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Author Topic: Major cutout update-hellish  (Read 1920 times)
KONASDAD
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« on: April 20, 2008, 10:18:09 AM »

I hope to post some pics later, but I did my first major cutout friday. It was above a third story window(doggy dormer). It was thankfully contyained in the triangle area above window. It was huge. It was also a mess. TRhe hive was above my head and the honey just started cascading down onme. Through my veil, down gloves, into footwear, iot just kept coming. I filled four five gallon pails w/ comb and honey before I even started to see brood,. By then, I was drenched in sweat and honey. By now the bees are stinging through my equipment. I got very litttler brood, did fing three very huge queen cells. I think its possible they had just swarmed  as honey was everywhere and the queen cells. I got stung at least 60 times. I started to get sick, so I left and went home. Enroute I had to stop and throw-up but no respitory distresss. Went home, benadrylled up and showered and to bed for two hrs. I felt better but exhausted. I go back today to finish up.
I have more respect for Understudy and JP than ever. I also have a few questions.
How do you deal w/ raing honey? It was in my veil screen which made it impossible to see?
How do you clean your suit after such an event? I'm glad it was only a cheap outfit, but I want to get a golden bee suit which is expensive .Gloves are drenched too! Honey in my footwear too.

The hive had comb going in very direction. Sideways, left to right, front to back, perpinduclar to evrything else etc. The lobes of comb were attached to the roof, sides, and each other. Some comb was ciurved around straight comb. It was impossible to do any organized cuts and place in frames, the comb was falling onto my head w/ honey and of course bees. Any suggestions? I left my veil outside hoping bees would clean it, but no luck.

What do I do w/ buckets of dead bees, honey, wax and lots construction dust? I must have about 50lbs of this stuff. Can I save the honey? Can I clean it enough? The wax?
I am sure I have more questions, but this was hard work. It also was three very steep stair cases to get my equipment up and down as well. Felt like mountain goat. The steps were so steep I could have placed my chin on an upper step as I walked up and down.
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kathyp
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2008, 10:30:47 AM »

that was a tough one!!  probably one i would have passed on.  you have a brass set!

your clothes will wash up in the washer.  if you have a lot of wax gunk on them, take a hose to them first. 

the honey can be strained through cheese cloth.  use lindas crush and strain method, a large strainer, then poor honey through cheese cloth,  done.  i got about 45 pounds from my last one.
you probably want to pick as many dead bees out when you crush as you can.  wax can be melted through cheese cloth over a double boiler.  takes a while and you my only want to mess with the cleaner wax.  i do it all, but i hate to waste stuff  smiley.

sorry this wasn't a fun one.  the next will be better and you learned off this.


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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2008, 11:45:12 AM »

 shocked Wow, better you than me.
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JP
The Swarm King
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I like doing cut-outs, but I love catching swarms!


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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2008, 01:07:03 PM »

Konas, you know the saying, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger? Well, you're stronger now my man!!!

Without seeing pictures its hard to give any suggestions, but the only thing that really comes to mind is what if you were able to get higher up? More at eye level with the hive, perhaps you could have avoided the honey dripping down on you this way. Not trying to add insult to injury, this is the only suggestion I can think of at this time without pics.

Higher up? With a bucket lift. I rent them all the time. Of course you can't always get a lift in there, so scaffolding would be the next option.

Anyway, now you got some expensive honey there. What's the going rate $15 a lb? grin

Hey, good job!


...JP
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"Good friends are as sweet as honey" Winne the Pooh

My pictures can be viewed at http://picasaweb.google.com/pyxicephalus
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KONASDAD
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2008, 02:14:25 PM »

JP, thats the only thing I can think of is I should have cut an additional hole on the side. I could have done so, but it was lathe and plaster. In hind sight, I should have done it anyways. As MB says, "if you're not making mistakes, you're not learning." I learned a lot. Probably more in one cut out than I could have from twenty easy ones. I hate failure, but I think this one will ultimately win. It looks like a lot of work for no bees and lots of dirty wax and honey. Lots! But I will finish this job, licks my wounds, and be a better beekeeper for it.

I went back today.As an aside I got stung on chin before I even entered the room. I now look like Jay Leno, wife not impressed. Here is what I found. The hive box w/ the queen cells didin't have any bees in it. Tens of thousands of bees were still in the soffit all clumbed like a swarm. I knocked them into the box w/ comb and frames, but by the time I left, they were back in soffit. I left box and put queen lure inside as last resort.

