Tools for the cutout.

[Understudy]

This is the list of tools kathyp and I have used for our cutouts.
1. Sawzall corded , the cordless one will not last long enough.
2. Extension cord for the above item.
3. Bee Vac with Shop Vac.
4. Smoker and fuel for it.
5. Serrated knives, my favorite is a small pumpkin carver because it fits into
small spaces.
6. Veil (beesuit if they are mean)
7. Camera, you want pictures
8. Bee brush
9. Screwdriver for prying stucco. Prybar will work also.
10. Big tupperware/rubbermade container.
11. a bucket with water or a hose.
12. Marble / tile cutting blades for sawzall. I recommend you have at least
four. you will burn through them. For stucco walls and soffits.
13. Drill with large masonry bit.
14. Flashlight to look into dark corners.
15. Queen cage just in case. Or empty jar with holes in the lid (clean the jar)
16. Safety googles and breathing mask
17. Paint scraper for removing comb remnants.
18. Tarp, having two is even better.
19. Baby Wipes (you will be a sticky mess)
20. Duct tape
21. Window screening.
22. Plumbing straps and screws or Hive staples.
23. Hammer
24. Staple gun.
25. Sprayer
26. 8 foot ladder
27. Keyhole saw, razor knife, linoleum knife

1. The sawzall will cut into walls, ceiling and soffits. Have the right type of blade. I love cordless sawzalls but cutting stucco drains them quickly. So I recommended corded.
2. Extension cord for sawzall, drills, and shopvacs.
3. Bee Vac to get those bees in the tight corners.
4. Smoker because getting stung sucks. Running out of smoker fuel sucks also.
5. Serrated knives so you can cut the comb out. Small knives fit into tight places better.
6. Veil and beesuit for when the bees don't like you. At the minimum a veil and long sleeve shirt. After you have done it for a while you can do it in your shorts if you want. But go in protected first.
7. Camera, No cut out happens unless you have proof.
8. Bee Brush to brush bees into box or out of the way.
9. Screwdriver, prybar Because when you have cut that opening you actually need to remove the piece.
10. Big container for extra comb.
11. a bucket with water or hose. For clean up of honey on walls and your self. The hose is better because if the bees get way to nasty you can use it to make it rain and calm down the situation.
12. Sawzall tile blades because Stucco is concrete and hard to cut. Even these blades  burn out quickly.
13. Drill (may be cordless) with a large masonary bit or whatever bit is appropriate for the material you are drilling. a hole saw blade can be used on drywall. This gives you the ability to see where the comb is. Also the drill bit should be large enough to allow the sawzall blade in so you can cut the material.
14. Because being in the dark with bees is a bad thing.
15. If you do spot the queen you do want to save her. a queen cage or jar with holes in the lid will work great. Make sure the jar is clean.
16. Googles and mask because going to the hospital because you got concrete in your eye is far more embarrassing than going in with a few hundred stings.
17. a paint scraper removes those small comb remnants. You don't want to leave comb in the wall.
18. Tarp because this is going to be messy.
19. Baby Wipes because your hands are going to stick to everything.
20. Duct tape to seal up small openings in the hive or secure hive parts. It's duct tape  you always need it.
21. Window screening because it keeps the bees in the box. I use this with duck boxes  and cover the entrance. And drive with the bees in the truck.
22. Hive staples , plumbing straps because if you have a cut out that fills three boxes and you stop suddenly you want the hive bodies to not slide off each other.
23. Hammer for those small but needed adjustments.
24. Staple gun for screening and anything else you can think of.
25. Sprayer small one and exterminator types filled with cold sugar water. To catch swarms. Spray the swarm down and put bees in box. Warning bees don't like showers and may express their displeasure.
26. 8 foot ladder because not all of us are basketball stars
27. Something to cut drywall with.

Thanks to kathyp for her contributions. Suggestions welcome.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Angi_H]

Laddar can not forget laddar or other type of device to stand on for those high places. Rented or not.

Angi

[Understudy]

Done Angi. Thank You

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Jerrymac]

I used a side grinder with masonry wheel on stucco. On that church I did the prying and wire cutting and all the popping didn't help the disposition of the bees. I use a circular saw for the majority of wood cutting. I would think the sawzall, going in and out, would equate to hammering, especially if you hit something with the end, and we all know how bees hate banging and popping and knocking. Then a hand saw if the skill saw doesn't quite reach where it needs to go. Sheet rock is simply cut with a knife that looks a lot like this I know, it's call a linoleum knife. But I happen to have it on hand. 

