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Author Topic: Condensation prevention  (Read 5797 times)
Robo
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« Reply #40 on: October 22, 2007, 06:45:17 AM »

My bees will be out flying at the mid 40s F

But that would be outside temperature, not the temperature in the hive.
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Moonshae
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« Reply #41 on: October 22, 2007, 06:51:02 AM »



Doesn't the light shining inside the hive 24/7 bother the bees?
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Michael Bush
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« Reply #42 on: October 22, 2007, 07:55:58 AM »

>Michael, I find this bit of information you are sharing to be very interesting.  But I am having a really hard time wrapping my head around what you are saying.  I may ask you if you could elaborate a little more on what you say about the internal temperature of the hive.

Wow!  I answered this somewhere, but it's not here...must be on some other thread now confusing people...

I am talking about the temperature outside the cluster in the corners of the hive.

>I may elaborate myself on my queery.  Our temperatures in the wintertime are varied, but I am thinking that our average temperatures (and I will use F) would be around 40-45 F, varies alot, but usually not too much colder than that, because of the rainy climate.  We can have hard freezing for a couple of weeks in January, and that is common, but not usually before or after this time.  Your comment suggests to me that the bees in my particular area would be able to move to their food stores easily for most of the winter here and not starve because they could not reach it.  Did I get this information correct?

They can get stuck when the temps get sub zero F.  At -10 to -20 the cluster is pretty much static.  I might be able to move some if it lucks out and picks the right direction and they have no brood.  But at 30 to 40 F the cluster can act pretty intelligently and find stores pretty well.  Even if they are stuck on brood they can usually send out a "finger" from the cluster and find some stores.
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Jerrymac
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« Reply #43 on: October 22, 2007, 10:20:17 AM »

Wow!  I answered this somewhere, but it's not here...must be on some other thread now confusing people...


Here it is

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php?topic=11718.msg78659#new
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Robo
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« Reply #44 on: October 22, 2007, 11:30:58 AM »



Doesn't the light shining inside the hive 24/7 bother the bees?


I guess not,  they make no attempt to block it with propolis.  In fact, the queen moves right down to lay eggs as close as possible. 

I guess it is no different than an open-air colony that are closer to the polar regions that have    24 hour light in the summer.
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Finsky
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« Reply #45 on: October 22, 2007, 12:02:02 PM »


Electrict heating is quite expencive if it is on whole winter. Just now we got frost. Nights are - 7C - -10+C.

This time hive spend about 1 kg/month sugar. Normal hive doesn not need extra heet here in my climate.

Bees have here cleansing flight in the first half of March.  It means that they stop now flying and are in winterball  5 months.

I install heaters after cleansing flight or  if I start to feed then with pollen patty in the beginning of April. I heat hives about 2 months.

I have ower wintered 2 frame colonies and they do well with 3W heater. That colony has only value of queen and it is vain to try normal hive from that 2 frame colony. 

++++++++++++++++

Here is installation of 5 frame colony and it has heating whole winter.  5 frame colony is critical size to keep colony healty here.
Wall restrict the space of hive and heater is on empty side


 


 
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Kev
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« Reply #46 on: October 22, 2007, 08:09:55 PM »



Thanks for those pics. They answered a lot of questions about shielding, etc. This has been a particularly interesting post.

Would you be willing to share the results of internal hive temps with us? What are you using to monitor those temps? I'm thinking about the lights for February idea to jump start brood production. I have a SBB that I'll have to figure out how to deal with.

One final question on colonies getting stuck without stores. Is it very low daytime highs that are worrisome? So if daytime temps get into the 30s then they can move. But not if they're in the 20s?

Kev
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rdy-b
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« Reply #47 on: October 22, 2007, 10:38:37 PM »

WOW Wink  >if you could elaborate a little more on what you say about the internal temperature of the hive.

Well, it's the temperature inside the hive but outside the cluster.

>I may elaborate myself on my queery.  Our temperatures in the wintertime are varied, but I am thinking that our average temperatures (and I will use F) would be around 40-45 F, varies alot, but usually not too much colder than that, because of the rainy climate.  We can have hard freezing for a couple of weeks in January, and that is common, but not usually before or after this time.  Your comment suggests to me that the bees in my particular area would be able to move to their food stores easily for most of the winter here and not starve because they could not reach it.  Did I get this information correct?

Basically they may not be warm enough to totally rearrange the stores at 40 F but the cluster can easily find the stores and move to them.  At -20 F they can't move at all.  They get stuck, especially if there is brood.  Yours could still get the cluster stuck on brood, but at 40 F the cluster can send out "fingers" to find the stores.

On a sunny day, I have seen mine take a cleansing flight in the 40s.  But they go right back in.  Upper 40s on a sunny calm day I've seen them fly more.  But the books all say that's wrong.
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rdy-b
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« Reply #48 on: October 22, 2007, 10:46:20 PM »

It was in the bee club thread (reply#47 coinsides with #42) i also need that recipe for honey ice cream grin RDY-B
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Finsky
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« Reply #49 on: October 23, 2007, 06:04:24 AM »

Would you be willing to share the results of internal hive temps with us?


Hive - cluster temperatures are well documented in internet. What we can learn about it? Perhaps nothing.
http://bees.freesuperhost.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1134069490

I nursed bees 40 years without knowing hive temperatures.
But after taking into use electrict heating, I found the importance of warm.  Now I may accelerate 3-fold spring build up with heating + pollen patty.
It means that insulation and ventilation + sunny spot whole day are awfully inportant to bees in spring. 

And notice - night temperature is what rules the development of colony, not sun+day's highest temp + tar paper.  Even human use to warm their homes at night - not during day.

Early spring build up makes to me extra yield month June from early start.

But still bigg hives and yiled are very diffrent matters. You may have 5-6 box hive and it is empty if flowers do not give nectar.

To get honey you must have big hives + splended pastures (move).

To get early yield you need much enough old foragers in spring =early start.  All wintered bees will die before  new yield start = early start to get enough new foragers and nurser bees.



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Robo
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« Reply #50 on: October 23, 2007, 07:58:03 AM »

Would you be willing to share the results of internal hive temps with us? What are you using to monitor those temps?

Sure,  I added details of the monitoring and control to the other post
http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php?topic=11721.0
[/quote]
One final question on colonies getting stuck without stores. Is it very low daytime highs that are worrisome? So if daytime temps get into the 30s then they can move. But not if they're in the 20s?
[/quote]

That is why I turn the lights on/off during the whole winter based upon temperature.   When we get a week or so cold spell,  I don't worry about them getting stranded away from stores.   
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