the bush or on the range thats fine.


If you are confident in your state run programs and want to keep them, that's fine for you.  i wonder what would happen if the TAXPAYERS decided they didn't want those programs anymore.  what are the odds that you could get rid of them?  pretty slim, i'd guess.  as for subsidizing and controlling drug prices...someone pays.  a government earns and produces nothing.  all that they have, they have because they took from others. 
it takes a drug company many years and billions of dollars to get drugs through the approval process.  they may develop 10 drugs and only get 1 or 2 approved.  if profit is removed from the equation, they will cease to develop new drugs.  you do pay for your drugs.  you pay in taxes.  we pay to make up what you will not pay.  if we cease to pay, all will suffer from lack of development.

guns....you have a great deal of confidence in your government to allow them to decide what is a valid reason for keeping guns.  our country was founded on the notion that government is not the best entity to decided what is best for us.  sadly, we are rapidly getting away from that founding notion.

 
Quote
The stats show a marginally better show for the Canadian health system overall with a slightly longer life expectancy and a better overall state of individual health.

before you accept these stats, you have to know what they are base on.  generally, they are based on hospital mortality and morbidity reports, and general age of death, they are not valid.  this includes infant mortality rates.

we have large numbers of legal and illegal immigrants and "medical tourists" who come here for treatment.  very often, they had little or not care at home.  they are already sick.  pregnant women come from the south to give birth and have very often not seen a doctor.  we have large numbers of SE asian, arab, and others who come here and all receive care and become part of the statistic.  we have HIGH RISK canadian pregnancies that come and are added in.

there is great risk in keeping government out of our lives.  it means that we have to be responsible for our own futures.  it is far easier to turn our future over to the government.  to let the government take care of us. 

Logged

.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Jerrymac
Galactic Bee
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 6047


Location: Wolfforth Texas


« Reply #28 on: February 23, 2009, 08:44:05 PM »

Has jerrymac read up on Wiki comparison.......YET?  I bet if he has he has had a big....... SURPRISE!  The stats show a marginally better show for the Canadian health system overall with a slightly longer life expectancy and a better overall state of individual health.  Drugs are cheaper here for a great many reasons all resulting from the expressed wish of the people who still feel that the government is an extension of their expressed will.  We feel confident that our state run institutions are there because we want them there.  Our recently failed gun control debacle is proof positive that here if people don't want something it won't be forced on them. People want their firearms for very valid reasons but maintaining a home arsenal for overthrowing a bad government should it become necessary?.....GOOD HUMOUR.  But what the hell if it gets you out in the bush or on the range thats fine.


So post a link to something that backs up what you say.
Logged

rainbow sunflower  Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.   rainbow sunflower

 Jerry

My pictures.Type in password;  youview
     http://photobucket.com/albums/v225/Jerry-mac/
reinbeau
Super Bee
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2502


Location: Hanson, MA and Lebanon, ME


« Reply #29 on: February 23, 2009, 09:02:21 PM »

Has jerrymac read up on Wiki comparison.......YET?  I bet if he has he has had a big....... SURPRISE!  The stats show a marginally better show for the Canadian health system overall with a slightly longer life expectancy and a better overall state of individual health.  Drugs are cheaper here for a great many reasons all resulting from the expressed wish of the people who still feel that the government is an extension of their expressed will.  We feel confident that our state run institutions are there because we want them there.  Our recently failed gun control debacle is proof positive that here if people don't want something it won't be forced on them. People want their firearms for very valid reasons but maintaining a home arsenal for overthrowing a bad government should it become necessary?.....GOOD HUMOUR.  But what the hell if it gets you out in the bush or on the range thats fine.


So post a link to something that backs up what you say.

And not a Wiki page that can be changed by anyone with an agenda.
Logged


- Ann, A Gardening Beek -  ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Click for Hanson, Massachusetts Forecast" border="0" height="150" width="256
Pages: 1 [2]  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Beemaster's Beekeeping Ring
Previous | Home | Join | Random | Next
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Sitemap Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 1.19 seconds with 21 queries.

Google visited last this page April 13, 2014, 03:56:34 AM
anything