[Understudy]

I added keyhole saw, razor knife, linoleum knife. I understand the side grinder with the masonry wheel but with me it seems that upsets them more than the sawzall with a tile blade. I can also use the sawzall for wood cutting so it is one less thing I have to carry around. However there is nothing wrong with a circular saw.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[kathyp]

the sawzall is so fast, i'd think you'd be done before they'd get to upset.

my big contribution was the baby wipes.    i know for a fact that you can go 17 days without a shower if you have baby wipes 

thanks for posting this.  it is so helpful!

[Understudy]

my big contribution was the baby wipes.    i know for a fact that you can go 17 days without a shower if you have baby wipes 

Please file under way to much information. 

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Robo]

Great list guys.

I have attached the checklist I use if anyone is interested.   If I don't go thru the checklist,  I'm guaranteed to forget something

[Frantz]

Excellent list guys, Thank you so much for the list. I hope to get a few this year. After losing 10 of 12 this winter. I finally found a guy here in SLC that is doing them and advertising. He charges a base of $400 to do them unless its just a swarm capture. I have sent him an email and told him if he ever needs a free hand to just let me know. Nothing yet??
Frantz

[Understudy]

Great list guys.

I have attached the checklist I use if anyone is interested.   If I don't go thru the checklist,  I'm guaranteed to forget something

Thanks for the form. I like that one a lot.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[dpence]

I have a portable generator, for those places with no electricity. 

David

[Understudy]

I have a portable generator, for those places with no electricity. 

David

I think a portable generator is a good idea if you are doing this professionally. For the hobbiest, I would say use either cordless tools or rent a generator. Because I feel that at least in Florida. It is rare that you are in a situation where you need electricity. Also I have a 4000 watt inverter in my van and a battery bank. I use for work and that is also an alternative idea. However I feel these are more along the lines of professional tools.

You circumstances may be different so a generator may be a very practical idea.

If you are doing this professionally a bucket truck would also be a good idea.

If you rent a generator more than 4 times a year. Buy a good generator. I am not sure what is like up north but here in Florida almost everyone has one because of the hurricanes. I assume snow white outs would probably mean most people in the north have one also.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[kathyp]

dust pan.  i used one this time and it worked well.  since i don't have a bee vac yet, i swept the bees into the dust pan and dumped them into the hive. 

[Understudy]

dust pan.  i used one this time and it worked well.  since i don't have a bee vac yet, i swept the bees into the dust pan and dumped them into the hive. 

An excellent idea. They didn't just fly out and attack the sweeper?

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[kathyp]

 i just swept up the clumps and swept down the post that they were on.  they kind of pealed off and dropped in the pan.  they weren't happy, but i didn't get any stings on the first hive.  they all came from the 2nd hive and not while i was sweeping them

[JP]

Along with most of the things ya'll mentioned, one thing you didn't, which comes in real handy at times. a queen catcher.


...JP

[Understudy]

I like the hair clip style one.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[JP]

I like the hair clip style one.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

Is there any other type?


...JP

[dpence]

I have a portable generator, for those places with no electricity. 

David

If you are doing this professionally a bucket truck would also be a good idea.

I assume snow white outs would probably mean most people in the north have one also.

I am sorta a tool fanatic, but yes we do have power outages here, ususally do to electrical storms.  Just a hobbiest, but a bucket truck would be nice to take out this old maple tree in my yard I am going to have to pay to have removed...LOL.  One other tool we found handy is a sheetrock mudding knife thats about 6 inches wide.  Worked well to cut the comb off with.     

[genesbees]

I like to keep a couple of epi pens handy.  Also plenty of rubber bands for strapping comb into frames.  I take a propane torch (one with a push button igniter) for lighting the smoker and heating knives to cut the comb.  I especially like my old carving knife that has about 1" bent over 90 degrees on the tip.  Don't forget plenty of tie down straps, I use the ratchet type.  I carry a 5' folding plastic table (from Sam's) to set near my work area to put stuff on.  Folding chairs are also nice to have when you need a break in the shade.  Being in Texas, I also bring along plenty of water and/or Gatoraid.

[KONASDAD]

In keeping w/ KP's suggestion of a dust pan, i now use a fireplace dust-pan. It has a long handle, is sturdy, but narrrower for tight spaces and deep sides to keep bes in pan. I use a painbrush for bee brush so its not wider than pan.