The homeowner says I can come by tomorrow, but I am at a loss as to what to do. there is little to no comb left in soffit, tens of thousdands of bees and probably the queen. Do I just vacuum them up? Spray w/ soapy water and be done?. I will see if I can get a few pics posted. I only took a few begining ones as I was way to sticky to take any after I started. The homeowner did. She is nice and I am sure she will email them to me but she is a busy gal anmd I dont know when she will get time.
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kathyp
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2008, 02:35:07 PM »

can you reach that clump with your bee brush and a dust pan?  if you can get your box close enough, you may get lucky and be able to sweep up that queen with the clump.  she has to be in there.  just sweep and dump until you have as many as you can get.  you'll know pretty quick if you get her in there.  as a last resort, i'd vacuum with a shop vac.  you'll kill lots of bees, but if those queen cells are good, you still have a chance to come out of this with a hive.

nothing to lose.  time to break eggs.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
JP
The Swarm King
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Location: Metairie, Louisiana

I like doing cut-outs, but I love catching swarms!


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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2008, 09:21:02 PM »

I would go in and start grabbing clumps of bees, with a gloved hand of course, gently and carefully, while looking out for the queen, and place them in a box or whatever. She will most likely be in the upper 1/3 of the cluster.

If you have a ton of bees, you can use the vac, but do so carefully, to not vacuum the queen.

A swarm trap with comb and pheremone even, is no match for the real deal, especially a mated queen. Their drive is to be with her, you need to catch her and cage her, and they will follow.

The hard work is done. Think of what you have left, as a swarm of bees with a queen, essentially this is what you have now.

Don't even think of throwing in the towel and spraying them!

Go back, take your time, have fun, take pics, kick some a$$ and take some names.

You CAN do it. Remember, the hard part is over.

Go back and catch you a swarm, get the queen.

So far, you have done a great job, on a very difficult cut-out, you are almost there, good luck Konas!!!


...JP
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"Good friends are as sweet as honey" Winne the Pooh

My pictures can be viewed at http://picasaweb.google.com/pyxicephalus
and
http://picasaweb.google.com/112138792165178452970

My Youtube videos can be viewed here: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=JPthebeeman&aq=f

My website JPthebeeman.com http://www.jpthebeeman.com/jpthebeeman/
KONASDAD
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Location: Cherry Hill, N.J.


« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2008, 10:25:42 PM »

I did sweep them into a pan and move into hive. They were back in soffit twenty minutes later. I grabbed w/ gloved hands and placed in box w/ queen cells . same result. I'll just keep plugging away. Stubborn is my best quality and my worst. Its now a grudge match!
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kathyp
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« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2008, 11:46:19 PM »

how are your stings??   grin
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
Cindi
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« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2008, 09:50:53 AM »

Konasdad, oh wow!!!  What more can I say.  You have the guts of steel.  I am very thankful that you were OK.  60 stings is a lot of stings and the raining honey scares the life out of me.

I don't think that I would ever in my wildest dreams attempt a cutout, I take my hat off to you for this work and attempt.  What an introduction to a first cutout eh?  You take care, I hope all goes well in the second part of the job, you did a great one.  Beautiful and wonderful day, Cindi
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There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service
KONASDAD
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« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2008, 10:15:46 AM »

how are your stings??   grin
Other than the hour or two of feeling lousy, mostly an inconvenience. I obviously maxed out on venom, combined w/ 90F room etc. I am now shopping hard for a pollination jacket as dont like getting stung.
Weather is iffy today so it may have to wait until tomorrow to finish. I plan to knock them into box and leave. Combine w/ another removal that is struggling to get its numbers up. I'll look for queen and call it a day.
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Moonshae
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« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2008, 08:22:28 PM »

I was thinking about offering to do cutouts this year in an attempt to build my hive numbers, but you just convinced me to stick to swarms for a bit!  tongue
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Understudy
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« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2008, 07:45:20 PM »

