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Author Topic: Feeding pollen and splits  (Read 979 times)
gmcharlie
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« on: February 04, 2009, 04:26:57 PM »

Started feeding pollen patties (from global great people)  Jan 1st  here in Southern Il,  thought is that 45 days to foragers would be mid march,  and late march here is apple blosoms already.    Don't know if its to soo or to late.  can't seem to find much opionions on starting the spring buildup.  all my hives (6) are doing great with good numbers of bees.  My plan is to take 2-3 frames of brood and 2-3 of honey and a new queen as soon as I can get a new queen.  I have been told the bees that stay on the frames and don't fly will be good nurse bees for the new hive and a good start without decimation of the old hive.  since 3 of my hives were actually honeybound going into the fall seems like the best plan.  any flaws in my thinking?   
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2009, 10:14:49 PM »

I assume you are using double deeps or the equivalent of the hives.  If so you plan seems to be fine.  If you want to split sooner, consider doing th splits when you notice a noticable populaton of drones.  A walkaway split will work, raising its own queens and if done after a drone population is already established the drones will be mature enough when needed.  You'll also save the cost of queens and can split in late March or Early April instead of waiting to May when queens become available.
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Life is a school.  What have you learned?   Brian      The greatest danger to our society is apathy, vote in every election!
gmcharlie
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« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2009, 10:15:27 AM »

I thought about that but my brain tells me that them raising their own queen wiould cause a 45 day delay with no laying queen(roughly)  my assuption is that they would fair better and produce better as a complete hive until queens are avalible.   SO I guess the question is are the "surplus" bees at that point better off as potential forages for the first queen,  or are they actually consuming hood without providing any real support at that point??   Probably not worded correctly  but I think you get my thoughts.

Thanks
Charlie
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Brian D. Bray
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« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2009, 08:25:43 PM »

45 days is the worst case senario.  Workers bees will forage, queen or no queen.  In a walkaway split the population might decline a bit before the queen hatches, mates, and starts laying.  But there are several factors in the beekeepers favor.
The unhatched brood in the frames used to create the split, the ability to add additional frames of brood, shaking in more workeds, or feeding the hive.  The workers will continue to forage for nectar and pollen so that there is a store of both by the time the queen is ready to begin laying.
They will consume food but probably not as much as they gather so the food situatiion is a plus not a negative.
The negative is the same as you'd get with a package as far as decline of ppopulation is concerned and in a package the queen is probably idle the 1st week anyway and then in very limited way depending on how fast comb is built.  In comb building only a portion can be used for brood as it is still necessary to set stores aside and much of the new comb is used for that.
So look at a split much like a package, the difference being a trade off between how soon the queen begins laying and developed comb.
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jsmob
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« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2009, 11:54:27 PM »

 If you have 6 hives and you have drones flying why not try to do the C.C. Miller Method.
Michael Bush has a great page on this.  bushfarms.com/beesqueenrearing.htm
 Just before the topic "Cell Starter" there is a list of names. Click on the Miller method and it will give you all the info on the Miller Method.
 
You can shake a couple of frames of bees from each hive into a queen less hive and raise your Owen queen with out much of an in pack on your donor hives.
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gmcharlie
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« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2009, 10:30:02 AM »

I read the miller method,  thanks for the link!...  One thing he mentioned in there was going back 10 days later and cutting out the extra queens,  Lesat thats what I understood.   Do you still do that in a walkaway,  or do you let them battle it out?   Seems to me it might be a good time (if there are  several queens)  to put them with just a few nurse bees in a nuc and see what grows.   Nothing lost but a few nurse bees,  and if they do well it seems like a free queen..?

Charlie
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jsmob
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« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2009, 09:20:03 PM »

Quote
Seems to me it might be a good time (if there are  several queens)  to put them with just a few nurse bees in a nuc and see what grows.   Nothing lost but a few nurse bees,  and if they do well it seems like a free queen..?

 If you are thinking in this direction you might find this link fascinating. www.mdasplitter.com/index.htm
I am going to try this out and see if I can gain some of my losses back. I don't know if I like the idea of just letting a hive less then a year old just fade. I will have to think that one out.
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gmcharlie
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« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2009, 09:44:50 AM »

I have to really thank you guys,  I read a lot  but most of the links and stuff that I have found here I have never seen before......  I am really enjoying this site and the others on here!  My winter boredom is getting better!   I was so bored I made a radial extractor from an old washing machine.....    Time much better spent reading!

Thanks!
Charlie
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