[NWIN Beekeeper]

I see two items not on anyone's lists that I would add.

Branch Swarm Removals
First off a plain white sheet.
All too many times a little bit of the cluster falls off into the grass and it takes too long to wait for them to walk into the hive.
With a sheet you can pick them up and shake them into the swarm hive.

Cut Outs
a long (approx 24" long and 2-4" wide) knife or blade.
This is handy for cutting combs loose in long voids like wall spaces.
a sturdy piece of sheet metal (air duct) works very well with one edge sharpened.

PS. Bee brushes are over-rated. I have reverted to goose feathers to brush bees from combs. Fewer bees get tangled, release far less alarm pheromones, and thus excite the bees far less. Older methods can be better methods.

[JP]

I see two items not on anyone's lists that I would add.

Branch Swarm Removals
First off a plain white sheet.
All too many times a little bit of the cluster falls off into the grass and it takes too long to wait for them to walk into the hive.
With a sheet you can pick them up and shake them into the swarm hive.

Cut Outs
a long (approx 24" long and 2-4" wide) knife or blade.
This is handy for cutting combs loose in long voids like wall spaces.
a sturdy piece of sheet metal (air duct) works very well with one edge sharpened.

PS. Bee brushes are over-rated. I have reverted to goose feathers to brush bees from combs. Fewer bees get tangled, release far less alarm pheromones, and thus excite the bees far less. Older methods can be better methods.

I have three scrapers in my tool box. Two are the same that long handles can screw into, one handle's about 2' long another about 3 and a 1/2' the other is about 5'.

Sheets do work well, especially under bushes and tall grass.

I don't care for bee brushes, never did, you're right they p.o. the bees,


...JP

[sjbees]

Kinda late for a comment on tools for a removal, but my sawzall only gets used on soffets or when both sides of what is being cut are visible.

Nests can be in wall partitions that have water pipes and electrical romex running through them. In a couple of cases the bees had used the holes the romex ran through to expand their nest into the next partition. Cutting through either kind of copper raises not only the prospect of damage liability, it could involve personal injury as well.

Instead of a sawzall I use:

 - Angle grinder w/diamond blade on stucco
 - Spiral cutter w/ceramic tile bit on sheetrock (the ceramic bits last way longer than the HSS)
 - Circular saw for the major cuts on timber plus the spiral cutter to get tight into a corner.

Ryobi makes all three in the 18V One Plus line, and the new lithium ion batteries do a remarkable job. The batteries are good enough that the electrical tools are back under the workbench.

[Understudy]

Kinda late for a comment on tools for a removal, but my sawzall only gets used on soffets or when both sides of what is being cut are visible.

Nests can be in wall partitions that have water pipes and electrical romex running through them. In a couple of cases the bees had used the holes the romex ran through to expand their nest into the next partition. Cutting through either kind of copper raises not only the prospect of damage liability, it could involve personal injury as well.

Instead of a sawzall I use:

 - Angle grinder w/diamond blade on stucco
 - Spiral cutter w/ceramic tile bit on sheetrock (the ceramic bits last way longer than the HSS)
 - Circular saw for the major cuts on timber plus the spiral cutter to get tight into a corner.

Ryobi makes all three in the 18V One Plus line, and the new lithium ion batteries do a remarkable job. The batteries are good enough that the electrical tools are back under the workbench.

You are correct. What my years in construction have taught me is I cut a small opening and then look in and find what obstacles there may be before cutting a big opening. I still prefer sawzalls in many cases because of the ability for it to get into tight spaces.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[sjbees]

> I cut a small opening and then look in and find what
> obstacles there may be before cutting a big opening.

The pipes and Romex I've encountered have often been completely concealed by drawn comb, and usually didn't find either one until well into the removal.

Nests that are in the partition below a window almost always have Romex running through them.

On 2-story houses I've run into water pipes a few inches below the top of the stud, totally invisible until the cutout was almost finished. Probably done during a retrofit that replaced galvanized with copper.

[Robo]

The worst one I did was located right above the circuit breaker panel.   The romex wasn't invisible,  but boy was it a pain in the butt.

[JP]

This one was a lot of fun. Went in from the outside and removed bees and brood and honey comb til the cows came home and then was greeted with a little 50lbs worth of surplus honey around a suspended light fixture.

Had to move all the lady's furniture to the other side of the room, take down her bed, pull the carpet back, cut the floor out, remove the monstrosity, then put everything back. And then I had to remove the other colony that was 5' over from this one!











