For those who think treating with sugar is "Non-Chemical"

[T Beek]

I'm still gonna leave em plenty and take mine in the Spring, it works for me.

thomas

[fat/beeman]

hello
lot of reading on sugar here got me confused.if you have flower in your yard that produces a sugar nectar that bees collect is that a chemical.let say I feed EO of lavender in sugar water is that a chemical,but lets say the bees collect it from same plant what's the difference? bottom line at the end of yr who's hives are alive? yes you can raise bees with no intervention but only in small cases.
Don

[T Beek]

I guess the diference lies in the substance and how much humans have messed with it when compared to naturally collected nectur, In other words, sugar, even refined white sugar is still pretty basic, while fumagilin-B, for example, is not.

thomas

[Acebird]

sugar, even refined white sugar is still pretty basic,

So is corn syrup, so is beet syrup or any other sugar derived from a plant.  What have they done to the plant, how it is grown, where it is grown and then what did they do to it in the processes that follow.  All pretty basic but not the nectar that bees normally collect.

[Robo]

The original intent of this post was more on semantics, than actual treatment with chemicals.   The point being that everything is a chemical.  Yes there are bad chemicals, like a lot of the synthetic commercially available treatments, and there are potentially less harmful chemicals like the organic acids, essential oils, sugar, etc.

Yes everyone can have their own opinions of how bad or good a given "chemical" is, and can draw their own line in the sand as far as their practices.   My point is, if you are applying anything to your hive,  please don't say you are "chemical-free"

[Jim 134]

The original intent of this post was more on semantics, than actual treatment with chemicals.   The point being that everything is a chemical.  Yes there are bad chemicals, like a lot of the synthetic commercially available treatments, and there are potentially less harmful chemicals like the organic acids, essential oils, sugar, etc.

Yes everyone can have thereir own opinions of how bad or good a given "chemical" is, and can draw their own line in the sand as far as their practices.   My point is, if you are applying anything to your hive,  please don't say you are "chemical-free"

Robo   Do you use a smoker or use sugar, pollen supplement or Bee-Go, bee quick 

    BEE HAPPY Jim 134  

[Robo]

Robo   Do you use a smoker or use sugar, pollen supplement or Bee-Go, bee quick 

Yes I do,  but I don't claim the be chemical-free either

[Acebird]

OK, Let me say that I have made up my mind that sugar is a chemical.  If it is a chemical and I treat my bees with it have I broken the rules of "Natural and Organic Bee Keeping Methods?"  Have I not broken the rules if it is not considered a chemical treatment?

[deknow]

...what "rules" are you trying to adhere to?
deknow

[Acebird]

...what "rules" are you trying to adhere to?
deknow

The catagory that these topics are put under.

Natural and Organic Bee Keeping Methods

[deknow]

ok, very good, you have posted the title of the category.

now, what rules are you referring to?

deknow

[wd]

hello
lot of reading on sugar here got me confused.if you have flower in your yard that produces a sugar nectar that bees collect is that a chemical.let say I feed EO of lavender in sugar water is that a chemical,but lets say the bees collect it from same plant what's the difference? bottom line at the end of yr who's hives are alive? yes you can raise bees with no intervention but only in small cases.
Don

 The only difference I see is Once man processes it, it's then considered man made / artificial / synthetic, etc. Though I'm one that leans towards the belief theres a higher success rate with the help of our man made substance.

[deknow]

The only difference I see is Once man processes it, it's then considered man made / artificial / synthetic, etc. Though I'm one that leans towards the belief theres a higher success rate with the help of our man made substance.

...if that's the only difference, why bother with honey?  put sugar syrup or hfcs on your pancakes and in your tea.

deknow

[Robo]

As far as I know there is no accepted standard for "organic" beekeeping, so you can make your own "rules" and call your methods whatever you want.   As far as this particular forum,  I would say any treatment other than the synthetic chemicals is probably fair game for discussion.

[T Beek]

As far as I know there is no accepted standard for "organic" beekeeping, so you can make your own "rules" and call your methods whatever you want.   As far as this particular forum,  I would say any treatment other than the synthetic chemicals is probably fair game for discussion.

Agreed.  Thanks Robo, you are the man.  I'm not aware of any existing "rule" book either   Hey,,,,didn't you start this thread???

thomas

[wd]

The only difference I see is Once man processes it, it's then considered man made / artificial / synthetic, etc. Though I'm one that leans towards the belief theres a higher success rate with the help of our man made substance.

...if that's the only difference, why bother with honey?  put sugar syrup or hfcs on your pancakes and in your tea.

deknow

Obviously, Man doesn't make honey

[Scadsobees]

OK, Let me say that I have made up my mind that sugar is a chemical.  If it is a chemical and I treat my bees with it have I broken the rules of "Natural and Organic Bee Keeping Methods?"  Have I not broken the rules if it is not considered a chemical treatment?

   Sucrose or fructose or glucose sugars?  Did you let the bees know to stay away from those too?

If you have your hives near a highway or golfcourse you are breaking a much bigger organic rule than a sugar one.

The rules are all arbitrary anyway.   Some people follow standards for a reason.  Others just like to do it because it makes them feel special.

[Acebird]

As far as I know there is no accepted standard for "organic" beekeeping,

Well that mean this whole forum is a bust, no such thing as Natural and Organic?

I think I have seen Organically labeled Honey in the store.  Normally you can't label something Organic unless it is certified.

[Robo]

As far as I know there is no accepted standard for "organic" beekeeping,

Well that mean this whole forum is a bust, no such thing as Natural and Organic?

If only there where some truth to your logic.

We don't have an accepted standard for pompous forum members either,  but we sure do get our share 

[rdy-b]

As far as I know there is no accepted standard for "organic" beekeeping,

Well that mean this whole forum is a bust, no such thing as Natural and Organic?

I think I have seen Organically labeled Honey in the store.  Normally you can't label something Organic unless it is certified.

 there is a registration(dont confuse reg with cert) process for the small producer -certification is a costly endeavor
 for the small producer-there are standards that have to be meet and of course compliance-
  if you dig deep enough you will find the appropriate channels for this-reg cost is pro rated to sales
per year-not to excede $5000 in sales --so dont sell over $5000 -dosent mean the oeration cant excede $5000
 just not for organic sales -this gives you the legal right to use the O word-in your operation--RDY-B