I hope to post some pics later, but I did my first major cutout friday. It was above a third story window(doggy dormer).
If you going in go in all the way. This is a tough one to start with. Congrads on doing it.
Quote
It was thankfully contyained in the triangle area above window. It was huge. It was also a mess. TRhe hive was above my head and the honey just started cascading down onme. Through my veil, down gloves, into footwear, iot just kept coming. I filled four five gallon pails w/ comb and honey before I even started to see brood,. By then, I was drenched in sweat and honey. By now the bees are stinging through my equipment. I got very litttler brood, did fing three very huge queen cells. I think its possible they had just swarmed  as honey was everywhere and the queen cells.
They did swarm. Save those queen cells and yes you will take a honey bath when you do these.
Quote
I got stung at least 60 times. I started to get sick, so I left and went home. Enroute I had to stop and throw-up but no respitory distresss. Went home, benadrylled up and showered and to bed for two hrs. I felt better but exhausted. I go back today to finish up.
This is the start to building up a tolerance. Think of it as being broken in.
Quote
I have more respect for Understudy and JP than ever.
You may name children after me. Wink
Quote
I also have a few questions.
How do you deal w/ raing honey?
A bucket with water and a hose.
Quote
It was in my veil screen which made it impossible to see?
You are going to stop wearing one after a while
Quote
How do you clean your suit after such an event? I'm glad it was only a cheap outfit, but I want to get a golden bee suit which is expensive .Gloves are drenched too! Honey in my footwear too.
Ditch the gloves. These jobs are messy. Not like the nice office job like CEOs who make millions have. This is strictly blue collar.
Quote
The hive had comb going in very direction. Sideways, left to right, front to back, perpinduclar to evrything else etc. The lobes of comb were attached to the roof, sides, and each other. Some comb was ciurved around straight comb. It was impossible to do any organized cuts and place in frames, the comb was falling onto my head w/ honey and of course bees. Any suggestions? I left my veil outside hoping bees would clean it, but no luck.
You cut small pieces to fit in the frames as best you can. Do not try to put honey frames in the box.
Quote
What do I do w/ buckets of dead bees, honey, wax and lots construction dust? I must have about 50lbs of this stuff. Can I save the honey? Can I clean it enough? The wax?
If the honey has dust in it you can only feed it back to the bees. They will clean it up. The wax can be melted again.
Quote
I am sure I have more questions, but this was hard work. It also was three very steep stair cases to get my equipment up and down as well. Felt like mountain goat. The steps were so steep I could have placed my chin on an upper step as I walked up and down.
Think of this as training for the Iron Man. grin

Sincerely,
Brendhan

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KONASDAD
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Location: Cherry Hill, N.J.


« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2008, 11:09:07 AM »

well, I went by today, as homeowner is dropping a bomb tomorrow afternoon. I will return one more time in the AM to get whatevers left. This AM, there were about 2lbs of bees clustered on the roof line, a few inches from the entrance. I got dust pan, brush and dumbed them into a box and closed up. I got about a pound of bees. I already emptied them into the hive which believe it or not has normal activity. No sign of a queen, but it now has about 4lbs of  bees, comb etc. I can also give it frames of brood if needed, but queen cells still intact and in middle. I wil return tomorrow and get as many bees as I can.
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kathyp
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« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2008, 11:30:41 AM »

they are staying in the hive for the most part?  i bet you got her...or her body.  good job.  baptism by fire for sure.
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.....The greatest changes occur in their country without their cooperation. They are not even aware of precisely what has taken place. They suspect it; they have heard of the event by chance. More than that, they are unconcerned with the fortunes of their village, the safety of their streets, the fate of their church and its vestry. They think that such things have nothing to do with them, that they belong to a powerful stranger called “the government.” They enjoy these goods as tenants, without a sense of ownership, and never give a thought to how they might be improved.....

 Alexis de Tocqueville
KONASDAD
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Location: Cherry Hill, N.J.


« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2008, 11:39:11 AM »

they are staying in the hive for the most part?  i bet you got her...or her body.  good job.  baptism by fire for sure.
No idea if I got queen or her parts. The cutout and hive are now more than 10 miles apart, so the bees are staying w/ frames and queen cells. Yes, this was baptism by fire, school of hard knocks etc. I knew it was going to a more difficult removal, type of construction materials, location, size... etc...so I learned a lot, super lot.

Understudy, I dont know how you could even contemplate a removal w/o veil, gloves yes, veil no. Bees really like my face. I mean really like it. Sometimes I am only person geting stung at meetings and always in face. As for naming children after you, wife said no to "understudy" even for a midddle name. sorry. I might however change my name to Undertstudy's Apprentice from Konasdad in your honor!!!!
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"The more complex the Mind, the Greater the need for the simplicity of Play".
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