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Author Topic: Stop the queen from laying in frames  (Read 2090 times)
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« on: December 13, 2008, 10:59:33 PM »

I needed to get the queen to stop laying in some frames I had in my TBH so I could remove the frames. Here's how I was able to get it done. Thanks!

http://www.johncall.com/blog/beekeeping-how-to-make-the-queen-stop-laying-in-certain-frames/
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2008, 06:47:19 AM »

My guess is that putting them in another location contributed more than putting them upside down, but the important thing is that it worked.

Back in the 1880's it was common to flip the frames upside down to prevent swarming and did not seem to discourage the queen at all.

"While the reversing of brood combs will produce no ill effects whatever, numerous are the advantages arising from such reversal; some of which aid us materially in accomplishing the desired results which are partially accomplished in the contracting system, above described.

"When using frames even no deeper than the standard Langstroth, you know how the bees (especially Italians) will persist in crowding the queen by storing honey that ought to go into the surplus department, along the upper edge of the brood combs, just under the top bar, and farther down in the upper corners, till by actual measurement we find that nearly one-fourth of each frame, and sometimes more, is occupied with honey.

"Now if we reverse the frame containing a comb so tilled, we place the honey in an unusual position; in a place usually occupied with brood, and when this is done in the breeding season, when the bees are not inclined to decrease their quantity of brood, this honey will be immediately removed to the surplus department, and soon the frame will be one solid sheet of brood, which is a glad sight to the bee-keeper whose experience has taught him the value of a compact brood nest, free from honey."--Success in Beeculture by James Heddon Pg 85

"The engraving represents the reversible brood-frame made by Mr. James Heddon. Many devices have been presented to reverse the frames, but this is as good as any, where reversing is desired."--Bees and honey, or, The management of an apiary for pleasure and profit by Thomas G. Newman pg 44


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Michael Bush
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« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2008, 08:43:57 AM »

Interesting. They didn't tell me to put them in the back but to flip them where they were. I put them in the back because the lips of the frame wouldn't let me turn them upside-down where they were.

Wish I could test it both ways.
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ArmucheeBee
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« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2008, 02:19:12 PM »

I have a Kenyan TB with sloping sides that I hope to get a swarm into this spring.  How would you exclude a queen from laying in the combs of this type of hive.  Or can you?  Not that I want to try to exclude her but for information sake.  You can't very well turn the comb upside down due to it's sloped sides.  I figured on pulling larvae out by hand if I wanted to harvest the comb.  For me it's just another interest and another build.  Of course I could cut down a metal queen excluder to form the "v".
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« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2008, 02:33:56 PM »

It won't absolutely prevent her from laying,  but move to the outside will deter her, as well as putting full frames of honey between her and the comb you don't want her to lay in.
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« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2008, 02:37:04 PM »

I have to agree with Micheal on this, it is more the placement than the inverting.   At one time, I started 2 TBHs with nucs and as they built new comb,  I slowly moved the frames to the end of the hive,  where the queen stopped laying in them and then removed them.
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2009, 09:41:15 AM »

Flipping the frames never failed for me! It is a tried tested and proven method and it has the advantage of getting the old comb out fast.
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« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2009, 10:37:58 PM »

Flipping the frames never failed for me! It is a tried tested and proven method and it has the advantage of getting the old comb out fast.

It works if you remove the frames fairly rapidly once the brood hatches, but if they are left to linger in the hive and/or the brood chamber is enlarged to encompass thos frames again, the queen will start laying in them again.  So, yes, it works effectively in the short hall as long as the frames are removed in a timely fashion.
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