I guess the good Lord wanted me to have a challenge on that day!


...JP

[kathyp]

you have gone back to image shack and i can't slideshow your cutouts     

how long did that take you and how many boxes and  buckets did you fill??

[JP]

you have gone back to image shack and i can't slideshow your cutouts     

how long did that take you and how many boxes and  buckets did you fill??

Kathy, My pictures can be viewed at http://picasaweb.google.com/pyxicephalus

That is one job I would just like to forget, I had a lot of trouble making this customer happy. I moved the person up in my schedule to accommodate them and nothing I could do was good enough.

In the end all was well, but let's just say I was under a lot of pressure to do the impossible, to make this person happy, which I really believe no one can.

I know I made at least three trips out to this house. I got two hives out of it.


...JP

[Irwin]

Man thats alot of work and yes there are some people you just can't make happy

[Bee Happy]

That is one job I would just like to forget, I had a lot of trouble making this customer happy. I moved the person up in my schedule to accommodate them and nothing I could do was good enough....
...JP

I've been in this situation before in the electrical field.. extra demanding customers who want  you to drop everything and run to them and then fail to pay you or get obnoxious about paying (trust your gut - if you think they're gonna be a real hassle just don't deal with them) I got burned a couple times but developed an instinct.

my contribution to the cool tools? a luxury I know but... search "fiber optic wall scope" pricey, but you drill a 1/4" hole in the wall and poke the scope in for a look around (same with the drilled holes for pipe, romex, etc.)

[JP]

Gadgets I have, problem is surplus honey. Some hives pack it on. Robo was nice enough to post a link for a borescope I wound up buying, actually I purchased two, the price was so good.

My old one broke but was much longer than I needed it to be. The new ones are perfect!

I like a good challenge, some say I am a glutton for punishment. I seem to like trying to turn yahoos in to good customers. Usually my patience wears them down if they are somewhat reasonable people.

I have walked on occasion, but it is rare that I do so.


...JP

[Robo]

Robo was nice enough to post a link for a borescope I wound up buying, actually I purchased two, the price was so good.

Here is the link for anyone that is interested.  I now have one in my toolbox
http://www.etooldirect.com/diagnostic-tools-meters-27/provision-pv2618-2-5-8mm-7400-pixels-hi-def-borescope-2140.html

[deknow]

We did an easy cutout last week:


Ideally, I would have made up some Lusby style "swarm ketching frames", but i had limited time, and no frame wire in the house...so i used a method i saw jim tew use in a video....quick and easy way to tie combs into frames:




Nails on the top and bottom bars...next time, I'll use rubber bands on both ends of the string (this makes removing the string easier).


This is 5-6 days after doing the cutout.  I was able to remove the strings from 7 of 8 frames.

More photos of the cutout can be found:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/Cutoutdevins
Details of the "Tew frames":
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/TewFrame
More closeup pics from yesterday:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/RoyalWormsAndCutoutProgress

deknow

[kathyp]

very cool.  i'll look at the pics later so if this is answered already, my apologies.

when you remove the bands, do you also take out the nails?  if not, how do you keep them from making a mess if you can't keep the frames tight?

[deknow]

when you remove the bands, do you also take out the nails?  if not, how do you keep them from making a mess if you can't keep the frames tight?

nails are just on the top and bottom bars, and don't extend far enough to interfere with one another.  remember, only the top sections of the side bars touch each other, never the top or bottom bars.

deknow

[kathyp]

got it.  thanks!

[joker1656]

I know this is an older thread, but it sure is helpful.  Great list.  Thanks!

[Jim 134]

 

http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/Cutoutdevins
De

e did an easy cutout last week:


Ideally, I would have made up some Lusby style "swarm ketching frames", but i had limited time, and no frame wire in the house...so i used a method i saw jim tew use in a video....quick and easy way to tie combs into frames:




Nails on the top and bottom bars...next time, I'll use rubber bands on both ends of the string (this makes removing the string easier).


This is 5-6 days after doing the cutout.  I was able to remove the strings from 7 of 8 frames.

More photos of the cutout can be found:
tails of the "Tew frames":
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/TewFrame
More closeup pics from yesterday:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Dean.Ramona/RoyalWormsAndCutoutProgress

deknow

 

 
 
 

Did this in the Peace Corps 1983-1985 in North Africa in Tunisia but use frame wire and nails.


            BEE HAPPY Jim 134